You know it just occured to me that the R is probably now scheduled for the same dates as Divers Cite usually is held ( Last week in July /first weekend of August).
Wonder what they will do?
If they try to hold both - even back to back - that could be a really huge undertaking...
And they would probably end up splitting the audience anyway that close together...
[Thread title modified for clarity. - Outsports moderator]
[ May 26, 2005, 12:09 AM: Message edited by: m1 ]
Full Version: RendezVous Montreal 2006
I think the timing of RendezVous and DiverCite was intentional so that there would be overlap. By splitting the audience, do you mean splitting the field of contestants between the Gay Games in Chicago and RendezVous?
Divers Cite and Rendezvous do overlap in 2006 intentionally. Rendezvous kicks off with a major international gay and lesbian human rights conference Wednesday July 26 - Saturday July 29th. The OutGames kick off on the Saturday July 29th and end on Saturday August 5. Divers Cite week traditionally goes from Monday - Sunday, so I assume it will be running Monday July 31 - Sunday August 6th, definitely overlapping with the OutGames.
I believe the idea behind this plan is that the OutGames people and all the volunteers for that organization can concentrate their efforts mainly on delivering a first rate sport and cultural event, leaving it to others like the gay village business association, the Divers Cite people and their volunteers and others to provide the 'entertainment' package for all of those extra thousands in town. All leading up to what will undoubtedly be an unforgetable, likely massively attended Pride Parade and street party on Sunday August 6th, the day after the OutGames end.
Definitely has the potential to be a fabulous week with everything imaginable, from great athletic performances to Gala choruses to all the fun of Montreal's DiversCite which I just attended and enjoyed immensely. For OutGames participants hopefully a top quality gay and lesbian sporting event with lots of things to see and do when not competing. It seems Berlin in their bid for the 2009 OutGames is following a similar model with their proposal to coincide with Berlin hosting EuroPride at the same time. One group to primarily provide the sport event and another group to provide the activities and fun associated with a Pride Event.
For Montreal this is definitely a big challenge to pull off both events simultaneously, but if any city can do it, Montreal is it. With their whack of government and community support - and with their successful track record as North America's 'City of Festivals' I expect an amazing 10 days.
I believe the idea behind this plan is that the OutGames people and all the volunteers for that organization can concentrate their efforts mainly on delivering a first rate sport and cultural event, leaving it to others like the gay village business association, the Divers Cite people and their volunteers and others to provide the 'entertainment' package for all of those extra thousands in town. All leading up to what will undoubtedly be an unforgetable, likely massively attended Pride Parade and street party on Sunday August 6th, the day after the OutGames end.
Definitely has the potential to be a fabulous week with everything imaginable, from great athletic performances to Gala choruses to all the fun of Montreal's DiversCite which I just attended and enjoyed immensely. For OutGames participants hopefully a top quality gay and lesbian sporting event with lots of things to see and do when not competing. It seems Berlin in their bid for the 2009 OutGames is following a similar model with their proposal to coincide with Berlin hosting EuroPride at the same time. One group to primarily provide the sport event and another group to provide the activities and fun associated with a Pride Event.
For Montreal this is definitely a big challenge to pull off both events simultaneously, but if any city can do it, Montreal is it. With their whack of government and community support - and with their successful track record as North America's 'City of Festivals' I expect an amazing 10 days.
Isn't there some concern that the audience is only so big - and will be split between venues - whereby neither DC or RVZ will get a full crowd?
I follow the logic of having two different sides to the coin - but it seems kind of risky too...
Then you have all the people who will be going to Chicago instead...
I am a big fan of DC - as I have often told anyone who would listen - I think it is one of the best parties in NA. I look forward to seeing what they will do - and how they will coordinate this.
[ August 20, 2004, 04:20 PM: Message edited by: ITJock ]
I follow the logic of having two different sides to the coin - but it seems kind of risky too...
Then you have all the people who will be going to Chicago instead...
I am a big fan of DC - as I have often told anyone who would listen - I think it is one of the best parties in NA. I look forward to seeing what they will do - and how they will coordinate this.
[ August 20, 2004, 04:20 PM: Message edited by: ITJock ]
Taking the advice of Rrowf - I'll put news about the Outgames in this thread and we'll see if the 'Schism' thread will die a slow natural death.
Todays Outgames news is that the details of their very generous Bursary Program is now on their website. Thanks to the overwhelming community support at fundraising events like the Nuit d'Or (which I had the good fortune to attend along with over 800 other people back in September) - and the generousity of sponsors like Glaxo Smith Kline - Outgames have announced bursaries valued at nearly $500,000 Canadian (about $425,000US) for disadvantaged participants in sport and cultural activities, as well as for participants in the International Conference on LGBT Human Rights.
Details can be found here:
http://www.montreal2006.org/en_release_2_d...ember_2005.html
Todays Outgames news is that the details of their very generous Bursary Program is now on their website. Thanks to the overwhelming community support at fundraising events like the Nuit d'Or (which I had the good fortune to attend along with over 800 other people back in September) - and the generousity of sponsors like Glaxo Smith Kline - Outgames have announced bursaries valued at nearly $500,000 Canadian (about $425,000US) for disadvantaged participants in sport and cultural activities, as well as for participants in the International Conference on LGBT Human Rights.
Details can be found here:
http://www.montreal2006.org/en_release_2_d...ember_2005.html
LOL
Okay, Having spent 1 (only) summer in Montreal, my experience of it is that when you are in Montreal, the only experience that matters is the one you are having, in Montreal.
It's hot, it's humid, it's ugly, and it's very much a part of whatever life you are having. The Montrealers, who have spent 7+ months indoors, come out. It's all about the life expereince you can grab. And for those who live there, another hard winter is coming, so they don't waste it.
It's hot, it's humid, it's ugly, and it's very much a part of whatever life you are having. The Montrealers, who have spent 7+ months indoors, come out. It's all about the life expereince you can grab. And for those who live there, another hard winter is coming, so they don't waste it.
Has everybody heard about the 1.1 millions dollars lawsuit filed this week against the Montreal Outgames? Here is a link to the press report (en francais).
So for those who don't speak French so well, here is my translation:
" Major legal suit against Montreal gay games
A legal proceeding seeking more than 1.1 Million dollars was filed on December 14, 2005 against Outgames of Montreal 2006, its administrators, the Ville-Marie newspaper and the newspaper To Be by the Group Pride Inc and its President François-Robert Lemire and carries the case number: 500-17-028670-050 (Superior Court Montreal) for serious, illicit and intentional attacks on the reputation of the plaintiffs.
According to the Court documents, Jean-Yves Duthel, defendant and person responsible for relationships with the media for Montreal 2006, and his associates, issued press releases directly attacking the good faith, the integrity and the sincerity of Pride and went as far as showing the President of the Group to have made illegal gestures with the trademark of Pride.
Contacted by electronic mail by the review Le Point in order to obtain his comments on the matter and the other alarming situations centering around him, Mr. Jean-Yves Duthel answered the editor of Le Point: "In good French; go to hell!!". The Editor of the review Le Point, Roger-Luc Chayer, risen and outraged by the personal and scornful remarks made by the Montreal 2006 spokesman towards the profession of journalism, demanded apologies and recalled to Duthel that the description of tasks of journalist does not include taking insults and vulgarities and that the duty of spokesman is one of respect towards the gay community and its representatives."
WOW!!
So for those who don't speak French so well, here is my translation:
" Major legal suit against Montreal gay games
A legal proceeding seeking more than 1.1 Million dollars was filed on December 14, 2005 against Outgames of Montreal 2006, its administrators, the Ville-Marie newspaper and the newspaper To Be by the Group Pride Inc and its President François-Robert Lemire and carries the case number: 500-17-028670-050 (Superior Court Montreal) for serious, illicit and intentional attacks on the reputation of the plaintiffs.
According to the Court documents, Jean-Yves Duthel, defendant and person responsible for relationships with the media for Montreal 2006, and his associates, issued press releases directly attacking the good faith, the integrity and the sincerity of Pride and went as far as showing the President of the Group to have made illegal gestures with the trademark of Pride.
Contacted by electronic mail by the review Le Point in order to obtain his comments on the matter and the other alarming situations centering around him, Mr. Jean-Yves Duthel answered the editor of Le Point: "In good French; go to hell!!". The Editor of the review Le Point, Roger-Luc Chayer, risen and outraged by the personal and scornful remarks made by the Montreal 2006 spokesman towards the profession of journalism, demanded apologies and recalled to Duthel that the description of tasks of journalist does not include taking insults and vulgarities and that the duty of spokesman is one of respect towards the gay community and its representatives."
WOW!!
I had not heard anything about that. Will be curious to see if we hear an official response from those being sued.
On to more positive news for the Outgames - their latest newsletter is out.
http://www.montreal2006.org/en_newsletter.html
Some highlights.
- A neat link that provides breakdown by city and country from which registrations have been received for each sport. A beach volleyball team from Nepal is one that caught my eye. People from 106 different nations have now registered for the Outgames.
- Some more details about some of the sports such as cycling and roller racing - on the Formula One race track - cool. That venue is right next to the Olympic rowing basin within 5 minutes of the heart of downtown. Some more info on the choral festival as well, with more than 20 choruses from around the world now registered for that event.
- Announcement that GLISA has announced the official creation of the North American gay and lesbian sport federation, modeled after the incredibly successful European federation.
- Additions of Slyvie Bernier - Olympic Gold medalist in diving at the 84 Los Angeles games and Nancy Drolet - six time world hockey champion and Silver medallist at the 1998 Nagano games - to the Outgames Circle of Excellence.
And this amazing report about the human rights conference portion of the Outgames.
*******
A month from now, the Preliminary Programme for the International Conference on LGBT Human Rights will be available. It will contain 200 workshop proposals organised according to the five broad themes of the Conference: Essential Rights, Global Issues, the Diverse LGBT Community, Participation in Society, and Creating Social Change.
We received an amazing 800 responses to the Call for Proposals from 69 different countries. Workshop proposals flooded in from countries including South Africa, Zimbabwe, Kyrgyzstan, Ecuador, Senegal, Moldavia, India, Malaysia and, of course, many European countries, clearly demonstrating that Montréal 2006 and GLISA made the right decision in linking the practice of sport with rights within the context of the Outgames. The international LGBT community is in a state of rapid evolution and development and, while it is important to promote and celebrate LGBT sport and culture, there is much more to our community than our leisure activities. As members of the LGBT community, we do not live compartmentalized lives; our status as a minority group within the greater society plays an integral role in our A month from now, the Preliminary Programme for the International Conference on LGBT Human Rights will be available. It will contain 200 workshop proposals organised according to the five broad themes of the Conference: Essential Rights, Global Issues, the Diverse LGBT Community, Participation in Society, and Creating Social Change.
We received an amazing 800 responses to the Call for Proposals from 69 different countries. Workshop proposals flooded in from countries including South Africa, Zimbabwe, Kyrgyzstan, Ecuador, Senegal, Moldavia, India, Malaysia and, of course, many European countries, clearly demonstrating that Montréal 2006 and GLISA made the right decision in linking the practice of sport with rights within the context of the Outgames. The international LGBT community is in a state of rapid evolution and development and, while it is important to promote and celebrate LGBT sport and culture, there is much more to our community than our leisure activities. As members of the LGBT community, we do not live compartmentalized lives; our status as a minority group within the greater society plays an integral role in our lives.
Outreach
The Montréal Conference, thanks in part to its bursary programme, and also because of the active involvement of organisations such as ILGA-World, South-South Dialogo, HELEM and many others, will succeed in setting an important precedent: that is, of having significant numbers of women and men from developing countries participating in the Conference. The issues surrounding our rights cannot be meaningfully discussed or resolved without their input; unlike the LGBT community in Canada and Western Europe that has the “privilege” of examining questions such as same-sex marriage, many in the international LGBT community struggle daily against the threat of imprisonment, physical violence and even death. We will have the opportunity, thanks to our sisters and brothers in the South, to make an important step forward in the advancement of human rights.
*******
On to more positive news for the Outgames - their latest newsletter is out.
http://www.montreal2006.org/en_newsletter.html
Some highlights.
- A neat link that provides breakdown by city and country from which registrations have been received for each sport. A beach volleyball team from Nepal is one that caught my eye. People from 106 different nations have now registered for the Outgames.
- Some more details about some of the sports such as cycling and roller racing - on the Formula One race track - cool. That venue is right next to the Olympic rowing basin within 5 minutes of the heart of downtown. Some more info on the choral festival as well, with more than 20 choruses from around the world now registered for that event.
- Announcement that GLISA has announced the official creation of the North American gay and lesbian sport federation, modeled after the incredibly successful European federation.
- Additions of Slyvie Bernier - Olympic Gold medalist in diving at the 84 Los Angeles games and Nancy Drolet - six time world hockey champion and Silver medallist at the 1998 Nagano games - to the Outgames Circle of Excellence.
And this amazing report about the human rights conference portion of the Outgames.
*******
A month from now, the Preliminary Programme for the International Conference on LGBT Human Rights will be available. It will contain 200 workshop proposals organised according to the five broad themes of the Conference: Essential Rights, Global Issues, the Diverse LGBT Community, Participation in Society, and Creating Social Change.
We received an amazing 800 responses to the Call for Proposals from 69 different countries. Workshop proposals flooded in from countries including South Africa, Zimbabwe, Kyrgyzstan, Ecuador, Senegal, Moldavia, India, Malaysia and, of course, many European countries, clearly demonstrating that Montréal 2006 and GLISA made the right decision in linking the practice of sport with rights within the context of the Outgames. The international LGBT community is in a state of rapid evolution and development and, while it is important to promote and celebrate LGBT sport and culture, there is much more to our community than our leisure activities. As members of the LGBT community, we do not live compartmentalized lives; our status as a minority group within the greater society plays an integral role in our A month from now, the Preliminary Programme for the International Conference on LGBT Human Rights will be available. It will contain 200 workshop proposals organised according to the five broad themes of the Conference: Essential Rights, Global Issues, the Diverse LGBT Community, Participation in Society, and Creating Social Change.
We received an amazing 800 responses to the Call for Proposals from 69 different countries. Workshop proposals flooded in from countries including South Africa, Zimbabwe, Kyrgyzstan, Ecuador, Senegal, Moldavia, India, Malaysia and, of course, many European countries, clearly demonstrating that Montréal 2006 and GLISA made the right decision in linking the practice of sport with rights within the context of the Outgames. The international LGBT community is in a state of rapid evolution and development and, while it is important to promote and celebrate LGBT sport and culture, there is much more to our community than our leisure activities. As members of the LGBT community, we do not live compartmentalized lives; our status as a minority group within the greater society plays an integral role in our lives.
Outreach
The Montréal Conference, thanks in part to its bursary programme, and also because of the active involvement of organisations such as ILGA-World, South-South Dialogo, HELEM and many others, will succeed in setting an important precedent: that is, of having significant numbers of women and men from developing countries participating in the Conference. The issues surrounding our rights cannot be meaningfully discussed or resolved without their input; unlike the LGBT community in Canada and Western Europe that has the “privilege” of examining questions such as same-sex marriage, many in the international LGBT community struggle daily against the threat of imprisonment, physical violence and even death. We will have the opportunity, thanks to our sisters and brothers in the South, to make an important step forward in the advancement of human rights.
*******
I love it. The minute seriously bad news about OutGames is posted, TravelPat launches into a cheery regurgitation of a press release that has nothing to do with it.
Pat, you really ought to consider coming to the US to work for the Bush administration.
Pat, you really ought to consider coming to the US to work for the Bush administration.
QUOTE
I love it. The minute seriously bad news about OutGames is posted, TravelPat launches into a cheery regurgitation of a press release that has nothing to do with it.
Pat, you really ought to consider coming to the US to work for the Bush administration.
LOL - perfect! Pat, you really ought to consider coming to the US to work for the Bush administration.
Oh, and what a shock that TravelPat 'had not heard anything about that'. Suuuuuure, you hadn't. It has been all the talk in Chicago, must have heard it a half dozen times during the course of the weekend.
Sorry to disappoint you guys, but I had not heard anything about the suit and other than reading Oswald's post here about it, I still have not heard anything about it from any other source.
And Strider I appreciate the Bush administration job offer, but no thanks. I may be good at posting entries and presenting arguments about things that I believe in and support, but I would be an abject failure trying to post arguments in support of Bush.
And not that it really matters at all but since Softballstud is insinuating I must have known before my post about the suit let me give you a rundown of the timing of this for me. I was in the office late Saturday after a busy day in the agency. At around 7:30PM (Eastern time) I received my monthly Outgames Newsletter by email (to my work email address). And just like I always do I cut and paste the link to the newsletter to post on this board and I also cut and paste the Human Rights conference details that I included in my post. It was only then that I logged on here to paste that information on this board when I saw Oswald's post. And so i just quickly added the comment at the beginning about this being news to me, and went on to post the newsletter info. I'd like to take credit for it, but it was no brilliant spin effort on my part to counter the news about the suit, just bad timing.
And Strider I appreciate the Bush administration job offer, but no thanks. I may be good at posting entries and presenting arguments about things that I believe in and support, but I would be an abject failure trying to post arguments in support of Bush.
And not that it really matters at all but since Softballstud is insinuating I must have known before my post about the suit let me give you a rundown of the timing of this for me. I was in the office late Saturday after a busy day in the agency. At around 7:30PM (Eastern time) I received my monthly Outgames Newsletter by email (to my work email address). And just like I always do I cut and paste the link to the newsletter to post on this board and I also cut and paste the Human Rights conference details that I included in my post. It was only then that I logged on here to paste that information on this board when I saw Oswald's post. And so i just quickly added the comment at the beginning about this being news to me, and went on to post the newsletter info. I'd like to take credit for it, but it was no brilliant spin effort on my part to counter the news about the suit, just bad timing.
OK - considering that this was 'all the talk in Chicago' it sure has been practically impossible to try to find much information on this suit. It certainly did not seem to be considered newsworthy enough to get picked up by much - if any of the Montreal media as of the weekend. My contacts at Tourism Montreal had not heard anything about this as of noon today when I told them about it. When they called back saying they still could not find the story anywhere I had to supply them Oswald's link which seemed to be the only place we could find the story. Sure seems bizarre that this story does not seem to appear in media in Montreal - yet it somehow gets picked up and posted here from a french language newswire service by somebody in Vienna of all places. Go figure!
Needless to say because it is now a legal manner people at the Outgames can not talk about any details related to the actual suit - for obvious reasons. What they did say to me when I finally got a hold of somebody there this afternoon was that they are very confident they will be cleared of any wrong doing. Most importantly though - I was told that this suit will in NO WAY impact the delivery of the Outgames at all. For one thing this may drag on in the court for months and there are insurances in place to cover the organization in the unlikely event that it even came to that. So the budget and organization for the delivery of the Outgames are secure. Their lawyers apparently are planning on making some sort of official comment in the next couple of days.
I guess we should get some more details as to what the suit is actually about once the lawyers make their statements. Hopefully the manner can be handled quickly and everyone involved with the Outgames can continue to concentrate on the important stuff - the delivery of their event.
[ December 19, 2005, 05:38 PM: Message edited by: Travelpat ]
Needless to say because it is now a legal manner people at the Outgames can not talk about any details related to the actual suit - for obvious reasons. What they did say to me when I finally got a hold of somebody there this afternoon was that they are very confident they will be cleared of any wrong doing. Most importantly though - I was told that this suit will in NO WAY impact the delivery of the Outgames at all. For one thing this may drag on in the court for months and there are insurances in place to cover the organization in the unlikely event that it even came to that. So the budget and organization for the delivery of the Outgames are secure. Their lawyers apparently are planning on making some sort of official comment in the next couple of days.
I guess we should get some more details as to what the suit is actually about once the lawyers make their statements. Hopefully the manner can be handled quickly and everyone involved with the Outgames can continue to concentrate on the important stuff - the delivery of their event.
[ December 19, 2005, 05:38 PM: Message edited by: Travelpat ]
Well, not a word of it in Vancouver, although I would certainly understand how Chicago might be watching the Montreal Outgames a little more closely than others.
Oh, and gay organisations in a tiff! Oh my! What an unusual occurance!
[ December 19, 2005, 06:20 PM: Message edited by: chuckvanc ]
Oh, and gay organisations in a tiff! Oh my! What an unusual occurance!
[ December 19, 2005, 06:20 PM: Message edited by: chuckvanc ]
Hey Chuck. Hopefullly all the news will be good in the New Year and we can concentrate all our efforts on having great events.
I certainly hope the Outgames and their lawyers will be able to quickly dispatch with this suit, just so there are absolutely no distractions moving forward. Although something I discovered today certainly does add an interesting twist to this tale if nothing else.
It turns out that the organization suing the newspapers and the Outgames, are the same Montreal group that in the spring of 2004 made a big splash with a press release announcing a partnership with the FGG. That was at the time things were at their nastiest between Montreal and the FGG, so having a Montreal group announcing a partnership with the FGG was really played up at the time. As far as I can tell there does not seem to be a formal relationship now - as there does not seem to be any mention of that group anywhere on the FGG website.
But in view of that past relationship - as you may well imagine - more than a few eyebrows are being raised over this. And setting aside completely the merits of the suit, which will be quite capably handled by the lawyers involved and settled by the courts, I must admit that my more cynical instincts do have me wondering. Just how is it that a fairly obscure French language newsire service story - that up until now has been totally passed up on by the media in Montreal and in the rest of Canada for that matter - somehow end up getting posted here from someone over in Europe and the same story somehow was the 'talk of the town' last weekend in Chicago. To this day if it were not for reading Oswald's post here, I would still not have known anything about it!
Oh well - maybe I'm just too cynical after having participated for so long in the sparring on this board. It is certainly not worth worrying about especially at this time of year.
Best Wishes for a Happy Holiday Season Everyone!
Pat
I certainly hope the Outgames and their lawyers will be able to quickly dispatch with this suit, just so there are absolutely no distractions moving forward. Although something I discovered today certainly does add an interesting twist to this tale if nothing else.
It turns out that the organization suing the newspapers and the Outgames, are the same Montreal group that in the spring of 2004 made a big splash with a press release announcing a partnership with the FGG. That was at the time things were at their nastiest between Montreal and the FGG, so having a Montreal group announcing a partnership with the FGG was really played up at the time. As far as I can tell there does not seem to be a formal relationship now - as there does not seem to be any mention of that group anywhere on the FGG website.
But in view of that past relationship - as you may well imagine - more than a few eyebrows are being raised over this. And setting aside completely the merits of the suit, which will be quite capably handled by the lawyers involved and settled by the courts, I must admit that my more cynical instincts do have me wondering. Just how is it that a fairly obscure French language newsire service story - that up until now has been totally passed up on by the media in Montreal and in the rest of Canada for that matter - somehow end up getting posted here from someone over in Europe and the same story somehow was the 'talk of the town' last weekend in Chicago. To this day if it were not for reading Oswald's post here, I would still not have known anything about it!
Oh well - maybe I'm just too cynical after having participated for so long in the sparring on this board. It is certainly not worth worrying about especially at this time of year.
Best Wishes for a Happy Holiday Season Everyone!
Pat
Pat, you really take the cake. Now you're implying that somehow the FGG had something to do with this. Remind anyone of Tricky US Rep. Tom Delay (or Tricky Dick Nixon) claiming his legal problems weren't really his; that they were all politically motivated? And please spare us the bi-weekly "oh, I didn't mean that" mea culpa. If you or your cronies think the FGG had something to do with this then put your money where your mouth is and say so explicitly, not "with eyebrows raised."
As to "talk of the town," well, I'm not sure about that - but I know that I received the same article - in French and translated for me - five different times in 2 days, twice from Europeans, once from someone in Montreal and twice from Americans. I fowarded to others on our Board and got back exactly one "hmph" (which may have been emailed with a raised eyebrow, but no such emoticon was included.)
You should stick to just cutting-and-pasting newsletters instead of this political intrigue.
Kevin
As to "talk of the town," well, I'm not sure about that - but I know that I received the same article - in French and translated for me - five different times in 2 days, twice from Europeans, once from someone in Montreal and twice from Americans. I fowarded to others on our Board and got back exactly one "hmph" (which may have been emailed with a raised eyebrow, but no such emoticon was included.)
You should stick to just cutting-and-pasting newsletters instead of this political intrigue.
Kevin
Hey Kevin:
Like I said - after all the sparring on this board I tend to be a bit cynical about things. So I question people's motivations for spreading the news of this suit which Montreal's media apparently did not deem to be newsworthy. And don't you think their media would be all over it considering the taxpayer monies involved if they did?
Let's face it if somebody's real hope is to see the growth of GLBT sport worldwide I would think that they would do everything they can to help make both events next year as successful as possible, as difficult as that may be with the events falling within two weeks of each other, and also keeping in mind the obvious animosity between some of the principles for each event. So for months now all I've tried to do is hype the event that I am directly involved with - the Outgames. Yet every positive post about the event - be it registration numbers, great fundraising events, GLISA's growth, and Copenhagen being announced for 2009 - have almost always been met with shameful reactions from some people. Those reactions have included everything from accusing people of bribing Copenhagen politicians to being called outright liars and worse.
Yet throughout the last few months while any of my posts were getting laughable reactions, was I, or anybody else for that matter, on this board guilty of such treatment of all announcements coming from your event. I'm not going to go back and read all the posts, perhaps there were a few negative reactions, but not the consistent pattern going the other way. When Chiathlete would post news of a new sponsor, the reaction from people like me or Chuck would always be 'Great News'. When Cologne got picked for 2010, the reactions were all congratulatory.
Even off this board, here in Toronto I have lost count of the number of times over the last many months that people have asked me if they should go to Chicago and do I think it will be a good event. Every single time I would say - Yes - I'm sure it will be a fantastic event. I often would of course add a sales pitch for Montreal, but I would never hype Montreal by tearing down Chicago, which clearly has been the pattern of some people whose posts here have been pro-FGG or pro-Chicago.
So yes - when I see people seemingly making an overt effort to spread news of this suit as far and wide as possible, and others making comments that indicate they seem to like the fact that there is such a suit and are laughing about it, then yes I tend to wonder what motivates people to do that.
And no I do not believe it is the FGG as an organization or you personally or people who are busy organizing your event at Chicago 2006 who are orchestrating a co-ordinated campaign to do stuff like this. But I do wonder at the motivation of the individuals who do seem intent on doing just that and wonder who they are.
We would all be better off if instead if we would all just do whatever we can in a positive fashion to help the event they have chosen to support succeed, rather than wasting so much energy and effort trying to tear down.
FYI - Just yesterday I referred a group from Toronto yesterday to your website. I think they are a volleyball team although these guys also all play badminton. They were asking me what the accommodation costs will be for the Gay Games. I referred them to the accommodation link on your web page and told them that there were some really great rates. I'm not sure if they will end up going, but when they asked if I thought it would be a fun - I told them that if they go that I'm sure they'll have an absolute blast.
Pat
[ December 22, 2005, 10:25 AM: Message edited by: Travelpat ]
Like I said - after all the sparring on this board I tend to be a bit cynical about things. So I question people's motivations for spreading the news of this suit which Montreal's media apparently did not deem to be newsworthy. And don't you think their media would be all over it considering the taxpayer monies involved if they did?
Let's face it if somebody's real hope is to see the growth of GLBT sport worldwide I would think that they would do everything they can to help make both events next year as successful as possible, as difficult as that may be with the events falling within two weeks of each other, and also keeping in mind the obvious animosity between some of the principles for each event. So for months now all I've tried to do is hype the event that I am directly involved with - the Outgames. Yet every positive post about the event - be it registration numbers, great fundraising events, GLISA's growth, and Copenhagen being announced for 2009 - have almost always been met with shameful reactions from some people. Those reactions have included everything from accusing people of bribing Copenhagen politicians to being called outright liars and worse.
Yet throughout the last few months while any of my posts were getting laughable reactions, was I, or anybody else for that matter, on this board guilty of such treatment of all announcements coming from your event. I'm not going to go back and read all the posts, perhaps there were a few negative reactions, but not the consistent pattern going the other way. When Chiathlete would post news of a new sponsor, the reaction from people like me or Chuck would always be 'Great News'. When Cologne got picked for 2010, the reactions were all congratulatory.
Even off this board, here in Toronto I have lost count of the number of times over the last many months that people have asked me if they should go to Chicago and do I think it will be a good event. Every single time I would say - Yes - I'm sure it will be a fantastic event. I often would of course add a sales pitch for Montreal, but I would never hype Montreal by tearing down Chicago, which clearly has been the pattern of some people whose posts here have been pro-FGG or pro-Chicago.
So yes - when I see people seemingly making an overt effort to spread news of this suit as far and wide as possible, and others making comments that indicate they seem to like the fact that there is such a suit and are laughing about it, then yes I tend to wonder what motivates people to do that.
And no I do not believe it is the FGG as an organization or you personally or people who are busy organizing your event at Chicago 2006 who are orchestrating a co-ordinated campaign to do stuff like this. But I do wonder at the motivation of the individuals who do seem intent on doing just that and wonder who they are.
We would all be better off if instead if we would all just do whatever we can in a positive fashion to help the event they have chosen to support succeed, rather than wasting so much energy and effort trying to tear down.
FYI - Just yesterday I referred a group from Toronto yesterday to your website. I think they are a volleyball team although these guys also all play badminton. They were asking me what the accommodation costs will be for the Gay Games. I referred them to the accommodation link on your web page and told them that there were some really great rates. I'm not sure if they will end up going, but when they asked if I thought it would be a fun - I told them that if they go that I'm sure they'll have an absolute blast.
Pat
[ December 22, 2005, 10:25 AM: Message edited by: Travelpat ]
Travel Pat is right, you know. His cut and paste press releases and/or other comments have been met with a constant barrage sarcasm and sniping. The reverse hasn't happened.
I know for me, that I have self-censored to not inflame passions. I was really interested that 125 Team Vancouverites took advantage of Montreal's Team discount, one of 4 cities to do so. One of the others were a LARGE (no, can't remember numbers and it's all gossip anyhow.) contingient from San Francisco. Remember that nastiness and lawsuit talk over the words "Team from San Francisco" or Equipe San Francisco? and the accusations that it was all the fault of one rabble-rouser? So, I was intrigued that a sizable number of SF people registered under the Team discount. What was up with that?
But I self-censored. Better to not discuss it, I thought. Avoid nastiness, I thiough. But why? It's not like some people going to Montreal in any way takes away from the undoubtably huge number of San Franciscans going to Chicago.
The difference is that my (probably incorrect -- self censorship is probably not a good thing) reaction was to minimise potential for nastiness, yet the anti-Montreal posters on this board seem to have the reaction of poking and sniping as the norm. Sorry fellows, but Pat is right on this one.
I know for me, that I have self-censored to not inflame passions. I was really interested that 125 Team Vancouverites took advantage of Montreal's Team discount, one of 4 cities to do so. One of the others were a LARGE (no, can't remember numbers and it's all gossip anyhow.) contingient from San Francisco. Remember that nastiness and lawsuit talk over the words "Team from San Francisco" or Equipe San Francisco? and the accusations that it was all the fault of one rabble-rouser? So, I was intrigued that a sizable number of SF people registered under the Team discount. What was up with that?
But I self-censored. Better to not discuss it, I thought. Avoid nastiness, I thiough. But why? It's not like some people going to Montreal in any way takes away from the undoubtably huge number of San Franciscans going to Chicago.
The difference is that my (probably incorrect -- self censorship is probably not a good thing) reaction was to minimise potential for nastiness, yet the anti-Montreal posters on this board seem to have the reaction of poking and sniping as the norm. Sorry fellows, but Pat is right on this one.
Pat - I think, to a certain extent, you reap what you sow. Announcements by Chicago are typically announcements. Announcements by your colleagues are often "comparative" and aggressively so. Given the stated early objective to "destroy the Gay Games," the anti-Americanism in communication, and - even to this day - comments about how M2006 efforts will "eclipse" the Gay Games, it should not surprise you that your happy-day posts would result in the kind of posts you don't like. Your stated objective of two successful events is NOT shared by your colleagues and as their mouthpiece on this chat board, people clearly are reacting not to your text but to the actions and statements of others.
You do not see the same comments coming from the Chicago organization and you won't for a variety of reasons that - in my opinion - illustrate the core organizational philosophy, structure and values of the Gay Games. The posts you see on this chat board aren't a conspiracy - they're the natural reaction of a group that supports a beloved institution that has come under attack.
Cynicism does not justify conjecture. It merely rationalizes it.
[ December 22, 2005, 02:17 PM: Message edited by: KevinB ]
You do not see the same comments coming from the Chicago organization and you won't for a variety of reasons that - in my opinion - illustrate the core organizational philosophy, structure and values of the Gay Games. The posts you see on this chat board aren't a conspiracy - they're the natural reaction of a group that supports a beloved institution that has come under attack.
Cynicism does not justify conjecture. It merely rationalizes it.
[ December 22, 2005, 02:17 PM: Message edited by: KevinB ]
I post the link and translation because I think it's very relevant that a lawsuit asking 1.1 million dollars of damages is filed against the Outgames organisers. Maybe others disagree with me, but I think that's important for everybody to know.
This is not my accusation. I provide a link to media report, and it gives precise case number in the court. And if I understand correctly, OutGames and Tourisme Montreal agrees this lawsuit has been filed, they just don't want to talk about it.
I'm not completely sure what Travelpat is suggesting in his comments, my English is not perfect and I apologise for that, but I am not trying to insult anyone or even give my opinions.
I just think this is relevant news that people who read this Board might want to know about if they don't already. Nobody seems to disagree this lawsuit against the Outgames is a fact, but they are not happy for everybody to know about it, and so accusations are made. Well I disagree. If the Outsports board is not supposed to allow people to share interesting news they come across, then I have really misunderstood the purpose of this web site and I apologise for that too.
Frohe Weihnachten!
This is not my accusation. I provide a link to media report, and it gives precise case number in the court. And if I understand correctly, OutGames and Tourisme Montreal agrees this lawsuit has been filed, they just don't want to talk about it.
I'm not completely sure what Travelpat is suggesting in his comments, my English is not perfect and I apologise for that, but I am not trying to insult anyone or even give my opinions.
I just think this is relevant news that people who read this Board might want to know about if they don't already. Nobody seems to disagree this lawsuit against the Outgames is a fact, but they are not happy for everybody to know about it, and so accusations are made. Well I disagree. If the Outsports board is not supposed to allow people to share interesting news they come across, then I have really misunderstood the purpose of this web site and I apologise for that too.
Frohe Weihnachten!
Well Kevin - what more can I say - other than that I respectfully disagree with that overall assessment.
My own experiences over the last two years with the people involved with GLISA and the Outgames have been nothing but positive. I'll grant you - that on occassion - particularly earlier when wounds were fresh in 2004, that some of the comments were overly emotional and were undoubtedly un-necessarily aggressive towards the Gay Games. And I would tell them so. But there were just as many comments coming the other way at the time and some even as of late, as Chuck and I have pointed out, both on this board and elsewhere. And like Chuck I have had to self edit myself dozens - and I do mean dozens of times, instead of doing a rant on this board when some of the outrageous lies being spread about Montreal would be passed along to me - and the sheer volume and diversity and creativity of those lies have been stunning. So I think any fair assessment would say that the unfortunate ugly stuff has truly been a two way street!
I'm all for somebody defending the Gay Games - heck I've found myself doing that recently, and indeed I fully support anybody working to build the Gay Games. But I will ONLY support that effort if it is being done by building. I will not support those who think they are building the Gay Games by tearing down GLISA and the Outgames. If they are doing that they do not deserve my support, nor anybody else's support for that matter. And I have told the exact same thing to those involved with the Outgames.
My experiences over the last couple of years meeting the great staff at the Outgames, or those from around the world who attended the GLISA conference or the fantastic group from Copenhagen who will carry the Outgames torch in 2009, all have been wonderful. All my interactions with them have been with such a POSITIVE vibe, with the clear motivation being to build something great, a new event and a great new organization to grow GLBT sport. Never have the conversations or discussion been defensive or about anything negative. Over and over again the comments by those at the GLISA conference were about how positive everybody was.
I honestly do wish you and everybody involved with the Gay Games in 2006 my best wishes for a wonderful event to leave a great legacy for Cologne in 2010. And those same best wishes go to anybody else who contributes to the growth of GLBT sport. But for those who seem to think they are helping build GLBT sport by trying to destroy what others are doing to build it, then may Santa leave you a lump of coal in your stocking, because quite frankly, that is what you deserve.
Pat
[ January 05, 2006, 04:53 PM: Message edited by: Travelpat ]
My own experiences over the last two years with the people involved with GLISA and the Outgames have been nothing but positive. I'll grant you - that on occassion - particularly earlier when wounds were fresh in 2004, that some of the comments were overly emotional and were undoubtedly un-necessarily aggressive towards the Gay Games. And I would tell them so. But there were just as many comments coming the other way at the time and some even as of late, as Chuck and I have pointed out, both on this board and elsewhere. And like Chuck I have had to self edit myself dozens - and I do mean dozens of times, instead of doing a rant on this board when some of the outrageous lies being spread about Montreal would be passed along to me - and the sheer volume and diversity and creativity of those lies have been stunning. So I think any fair assessment would say that the unfortunate ugly stuff has truly been a two way street!
I'm all for somebody defending the Gay Games - heck I've found myself doing that recently, and indeed I fully support anybody working to build the Gay Games. But I will ONLY support that effort if it is being done by building. I will not support those who think they are building the Gay Games by tearing down GLISA and the Outgames. If they are doing that they do not deserve my support, nor anybody else's support for that matter. And I have told the exact same thing to those involved with the Outgames.
My experiences over the last couple of years meeting the great staff at the Outgames, or those from around the world who attended the GLISA conference or the fantastic group from Copenhagen who will carry the Outgames torch in 2009, all have been wonderful. All my interactions with them have been with such a POSITIVE vibe, with the clear motivation being to build something great, a new event and a great new organization to grow GLBT sport. Never have the conversations or discussion been defensive or about anything negative. Over and over again the comments by those at the GLISA conference were about how positive everybody was.
I honestly do wish you and everybody involved with the Gay Games in 2006 my best wishes for a wonderful event to leave a great legacy for Cologne in 2010. And those same best wishes go to anybody else who contributes to the growth of GLBT sport. But for those who seem to think they are helping build GLBT sport by trying to destroy what others are doing to build it, then may Santa leave you a lump of coal in your stocking, because quite frankly, that is what you deserve.
Pat
[ January 05, 2006, 04:53 PM: Message edited by: Travelpat ]
Hi everyone, I just discovered that your topic was involving our decision to go public with the legal action taken against Montreal 2006 for serious reasons that are well established in the documents that can be consulted at the Montreal court house.
Our decision is not political, we are a gay media from Montreal, we believe that such a situation is important to be known and the implications of such a news are international.
We published the press release on the Canada News Network to advertise our publication and its content, all details following this legal action will be published, there are no secrets and our legal system is made to be public.
As for the other medias, many television stations, magazines and web sites, in the world, have covered this situation and you may even download a report made at Christmas day on tv about this legal action on this link http://le-national.com/pride-tqs24122005.html
Thank you
Our decision is not political, we are a gay media from Montreal, we believe that such a situation is important to be known and the implications of such a news are international.
We published the press release on the Canada News Network to advertise our publication and its content, all details following this legal action will be published, there are no secrets and our legal system is made to be public.
As for the other medias, many television stations, magazines and web sites, in the world, have covered this situation and you may even download a report made at Christmas day on tv about this legal action on this link http://le-national.com/pride-tqs24122005.html
Thank you
Is there an English version of your report? [My French has deteriorated seriously!]
[ January 03, 2006, 08:56 PM: Message edited by: LACharlie ]
[ January 03, 2006, 08:56 PM: Message edited by: LACharlie ]
Who controls the Outgames:
canada news network
excerpt: Ravers will shake it at 514 Productions' annual all-night Celebration event at the Bell Centre (1260 De la Gauchetière). This time Celebration is being co-presented by Bad Boy Club Montreal, whose annual Bal des Boys gay circuit party is taking a rest this year as BBCM organizers prepare for this summer's OutGames events. Tix will set you back $100.
canada news network
excerpt: Ravers will shake it at 514 Productions' annual all-night Celebration event at the Bell Centre (1260 De la Gauchetière). This time Celebration is being co-presented by Bad Boy Club Montreal, whose annual Bal des Boys gay circuit party is taking a rest this year as BBCM organizers prepare for this summer's OutGames events. Tix will set you back $100.
LACharlie Do you mean an english version of the TV report?
No english version sorry.
About the Bad Boys Club Montreal, associated with the Outgames, they were very famous in the '90 following many iinvestigations related to their use of the funds collected for AIDS, they since refused to give any informations to the press on their use of the money. Many are still preoccupied.
No english version sorry.
About the Bad Boys Club Montreal, associated with the Outgames, they were very famous in the '90 following many iinvestigations related to their use of the funds collected for AIDS, they since refused to give any informations to the press on their use of the money. Many are still preoccupied.
Edito,
Very interesting that you would mention that relationship with Bad Boys and some questions as to usage of funds that are not answered.
Atr you aware that the Male Chair of the Montreal bid group was Robert Vezina - the leader of the Bad Boys group?
Questions questions with not an answer to be found!
Ken
PS Did you notice that the article in French mentioned that one of the leaders of Montreal 2006 has a criminal record which includes some nasty stuff. It must be true if it is in the newspaper and a legal suit.
Travel pat - could you clarify that part of the article for us? Please don't tell me that it is not news because the press didn't report it.
For many people that are thinking of following through with their on-line registrations and actually sending money to Montreal, they would find it really important. At this point I am repeating what is on the internet news.
Very interesting that you would mention that relationship with Bad Boys and some questions as to usage of funds that are not answered.
Atr you aware that the Male Chair of the Montreal bid group was Robert Vezina - the leader of the Bad Boys group?
Questions questions with not an answer to be found!
Ken
PS Did you notice that the article in French mentioned that one of the leaders of Montreal 2006 has a criminal record which includes some nasty stuff. It must be true if it is in the newspaper and a legal suit.
Travel pat - could you clarify that part of the article for us? Please don't tell me that it is not news because the press didn't report it.
For many people that are thinking of following through with their on-line registrations and actually sending money to Montreal, they would find it really important. At this point I am repeating what is on the internet news.
As Imus says, you can't make this stuff up!! It gets better and better every day.
The Greedhead Junta has the same attitude toward the gay sports community as did Jack Abramoff [in the current US political scandal], who ridiculed the Indian tribes he ripped off. The circuit party moguls come out of a criminal culture [I lived next door to one in WeHo for several years] in which gay people are contemptible dupes and victims. They have falsely portrayed themselves as leaders and a bastion of the "Gay Community" - the visible gay ghetto. Their main financial support comes from gay dance extravaganzas fueled by crystal meth, purported Ecstasy, and other stimulants mixed with narcotics [ibogaine with ether? lol!!] My experience is that they rip off everyone with whom they come in contact, from the lowliest vendor to the FGG. They live a lushly riotous lifestyle in posh neighborhoods and imagine themselves as Gods-On-Earth.
I can live with all that, and I am not personally envious in the slightest [Hollywood is full of excess!!]. What I cannot tolerate is their incursion into a truly wonderful institution - the Gay Games. The circuit party moguls and their ilk bankrupted every Games since Vancouver, although the total contribution to the host city is estimated by them to be over $200 million - not counting the illicit money!! How come the Games go bankrupt and others make tens, perhaps hundreds, of millions of dollars?
If the GJ functioned as a gay Maecenas and gave appropriately large sums to gay sports, I would still have reservations, as I do of beer sponsors, etc., but I understand refusing this money might make difficulties. Frankly, as a veteran of teamsports, my preference is to be self-supporting and independent. We are a fairly affluent group of people [certainly the men], after all. My teams always helped low income players participate. But we never have to agonize about the GJ - they never have been contributors, just leeches!!
The Greedhead Junta has the same attitude toward the gay sports community as did Jack Abramoff [in the current US political scandal], who ridiculed the Indian tribes he ripped off. The circuit party moguls come out of a criminal culture [I lived next door to one in WeHo for several years] in which gay people are contemptible dupes and victims. They have falsely portrayed themselves as leaders and a bastion of the "Gay Community" - the visible gay ghetto. Their main financial support comes from gay dance extravaganzas fueled by crystal meth, purported Ecstasy, and other stimulants mixed with narcotics [ibogaine with ether? lol!!] My experience is that they rip off everyone with whom they come in contact, from the lowliest vendor to the FGG. They live a lushly riotous lifestyle in posh neighborhoods and imagine themselves as Gods-On-Earth.
I can live with all that, and I am not personally envious in the slightest [Hollywood is full of excess!!]. What I cannot tolerate is their incursion into a truly wonderful institution - the Gay Games. The circuit party moguls and their ilk bankrupted every Games since Vancouver, although the total contribution to the host city is estimated by them to be over $200 million - not counting the illicit money!! How come the Games go bankrupt and others make tens, perhaps hundreds, of millions of dollars?
If the GJ functioned as a gay Maecenas and gave appropriately large sums to gay sports, I would still have reservations, as I do of beer sponsors, etc., but I understand refusing this money might make difficulties. Frankly, as a veteran of teamsports, my preference is to be self-supporting and independent. We are a fairly affluent group of people [certainly the men], after all. My teams always helped low income players participate. But we never have to agonize about the GJ - they never have been contributors, just leeches!!
QUOTE
kenmac
It must be true if it is in the newspaper and a legal suit.
For many people that are thinking of following through with their on-line registrations and actually sending money to Montreal, they would find it really important. At this point I am repeating what is on the internet news. [/QB]
Ah yes. Anything that is in the newspaper must be true. Oh, I could tell stories... It must be true if it is in the newspaper and a legal suit.
For many people that are thinking of following through with their on-line registrations and actually sending money to Montreal, they would find it really important. At this point I am repeating what is on the internet news. [/QB]
Oh, and about that internet....And as far as sending money to any place: I feel that I am very privileged: I have now sent my registration money to both Chicago and Montreal. I am truly blessed in that I have enough money that if one or both of these events went under, the money would be nothing. Truly, how many people fortunate enough to vacation around the world would miss the $125-175 that it costs to register??? I mean....really? This is a first world, well-off person's indulgence. (And more power to the scholarships! I personally will treasure the one meeting I had with a netball team from some island off Australia---It really was a huge accomplishment for them to compete!!!!!!!!!!!! And an honour for me to meet them.) But for most of us, travelling to Gay sports events is a personal enrichment, and a cultural lesson, but anybody who can afford to register can afford to lose the money, not that I have ANY WORRIES about that. Whatever. Throw your nickel, take your chance.
And as for you, LA Charlie, tell me, in your personal vendetta to stop the "Greedhead Junta," are you so committed to International Gay Sport that you are going to Chicago? If not, maybe you might direct your passions locally, or at least stop annoying the rest of us or at least embarassing everybody who feels readers might paint all Gay Sports movement people with the same lame-ass brush...
I registered for Chicago long ago, although why this should affect the truth value of what I say is beyond me. I have two gold and two silver medals for soccer and flag football, plus I played softball once, if you want to accept that as bona fides.
My vendetta is not based on personal interest, but rather on my analytic diagnosis of the situation. I understand conflict - I taught it at the university level for 30 years.
Show me where the facts and the events of the last couple of years prove me wrong - otherwise you are going to catch hell from me every time you poke your head above the ramparts. I don't think you can stand the truth, and you are evidently incapable of rational argument.
My vendetta is not based on personal interest, but rather on my analytic diagnosis of the situation. I understand conflict - I taught it at the university level for 30 years.
Show me where the facts and the events of the last couple of years prove me wrong - otherwise you are going to catch hell from me every time you poke your head above the ramparts. I don't think you can stand the truth, and you are evidently incapable of rational argument.
Chuck,
It is exactly this statement of yours that makes me cringe every time I hear it from you or anyone else:
"anybody who can afford to register can afford to lose the money"
The whole point of the Gay Games is not to throw a party that will have no effect on the world and would barely be missed. You are correct in regards to your situation but sorely missing the point of that team from the island off of Australia as well as many more folks that use the energy they get at a Gay Games to go home and find ways to continue to function in way less than optimal situations.
Your statement is so cavalier in regards to the situations of others that do not ride in the same boat as you.
I must repeat that the Gay Games is NOT a party and the goals are not consistent with parties. That is where the GLISA model and the FGG model are completely divergent. The divergence is important to the sustainability of the event itself.
I believe that the folks in Montreal have already found out that they cannot promote their event as a party or it loses the flavor that is so important. That doesn't mean that it isn't a party though.
I suspect that you (Chuck) will leave a note to state that you really meant that you are the only person you were referring to when you made that statement. Or, at least, I hope so.
TravelPat - any news on the inside workings of the lawsuit and the high ranking M2006 official with a troubled past? I can get the court case # for you if you need it but I know your friends in Montreal already have it and are very familiar with the situation. Considering how quickly they gave you info in the past, I am surprized that you are quiet for so long?
Ken
It is exactly this statement of yours that makes me cringe every time I hear it from you or anyone else:
"anybody who can afford to register can afford to lose the money"
The whole point of the Gay Games is not to throw a party that will have no effect on the world and would barely be missed. You are correct in regards to your situation but sorely missing the point of that team from the island off of Australia as well as many more folks that use the energy they get at a Gay Games to go home and find ways to continue to function in way less than optimal situations.
Your statement is so cavalier in regards to the situations of others that do not ride in the same boat as you.
I must repeat that the Gay Games is NOT a party and the goals are not consistent with parties. That is where the GLISA model and the FGG model are completely divergent. The divergence is important to the sustainability of the event itself.
I believe that the folks in Montreal have already found out that they cannot promote their event as a party or it loses the flavor that is so important. That doesn't mean that it isn't a party though.
I suspect that you (Chuck) will leave a note to state that you really meant that you are the only person you were referring to when you made that statement. Or, at least, I hope so.
TravelPat - any news on the inside workings of the lawsuit and the high ranking M2006 official with a troubled past? I can get the court case # for you if you need it but I know your friends in Montreal already have it and are very familiar with the situation. Considering how quickly they gave you info in the past, I am surprized that you are quiet for so long?
Ken
QUOTE
I believe that the folks in Montreal have already found out that they cannot promote their event as a party or it loses the flavor that is so important. That doesn't mean that it isn't a party though.
Actually, I think OutGames is promoting their event as a party, perhaps realizing they are not in the same league as the Gay Games as far as the sports competitions are concerned. In a recent issue of a popular LGBT magazine, it was striking that the full page ad for Chicago Gay Games featured athletes and the sports competitions, while the ad in the same issue of the magazine for OutGames proclaimed Montreal as the city known for "apres sports." Which the rest of the ad made pretty clear is a code word for parties.
There's nothing wrong with parties -- I love to go to parties -- but an event consisting of a week of circuit parties seems quite far removed from the Gay Games vision as it has developed over the last 24 years.
So the choice seems pretty clear to me: the Circuit Boys and druggies will probably find Montreal more to their liking, while the athletes, their friends, families, and supporters will be more comfortable in Chicago.
Hulaboy: I personally hate curcuit parties (Yawn) but to paraphrase Samuel Johnson's comment about London "When a man is tired of Montreal, he's tired of life." There's lots to do and see.
Ken: No, I pretty much stand by my money comments, (and that is not to say someone can't have a great time and further a social agenda at the same time.)
Here are some of my thoughts: the 340 Vancouverites who registered in Sydney could have all stayed home and donated say $3000 each to fund any number of VERY worthy causes with the $100,000. But we didn't, just like people everyday go on vacation instead of sending the money to Doctors Without Borders. The difference is that we all went to be part of something that had 2 goals: 1.) be part of a fabulous experience that enriched and strengthened our sense of community and 2.) be ambassadors to the outside world and have them get to know us and respect us and become our friends.
I'm not saying the latter isn't a worthy goal. It is. In fact it was a definite point that factored in my decision to go to Chicago. I believe the United States NEEDS a successful gay event. I believe that the U.S. in particular has a respect for splashy, competitive, money-generating events--just look at any Olympic Ceremonies or even half-time football shows. Sports spectacle catches the spirit of American consciousness, which I believe is why they do them SO WELL. Culturally, sport is a great way to promote understanding in America.
That being said, Gay Games (and Gay Sports events) are (largely) driven by "first world" (please excuse the expression--I don't like it, but can't find an alternative) travellers and money. Yes, one of the VERY important benefits is that people like the Netball players I mentioned took back something tremendous to their homes.
BUT any Canadian that has the luxury to drop $2-4000 to go around the world can afford to drop $150 if an event was cancelled. (The disasterous fallout for gay events is a whole other story.)
$150 is 5 Saturday night's beer. (I really have to go into training now...) If I think an event is worth supporting, and the organisers gave it their all, and failed, then I would be sad. I would cheer their efforts, wish them the best, and not sweat the money. If it was worth supporting in the first place, then it would remain to me, something I was glad to have tried to make successful, even by only contributing a few vacation dollars.
Ken: No, I pretty much stand by my money comments, (and that is not to say someone can't have a great time and further a social agenda at the same time.)
Here are some of my thoughts: the 340 Vancouverites who registered in Sydney could have all stayed home and donated say $3000 each to fund any number of VERY worthy causes with the $100,000. But we didn't, just like people everyday go on vacation instead of sending the money to Doctors Without Borders. The difference is that we all went to be part of something that had 2 goals: 1.) be part of a fabulous experience that enriched and strengthened our sense of community and 2.) be ambassadors to the outside world and have them get to know us and respect us and become our friends.
I'm not saying the latter isn't a worthy goal. It is. In fact it was a definite point that factored in my decision to go to Chicago. I believe the United States NEEDS a successful gay event. I believe that the U.S. in particular has a respect for splashy, competitive, money-generating events--just look at any Olympic Ceremonies or even half-time football shows. Sports spectacle catches the spirit of American consciousness, which I believe is why they do them SO WELL. Culturally, sport is a great way to promote understanding in America.
That being said, Gay Games (and Gay Sports events) are (largely) driven by "first world" (please excuse the expression--I don't like it, but can't find an alternative) travellers and money. Yes, one of the VERY important benefits is that people like the Netball players I mentioned took back something tremendous to their homes.
BUT any Canadian that has the luxury to drop $2-4000 to go around the world can afford to drop $150 if an event was cancelled. (The disasterous fallout for gay events is a whole other story.)
$150 is 5 Saturday night's beer. (I really have to go into training now...) If I think an event is worth supporting, and the organisers gave it their all, and failed, then I would be sad. I would cheer their efforts, wish them the best, and not sweat the money. If it was worth supporting in the first place, then it would remain to me, something I was glad to have tried to make successful, even by only contributing a few vacation dollars.
Kenmac i just read your interbention.
ON your question «Are you aware that the Male Chair of the Montreal bid group was Robert Vezina - the leader of the Bad Boys group?» Yes i was, they used my own name in the documents for more credibility, now that we ask questions, they dont recognize my name but that's another story.
Now about the case number involving the criminal past of someone important in the Outgames org, i went yesterday to the Montreal Court House and the number is 500-01-000484-912 and anyone can access the file.
ON your question «Are you aware that the Male Chair of the Montreal bid group was Robert Vezina - the leader of the Bad Boys group?» Yes i was, they used my own name in the documents for more credibility, now that we ask questions, they dont recognize my name but that's another story.
Now about the case number involving the criminal past of someone important in the Outgames org, i went yesterday to the Montreal Court House and the number is 500-01-000484-912 and anyone can access the file.
Francois Lemire and the Group Pride lawsuit:
The 1st World Outgames Montreal 2006 legal advisor will, if appropriate, issue an official statement in January 2006 in regards to the Group Pride lawsuit naming the 1st world Outgames, the To Be magazine Publications/Les editions Être, the Journal Ville Marie (property of Media Transcontinental Inc) and respective co-defenders.
In the interim the 1st World Outgames Montreal 2006 will not issue (for the time being) an official public statement (in regards to the lawsuit). (Normal when legal procedures are pending)
The 1st. world Outgames Montreal 2006 wish to re-ensure all of their registered participants, future registrants, partners, clients, suppliers and supporters that:
A. The 1st world Outgames Montreal 2006 organization has not, to the best of their knowledge, committed any wrong doings or contravened the law at any time in the course of organizing and promoting the 1st World Outgames Montreal 2006.
B. The 1st world Outgames Montreal 2006 pending lawsuit and issuing court case will not in any manner impede or handicap the delivery of the 1st world Outgames Montreal 2006 as planned.
The 1st World Outgames Montreal 2006 legal advisor will, if appropriate, issue an official statement in January 2006 in regards to the Group Pride lawsuit naming the 1st world Outgames, the To Be magazine Publications/Les editions Être, the Journal Ville Marie (property of Media Transcontinental Inc) and respective co-defenders.
In the interim the 1st World Outgames Montreal 2006 will not issue (for the time being) an official public statement (in regards to the lawsuit). (Normal when legal procedures are pending)
The 1st. world Outgames Montreal 2006 wish to re-ensure all of their registered participants, future registrants, partners, clients, suppliers and supporters that:
A. The 1st world Outgames Montreal 2006 organization has not, to the best of their knowledge, committed any wrong doings or contravened the law at any time in the course of organizing and promoting the 1st World Outgames Montreal 2006.
B. The 1st world Outgames Montreal 2006 pending lawsuit and issuing court case will not in any manner impede or handicap the delivery of the 1st world Outgames Montreal 2006 as planned.
Just a note:
I deleted 2 messages in this thread. One was a personal attack on a journalist by someone who had never posted before and violated our rules against personal attacks. This post had nothing to do with the issue at hand. The journalist merely pointed out the existence of the lawsuit, which is a fact and is public information and was also acknowledged by TOMSKI in his subsequent post.
I also deleted the journalist's response to that other post I deleted since it would have confused readers without the prior message.
I just wanted you all to know why the actions were taken. Thanks!
I deleted 2 messages in this thread. One was a personal attack on a journalist by someone who had never posted before and violated our rules against personal attacks. This post had nothing to do with the issue at hand. The journalist merely pointed out the existence of the lawsuit, which is a fact and is public information and was also acknowledged by TOMSKI in his subsequent post.
I also deleted the journalist's response to that other post I deleted since it would have confused readers without the prior message.
I just wanted you all to know why the actions were taken. Thanks!
Not that I disagree with that move Jim, but I am glad that I had read one of those posts prior to you deleting it. It certainly did put a number of things into some proper context for me and certainly validated some suspicions I had that I have talked about in some of my earlier posts. Not being from Montreal - and not reading French - I had no knowledge of some the history between some of those involved in this. A point I have had confirmed by some other friends in Montreal this afternoon who I contacted after reading one of the posts prior to it being deleted. Unfortunately other readers of this latest series of postings will not have that insight, now that they are no longer there. I know this will all sound rather cryptic to those who did not see the posts, but I'll leave it at that. As I say it is unfortunate, but certainly defensible on your part, and based on the rules of this board the right decision.
And just a minor housekeeping note - you may also want to delete KevinB's last post, only because that post was his reply to something that was said in one of the posts that you have now deleted.
Pat
[ January 06, 2006, 04:50 PM: Message edited by: Travelpat ]
And just a minor housekeeping note - you may also want to delete KevinB's last post, only because that post was his reply to something that was said in one of the posts that you have now deleted.
Pat
[ January 06, 2006, 04:50 PM: Message edited by: Travelpat ]
I googled this:
Robert Vézina, circuit king
Robert Vézina calls me from his car phone for this interview. He's headed out to the country for some much-needed R&R. The problem? This admitted workaholic is taking his laptop with him--which will mean, between his computer and the cell phone, he'll be eligible for about as much rest as he usually gets while in his downtown Montreal office.
Vézina has spent the last seven years building up his circuit empire, the Bad Boy Club Montreal, the non-profit organization which now hosts a series of annual parties. They include Twist (held in conjunction with every Divers/Cité celebration, this year's to be held Saturday, August 1), Wild and Wet (every Victoria Day) and the BBCM's crown jewel, October's Black & Blue.
This October, the Black & Blue heads into its eighth year and the results are impressive. The BBCM has donated more than half a million dollars in revenue to local AIDS- and gay-related charities, money culled from profits from the parties. Black & Blue has secured itself as one of the most impressive parties on the infamous gay circuit, receiving top-10 status last year when the New York Times did a feature on the phenomenon. In '97, B&B's numbers swelled to 12,000--no mere intimate dinner party; the all-night soirées feature dazzling light shows and entertainment varying from the latest club acts to high-profile DJs.
But along with the circuit hype comes the reputation the parties have as drug dens, where overdoses and unsafe sex are rampant. Amid all the criticism, the BBCM has taken a decidedly different stance: rather than deny that drugs are a reality at the parties, as organizers of several key American events have done, Vézina and crew have embarked on a safe-drugging, safe-sex campaign, distributing detailed literature at the events telling revellers how to party, good health intact. So far, the strategy appears to have worked, with only minor incidents--or "ambulances," as cases requiring medical attention at the parties are referred to--occurring at each BBCM event.
"The circuit does not promote drugs any more than regular clubs do," insists Vézina. "Promoters cannot be blamed for people doing drugs."
Vézina concedes he has consumed drugs occasionally, but says he ceased doing any hard drugs several years ago after a couple of bad trips. "I'm too sensitive for them," he explains. And the memory of the BBCM's co-founder and one of Vézina's closest friends, the late Christian Beaudry, who died of AIDS-related causes four years ago, continues to drive Vézina.
"Whenever I feel overwhelmed, overworked, whenever the bureaucratic crap really starts to get me down, I think of Christian and what he had to go through. I realize it's not that bad, and how important the work is."
And what of the charge that Vézina is a control freak? "I am," he readily admits. "I have to be. That's the first rule of organizing special events like these: never assume things are done.
"Frankly, I'm proud of creating a baby and it turning into a monster. I really am."
--Matthew Hays
Robert Vézina, circuit king
Robert Vézina calls me from his car phone for this interview. He's headed out to the country for some much-needed R&R. The problem? This admitted workaholic is taking his laptop with him--which will mean, between his computer and the cell phone, he'll be eligible for about as much rest as he usually gets while in his downtown Montreal office.
Vézina has spent the last seven years building up his circuit empire, the Bad Boy Club Montreal, the non-profit organization which now hosts a series of annual parties. They include Twist (held in conjunction with every Divers/Cité celebration, this year's to be held Saturday, August 1), Wild and Wet (every Victoria Day) and the BBCM's crown jewel, October's Black & Blue.
This October, the Black & Blue heads into its eighth year and the results are impressive. The BBCM has donated more than half a million dollars in revenue to local AIDS- and gay-related charities, money culled from profits from the parties. Black & Blue has secured itself as one of the most impressive parties on the infamous gay circuit, receiving top-10 status last year when the New York Times did a feature on the phenomenon. In '97, B&B's numbers swelled to 12,000--no mere intimate dinner party; the all-night soirées feature dazzling light shows and entertainment varying from the latest club acts to high-profile DJs.
But along with the circuit hype comes the reputation the parties have as drug dens, where overdoses and unsafe sex are rampant. Amid all the criticism, the BBCM has taken a decidedly different stance: rather than deny that drugs are a reality at the parties, as organizers of several key American events have done, Vézina and crew have embarked on a safe-drugging, safe-sex campaign, distributing detailed literature at the events telling revellers how to party, good health intact. So far, the strategy appears to have worked, with only minor incidents--or "ambulances," as cases requiring medical attention at the parties are referred to--occurring at each BBCM event.
"The circuit does not promote drugs any more than regular clubs do," insists Vézina. "Promoters cannot be blamed for people doing drugs."
Vézina concedes he has consumed drugs occasionally, but says he ceased doing any hard drugs several years ago after a couple of bad trips. "I'm too sensitive for them," he explains. And the memory of the BBCM's co-founder and one of Vézina's closest friends, the late Christian Beaudry, who died of AIDS-related causes four years ago, continues to drive Vézina.
"Whenever I feel overwhelmed, overworked, whenever the bureaucratic crap really starts to get me down, I think of Christian and what he had to go through. I realize it's not that bad, and how important the work is."
And what of the charge that Vézina is a control freak? "I am," he readily admits. "I have to be. That's the first rule of organizing special events like these: never assume things are done.
"Frankly, I'm proud of creating a baby and it turning into a monster. I really am."
--Matthew Hays
More googling;
"These days Black & Blue attracts some 80,000 participants and is one of the top tourism generators for the city of Montreal. The organisers admit that they never expected quite how massive the Black & Blue festival had become in its 13 year history. BBCM has also expanded beyond Black & Blue in October to provide four impressive parties throughout the year. On Valentines Day there’s the Red Party, May brings the Hot and Dry party, then there is New Year’s party called Bal des Boys, during Montreal’s gay pride festivities there is also a party called Twist. Checkout the BBCM web site for further details www.BBCM.org. The foundation has managed to raise well over $1 million over the years, a fantastic achievement.
Some critics have pointed out that circuit parties are a haven for drugs which can lead to unsafe sex. So how can a foundation in which the key ambition is to promote safe sex and AIDS awareness justify raising money through circuit parties? They addressed the problem upfront, in a way that’s been highly effective. The BBCM was among the first circuit party organizers to offer condoms and non-judgmental pamphlets on how to party safely. The effects are clear with medical staff being on call in case of any emergencies; BBCM events have managed to remain almost entirely free of any medical incidents."
"These days Black & Blue attracts some 80,000 participants and is one of the top tourism generators for the city of Montreal. The organisers admit that they never expected quite how massive the Black & Blue festival had become in its 13 year history. BBCM has also expanded beyond Black & Blue in October to provide four impressive parties throughout the year. On Valentines Day there’s the Red Party, May brings the Hot and Dry party, then there is New Year’s party called Bal des Boys, during Montreal’s gay pride festivities there is also a party called Twist. Checkout the BBCM web site for further details www.BBCM.org. The foundation has managed to raise well over $1 million over the years, a fantastic achievement.
Some critics have pointed out that circuit parties are a haven for drugs which can lead to unsafe sex. So how can a foundation in which the key ambition is to promote safe sex and AIDS awareness justify raising money through circuit parties? They addressed the problem upfront, in a way that’s been highly effective. The BBCM was among the first circuit party organizers to offer condoms and non-judgmental pamphlets on how to party safely. The effects are clear with medical staff being on call in case of any emergencies; BBCM events have managed to remain almost entirely free of any medical incidents."
Jim,. major changes made in Montral Outgames. The co-chair resigned yesterday with many of her followers after investigation for criminal past and 1.1 Million $ legal action. Investigation will follow...
Edito...
Interesting. What type of changes to the Outgames, other than the co-chair (and others) quitting?
I do see there are changes to their website already. Those that have given their money to Montreal had better make sure refunds are permitted!! eek! eek!
Interesting. What type of changes to the Outgames, other than the co-chair (and others) quitting?
I do see there are changes to their website already. Those that have given their money to Montreal had better make sure refunds are permitted!! eek! eek!
QUOTE
Those that have given their money to Montreal had better make sure refunds are permitted!!
Let's not get carried away here. Past gay sports events have had changes to their management and still come off fine. I know nothing more than was posted so I ask people to not make leaps of judgment unless they know what they're talking about. Thanks!
I agree.
The new issue of Bay Area Reporter has reported a few more things on the pending Montreal suit:
Bay Area Reporter
Bay Area Reporter
For the record:
- The new co-president of the 1st world Outgames is Marielle Dupere. She already was a board member of the games. The former co – chair resigned a few weeks ago not yesterday (before Xmas) for personal family reasons.
- The Outgames have taken on a PR firm, European PR consultants and have 10 full time staff in the marketing communications department. M. Jean Yves Duthel is leaving to work as the DIRECTOR OF SPECIAL PROJECTS at the City of Montreal at the Major’s request. He will in his new position remain closely linked to the Conference and the Outgames.
- The Outgames staff has increased not decreased in the last few month. We are now 51 full time employees, 2000 + volunteers, 400, committee members - all working hard to make the 1st world Outgames Montreal 2006 a total success.
- The law firm that will defend the Outgames versus Group Pride is Avery De Billy a well known and respected international law firm.
- The Outgames (Organising Committee) has an important insurance policy that covers legal procedures and law suits. No matter what the outcome in court, the result will not in any way harm the financial situation of the Games.
- A word of friendly advice: it would be unwise for anyone to comment on the law suit in public because it is pending before a court of law. Anyone choosing to do so, may unwittingly become involved.
The Outgames Team wish everyone the very best in 2006 - 2006 THE YEAR OF THE OUTGAMES-
Tom Czerniecki
marketing -communications director
1st world Outgames Montreal 2006
- The new co-president of the 1st world Outgames is Marielle Dupere. She already was a board member of the games. The former co – chair resigned a few weeks ago not yesterday (before Xmas) for personal family reasons.
- The Outgames have taken on a PR firm, European PR consultants and have 10 full time staff in the marketing communications department. M. Jean Yves Duthel is leaving to work as the DIRECTOR OF SPECIAL PROJECTS at the City of Montreal at the Major’s request. He will in his new position remain closely linked to the Conference and the Outgames.
- The Outgames staff has increased not decreased in the last few month. We are now 51 full time employees, 2000 + volunteers, 400, committee members - all working hard to make the 1st world Outgames Montreal 2006 a total success.
- The law firm that will defend the Outgames versus Group Pride is Avery De Billy a well known and respected international law firm.
- The Outgames (Organising Committee) has an important insurance policy that covers legal procedures and law suits. No matter what the outcome in court, the result will not in any way harm the financial situation of the Games.
- A word of friendly advice: it would be unwise for anyone to comment on the law suit in public because it is pending before a court of law. Anyone choosing to do so, may unwittingly become involved.
The Outgames Team wish everyone the very best in 2006 - 2006 THE YEAR OF THE OUTGAMES-
Tom Czerniecki
marketing -communications director
1st world Outgames Montreal 2006
I love it. Now Outgames reps are threatening people with lawsuits if they talk about it!
So, if I make a comment, and get subpoenaed, do I get a free trip to Montreal?
Nice of you to come to the defense of your advertisers, Jim!
So, if I make a comment, and get subpoenaed, do I get a free trip to Montreal?
Nice of you to come to the defense of your advertisers, Jim!
QUOTE
Nice of you to come to the defense of your advertisers, Jim!
What are you talking about? I simply said not to extropolate that the lawsuit equals the end of the OutGames.
Hi,
Jim is right that he just clarified the point.
What I find funny is that Tom managed to tell us that he was giving us some friendly advice and then added the threat.
I suppose that all of those folks that talked about the OJ trial were in danger of becoming involved? Is he suggesting that a discussion should not be held for that reason?
How transparent is that? Clearly it is not in his interest to have discussion about the negative aspects of his program.
If Lucie really left for personal family reasons, why did they take so long to announce it?
Now both of the original Co-Chairs are gone.
I also must say that he is wrong if he thinks that a lawsuit couldn't hurt them. I expect he is playing the odds on what could possibly be awarded and what resources they have but it is not clear. Seems to me that there is something fishy going on with Mr. Duthel leaving at such a critical moment.
Timing or convenience?
I must say one thing for this group, they sure do seem to stick up for one another like a very tight group. It will be interesting to see how it all shakes out as the days pass and the stresses of the actual event hit their offices.
Of course with 51 staff it must be very interesting over there. I can't wait to read the last chapter of this story!
Ken
Jim is right that he just clarified the point.
What I find funny is that Tom managed to tell us that he was giving us some friendly advice and then added the threat.
I suppose that all of those folks that talked about the OJ trial were in danger of becoming involved? Is he suggesting that a discussion should not be held for that reason?
How transparent is that? Clearly it is not in his interest to have discussion about the negative aspects of his program.
If Lucie really left for personal family reasons, why did they take so long to announce it?
Now both of the original Co-Chairs are gone.
I also must say that he is wrong if he thinks that a lawsuit couldn't hurt them. I expect he is playing the odds on what could possibly be awarded and what resources they have but it is not clear. Seems to me that there is something fishy going on with Mr. Duthel leaving at such a critical moment.
Timing or convenience?
I must say one thing for this group, they sure do seem to stick up for one another like a very tight group. It will be interesting to see how it all shakes out as the days pass and the stresses of the actual event hit their offices.
Of course with 51 staff it must be very interesting over there. I can't wait to read the last chapter of this story!
Ken
Hey Tom,
Your website says that you are wrong about the staff #, you have managed to inflate that number by four people. It says that you have 47 staff and will have 50 by the time the games are put on in the summer.
Here is a cut and paste and it looks current given that there is a date:
From one person in December 2001, we are today 47 full time employees (as of 13 January 2006). At the games, roughly 50 full time employees and 5,000 volunters will work hard to deliver the event.
Just a little exaggeration huh?
Ken
Your website says that you are wrong about the staff #, you have managed to inflate that number by four people. It says that you have 47 staff and will have 50 by the time the games are put on in the summer.
Here is a cut and paste and it looks current given that there is a date:
From one person in December 2001, we are today 47 full time employees (as of 13 January 2006). At the games, roughly 50 full time employees and 5,000 volunters will work hard to deliver the event.
Just a little exaggeration huh?
Ken
Maybe I should have stopped reading but it is like watching a fire.....
Later on the same page they say:
Never has a host organization had such a comprehensive, professional, competent staff working full-time to ensure the success of the Outgames on every level. In addition, we already have over 1,700 volunteers in our database, many already working a numerous projects.
On the surface, you have to think they are right considering there has never been an OutGames before - no standards are easy to achieve.
Then we see how many volunteers are in their database - not active, in their database and they can say there will be 5,000 when they need them. Where will they come from? I know I had signed up to be a volunteer before they decided to go alone and I will not be there to volunteer, I wonder how many others in their database are going to withdraw as volunteers?
Spin spin spin
Ken
again
Later on the same page they say:
Never has a host organization had such a comprehensive, professional, competent staff working full-time to ensure the success of the Outgames on every level. In addition, we already have over 1,700 volunteers in our database, many already working a numerous projects.
On the surface, you have to think they are right considering there has never been an OutGames before - no standards are easy to achieve.
Then we see how many volunteers are in their database - not active, in their database and they can say there will be 5,000 when they need them. Where will they come from? I know I had signed up to be a volunteer before they decided to go alone and I will not be there to volunteer, I wonder how many others in their database are going to withdraw as volunteers?
Spin spin spin
Ken
again
Dear Kenmac,
The additional staff (4 people) have been hired in my department (starting on the 9th of Jan. 2006). Sorry but your comments are dead wrong.
As for the volunteers they come from the following sources:
LGBT sport teams
LGBT cultural organizations
LGBT community organizations
main stream sport governing bodies
municipal organizations
private corporations
citizens from Montreal
other local events
international
We have been recruiting over the years and had a Xmas drive which was very succesful and hence the additional number of volunteers. Difficult for some of you to grasp the idea that in Montreal this event is being treated like any other major event in Montreal! We are supported,liked, financed,and well on our way to being the most succesful LGBT event in history!
As for the comitees you should know that over and above the full time staff we are working with committees: 35 in sports,6 cultural, 10 in logistics, 4 marketing-communications etc. Do your own math 8 - 10 people per committee.
I will repeat for those of you who like so much to distort:
1.We will not comment on the lawsuit.
2.The courts and judges will decide who is in their lawful right. All in due time!
As per my ''advice'' : no threat intended. (And personaly I couldn't careless what you do or say!) If you don't consider my advice as sound & friendly,please by all means make all the comments you want to.
As for your expression ''critical moment'' : There is no critical moment. Everything is fully on track and the Outgames are well on their way in becomming the most sucessful LGBT games ever. Yes I'm repeating myself but hey you deserve it!
Read our next Club Montreal email letter and get the latest news on sports, cultural, conference and much more.
I will not be back to write on any more of your comments simply because:
WE HAVE GAMES TO DELIVAR IN 7 MONTH AND OUR TIME IS BETTER SPENT WORKING ON THE GAMES THEN CHATTING ON THIS BOARD.
Best regards to you and some of your close friends,
Tom
The additional staff (4 people) have been hired in my department (starting on the 9th of Jan. 2006). Sorry but your comments are dead wrong.
As for the volunteers they come from the following sources:
LGBT sport teams
LGBT cultural organizations
LGBT community organizations
main stream sport governing bodies
municipal organizations
private corporations
citizens from Montreal
other local events
international
We have been recruiting over the years and had a Xmas drive which was very succesful and hence the additional number of volunteers. Difficult for some of you to grasp the idea that in Montreal this event is being treated like any other major event in Montreal! We are supported,liked, financed,and well on our way to being the most succesful LGBT event in history!
As for the comitees you should know that over and above the full time staff we are working with committees: 35 in sports,6 cultural, 10 in logistics, 4 marketing-communications etc. Do your own math 8 - 10 people per committee.
I will repeat for those of you who like so much to distort:
1.We will not comment on the lawsuit.
2.The courts and judges will decide who is in their lawful right. All in due time!
As per my ''advice'' : no threat intended. (And personaly I couldn't careless what you do or say!) If you don't consider my advice as sound & friendly,please by all means make all the comments you want to.
As for your expression ''critical moment'' : There is no critical moment. Everything is fully on track and the Outgames are well on their way in becomming the most sucessful LGBT games ever. Yes I'm repeating myself but hey you deserve it!
Read our next Club Montreal email letter and get the latest news on sports, cultural, conference and much more.
I will not be back to write on any more of your comments simply because:
WE HAVE GAMES TO DELIVAR IN 7 MONTH AND OUR TIME IS BETTER SPENT WORKING ON THE GAMES THEN CHATTING ON THIS BOARD.
Best regards to you and some of your close friends,
Tom
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