Interesting article from the New Republic:
http://www.tnr.com/politics/story.html?id=...e4-0e26a61316b4
It's pretty hard to ignore the consistent undercurrent of homophobia in Duke anti-fandom. People tend to pick out the best-looking white guy on the team and taunt him mercilessly as gay, feminine, etc.--see the "I Kissed a Boy" Paulus video that Cyd approvingly linked to a few days ago for the latest edition of that, the constant Redick and Laettner bashing, etc. For what it's worth, I'm a Duke agnostic, but this kind of thing makes me sympathize with their players on a personal level.
The real question is whether Duke basketball gets its "fair share" of homophobic taunts, and we just notice it more because they are one of the most hated teams in America. Notre Dame football has to be up there with Duke basketball in that respect; Brady Quinn (and now Jimmy Clausen) dealt with more than his share of gay-bashing, masquerading as "fans" of other teams rooting against Notre Dame. But it's nothing like what Redick had to deal with.
Full Version: Duke Hatred and Homophobia
It's pure jealousy.... no other way to paint it!
As I said on the blog:
http://outsports.com/jocktalkblog/2009/03/...a/#comment-5317
Duke University’s trouble is only present because of the prestige it holds and the great players it has had. This is just one very large case of jealousy by other contending universities who have to use “gay” as a way to mock Duke players. It’s a shame too, considering the word itself has lost all original meaning and it’s just playground taunts. In plain English that means those who resort to such a stupid taunt in order to ridicule Duke players aren’t very mature, or rather less mature than your average 10 year old.
@ John: Duke is actually not a homophobic school. The theory of it being a homophobic school spans decades. In Spring 2003 a program was started up at Duke University to change the perception of Duke being a homophobic school. The program since then has spread to other universities in the US as well. Unless you can actually back that claim up, I see it as mere fiction.
http://outsports.com/jocktalkblog/2009/03/...a/#comment-5317
QUOTE(DJ on the Jock Talk Blog)
Duke University’s trouble is only present because of the prestige it holds and the great players it has had. This is just one very large case of jealousy by other contending universities who have to use “gay” as a way to mock Duke players. It’s a shame too, considering the word itself has lost all original meaning and it’s just playground taunts. In plain English that means those who resort to such a stupid taunt in order to ridicule Duke players aren’t very mature, or rather less mature than your average 10 year old.
@ John: Duke is actually not a homophobic school. The theory of it being a homophobic school spans decades. In Spring 2003 a program was started up at Duke University to change the perception of Duke being a homophobic school. The program since then has spread to other universities in the US as well. Unless you can actually back that claim up, I see it as mere fiction.
As a Maryland alum, I think jealousy and Duke's "prestige" does play a role. But, I'm not shedding any tears for them. They have the opportunity to go to one of the nation's best higher educations of learning, and play for one of the best college basketball programs ever. Please!! Ok!! They will be alright.
QUOTE(mdterp01 @ Mar 20 2009, 06:11 AM) 
As a Maryland alum, I think jealousy and Duke's "prestige" does play a role. But, I'm not shedding any tears for them. They have the opportunity to go to one of the nation's best higher educations of learning, and play for one of the best college basketball programs ever. Please!! Ok!! They will be alright.
Most definitely. These players need to get it through their minds that these are just childish taunts. Just block them out of your head and strut your stuff!
QUOTE(.DJ. @ Mar 20 2009, 05:36 PM)
Most definitely. These players need to get it through their minds that these are just childish taunts. Just block them out of your head and strut your stuff!
I'm quite sure they're tough enough to handle it by now or they wouldn't make it past the first ACC matchup. Why do people still hate them though. They're not nearly as good as they use to be. Why don't people hate Carolina and UCONN more?
The homophobia doesn't bother me but the presumption that Duke is the conservative republican school and UNC is the liberal one does. I doubt there is much difference in the political make up of the student body. NC state is the conservative school. The media got it wrong when they tried to portray Duke as an elite white school that had a relationship problem in a black town. Yes there are spoiled elite brats on campus but Durham is probably the most liberal city in the south thanks in large part to having high powered research institutions close by. Neighboring Orange county (Chapel Hill) is close behind but based on election results Durham county is slightly more liberal clocking in at over 75% democrats. They have a nice size gay pride parade every year (over 10,000) and all the businesses near the parade put up rainbow flags. Driving around town it is not uncommon to see rainbow flags on people's front porches. Most neighborhoods in Durham are racially mixed and it has historically had the largest black middle class in the country. It is home of black wall street where the first black own bank and insurance company began. There are racial conflicts but locals describe the conflicts and open political discussions where people shake hands when it is over.
I don't really care how the coaches vote. I worked with Roy William's son but I never discussed politics him. His boss was such a Bush fan I didn't dare.
Homophobia directed towards any team is irritating but what is really disturbing are death threats. Some fans like to call the players in the middle of the night with death threats to intimidate them the next day. That is just plain sick no matter what team you love to hate.
Easy, hate never leaves. It may decline, but it will never leave.
I think people hate Duke because in the 1990s they got a lot of favorable calls from the refs. Nobody cares if the school is racist or homophobic or conservative. They cheat. Some might suggest because they had a fair number of white players that they got even more calls because they were seen as a "white" team. Kind of like the Boston Celtics used to be. But I'm not making that argument, just the cheating one.
Case in point: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AwYVTB2rZw
Laettner stomps on a Kentucky player but isn't ejected? Then he goes on to hit the game winning last second shot. The game against UNLV (year 2) was also a travesty of justice.
Until the last few years, the announcers were also extremely biased toward Duke. CBS' Billy Packer was the poster boy for enthusiastic Dukedom jock-ship but you could hear it on other stations as well. It's hard to watch a game when the announcers scream every time Duke makes a lay-up; it brings out a subconscious hatred and if you google Packer's name you'll see that people were glad he was fired because he was so annoyingly DUKE!
I'm glad Duke has sucked for the past few years and root against anyone who plays them. I always will. I am rooting for Texas right now. I am also a Michigan Man, so my hatred is justified.
Case in point: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AwYVTB2rZw
Laettner stomps on a Kentucky player but isn't ejected? Then he goes on to hit the game winning last second shot. The game against UNLV (year 2) was also a travesty of justice.
Until the last few years, the announcers were also extremely biased toward Duke. CBS' Billy Packer was the poster boy for enthusiastic Dukedom jock-ship but you could hear it on other stations as well. It's hard to watch a game when the announcers scream every time Duke makes a lay-up; it brings out a subconscious hatred and if you google Packer's name you'll see that people were glad he was fired because he was so annoyingly DUKE!
I'm glad Duke has sucked for the past few years and root against anyone who plays them. I always will. I am rooting for Texas right now. I am also a Michigan Man, so my hatred is justified.
QUOTE(jay original @ Mar 21 2009, 08:33 PM)
Until the last few years, the announcers were also extremely biased toward Duke. CBS' Billy Packer was the poster boy for enthusiastic Dukedom jock-ship but you could hear it on other stations as well. It's hard to watch a game when the announcers scream every time Duke makes a lay-up; it brings out a subconscious hatred and if you google Packer's name you'll see that people were glad he was fired because he was so annoyingly DUKE!
You just lost all credibility when you claimed that Bill Packer was a Duke fan!? He hated Duke. I even heard him screaming his disdain during a game once. Duke had made a 3-point shot with the foot on the NBA three point line and he started screaming that it should be a two. He didn't quit, saying "this is why everyone hates Duke because they get all the calls". The media is very anti-duke and some sports writers have written openly about their dislike for the team. In fact the media plays right into the "Duke gets all the calls" myth. If you really feel Duke somehow magically gets all the calls hate the refs it's their job to call games.
I don't like UCONN but I can say it is because they beat Duke twice when Duke should have won it all. I don't have to whine about them getting all the calls or claim that they are Nazi students. I also don't particularly like Kentucky but I'm not going to claim that they are hillbillies. It is because they are a traditional power even if they are down this year. Real sports fans will simply say they don't like another team because they beat their team.
Why do people call them a white team when they have so many great (and often handsome) black players.
I don't recall saying Duke was a Nazi school. David Duke is a Nazi and America is racist. I could care less. I do recall saying that they do get a lot of favorable calls, I stand by that. It's empirical logic and reasoning; you sound like the one who is whining and being unduly passionate...using racial epithets like "hillbilly". Yikes. 
Meanwhile, I think you are confusing Packer's hatred of Duke with the sex scandal before the Duke game when he told two women to work a women's game when they asked for his credentials and he had to apologize. Did you ever hear him call a game with J. J. Redick? It was nauseating. And how does Packer have anything to do with refs giving Duke freebies???
Throw Jim Nantz in there for good measure. Nantz = Duke Sycophant.
I often wonder why people consider a film or neighborhood "black" if blacks have a co-staring role or are more than 10% of the population...As for Duke, maybe because certain white players (Hurley, Ferry, Laettner, Redick, etc.) get elevated to God status in the media and receive privileged status from the refs, people associate them with affluent white privilege in America. If you were alive in the 80s the Celtic/Laker, Indiana State/Michigan State divide was as much a racial divide as anything else.
I have never noticed any hot players from Duke in general. What black players are you telling about?
Meanwhile, I think you are confusing Packer's hatred of Duke with the sex scandal before the Duke game when he told two women to work a women's game when they asked for his credentials and he had to apologize. Did you ever hear him call a game with J. J. Redick? It was nauseating. And how does Packer have anything to do with refs giving Duke freebies???
Throw Jim Nantz in there for good measure. Nantz = Duke Sycophant.
I often wonder why people consider a film or neighborhood "black" if blacks have a co-staring role or are more than 10% of the population...As for Duke, maybe because certain white players (Hurley, Ferry, Laettner, Redick, etc.) get elevated to God status in the media and receive privileged status from the refs, people associate them with affluent white privilege in America. If you were alive in the 80s the Celtic/Laker, Indiana State/Michigan State divide was as much a racial divide as anything else.
I have never noticed any hot players from Duke in general. What black players are you telling about?
I never claimed you called Duke a Nazi school but I have heard other haters do so.
I assure you I have watched more Duke games called by Packer than you have. I have heard his outbursts against Duke. He is a WF grade but an ultra-Carolina fan.
The problem with these discussions is that people will always argue that the winning team gets all the calls when it is not the team they want to win. They will always complain that the media elevates their competition to god-like status when the competition is beating them. Have you notice the god-like status Carolina and their players receive these days. Particularly their pretty white boy?
As for hot black Duke players the school has turned out many. Henderson is a stud, Tragon Langdon, Boozer, Battier.. I could go on. I am a huge fan of Grant Hill and Johnny Dawkins. Both are stellar individuals I'm sure I missed quite a few, like Brian Davis. I saw him hanging out at the bars in Durham about 10 years ago and he looks better in person. Duke typically as 3 black players and 2 white players on the floor. And this so called "white team" has recently produced three black head coaches. If you'd like to tell me Tommy A.'s was a failure at Michigan for not turning around a program on probation go ahead. Jeff Capel inherited OU in the same state three years ago and just beat your big blue.
As I mention before there are plenty of schools that I love to see lose but I am always able to separate my feelings for their team's success with the players or students of the school. Any other way is just childish. UConn's Okafor is a stud and a top notch individual but damn did it piss me off when his UCONN team beat Duke because Sheldon Williams fouled out on a touch call with 5 minutes to go. Oh, but I seem to have forgotten that Duke is suppose to gets all the calls go their way.
I assure you I have watched more Duke games called by Packer than you have. I have heard his outbursts against Duke. He is a WF grade but an ultra-Carolina fan.
The problem with these discussions is that people will always argue that the winning team gets all the calls when it is not the team they want to win. They will always complain that the media elevates their competition to god-like status when the competition is beating them. Have you notice the god-like status Carolina and their players receive these days. Particularly their pretty white boy?
As for hot black Duke players the school has turned out many. Henderson is a stud, Tragon Langdon, Boozer, Battier.. I could go on. I am a huge fan of Grant Hill and Johnny Dawkins. Both are stellar individuals I'm sure I missed quite a few, like Brian Davis. I saw him hanging out at the bars in Durham about 10 years ago and he looks better in person. Duke typically as 3 black players and 2 white players on the floor. And this so called "white team" has recently produced three black head coaches. If you'd like to tell me Tommy A.'s was a failure at Michigan for not turning around a program on probation go ahead. Jeff Capel inherited OU in the same state three years ago and just beat your big blue.
As I mention before there are plenty of schools that I love to see lose but I am always able to separate my feelings for their team's success with the players or students of the school. Any other way is just childish. UConn's Okafor is a stud and a top notch individual but damn did it piss me off when his UCONN team beat Duke because Sheldon Williams fouled out on a touch call with 5 minutes to go. Oh, but I seem to have forgotten that Duke is suppose to gets all the calls go their way.
Thanks for clearing up the Nazi slur. I don't like people thinking I'm racist against racist people. There is no power in that.
This is cyberspace; you can't definitively say that you've watched more Duke games than I have with Billy Packer announcing. Johnny Dawkins was actually my favorite player from 1982 until Jalen Rose arrived at Michigan in '91. I didn't really start hating Duke until the Hurley Laettner era and thereafter watched them to see them lose. And just like you claim a bias by people who feel the media elevates certain players when they don't like the team, I could say that you have a listening bias where you think that Packer is anti-Duke because you don't want to admit that he is really a strong Duke man. Please address the J. J. Redick(!!!) question in regard to Packer.
Also bringing up Urkel from UNC doesn't negate my argument. It's like mentioning Chipper Jones. Irrelevant.
I need you to explain to me what kind of high road you feel that you are on by "separating" fans/school from a team. It's all the same to me. I don't say, Gosh I hope Ohio State loses! Then hug their fans and say I love their school. Unless it's tournament play and I'm supporting the Big Ten I hate Ohio State. And I know that as a Michigan fan they hate me in kind. It's just sports. Sometimes people take it too seriously but I don't think I am one of them. Saying I hate Duke just means I want the team to lose; that also means the students will be a little depressed in class because their team lost and the mood of the school will be sour. I don't call players slurs based on gender/race/sexuality; but I don't do that with anyone. I will chant overrated and scoreboard though and an occasional you suck, even though the last one is a bit homophobic.
We could probably keep going back and forth and if you were in my town eventually we'd hook up to let off steam so I'll stop with the rebuttals now otherwise I'll get Maize & Blue balls. But I will say that Duke not getting a call against UCONN is karma. It comes back around my friend. I hated Tommy Amaker until he coached Michigan, now he's an alright guy. I'll hate Tragon Langdon until he puts his penis in my mouth. And finally, while a great Oklahoma team did defeat Michigan in tournament play in their final matchup of the season MICHIGAN DEFEATED DUKE 81-73! Which in all honesty made my year even before the NCAAs!
Go Blue!!! (That's a Michigan chant, I know you Dookies get confused)
This is cyberspace; you can't definitively say that you've watched more Duke games than I have with Billy Packer announcing. Johnny Dawkins was actually my favorite player from 1982 until Jalen Rose arrived at Michigan in '91. I didn't really start hating Duke until the Hurley Laettner era and thereafter watched them to see them lose. And just like you claim a bias by people who feel the media elevates certain players when they don't like the team, I could say that you have a listening bias where you think that Packer is anti-Duke because you don't want to admit that he is really a strong Duke man. Please address the J. J. Redick(!!!) question in regard to Packer.
Also bringing up Urkel from UNC doesn't negate my argument. It's like mentioning Chipper Jones. Irrelevant.
I need you to explain to me what kind of high road you feel that you are on by "separating" fans/school from a team. It's all the same to me. I don't say, Gosh I hope Ohio State loses! Then hug their fans and say I love their school. Unless it's tournament play and I'm supporting the Big Ten I hate Ohio State. And I know that as a Michigan fan they hate me in kind. It's just sports. Sometimes people take it too seriously but I don't think I am one of them. Saying I hate Duke just means I want the team to lose; that also means the students will be a little depressed in class because their team lost and the mood of the school will be sour. I don't call players slurs based on gender/race/sexuality; but I don't do that with anyone. I will chant overrated and scoreboard though and an occasional you suck, even though the last one is a bit homophobic.
We could probably keep going back and forth and if you were in my town eventually we'd hook up to let off steam so I'll stop with the rebuttals now otherwise I'll get Maize & Blue balls. But I will say that Duke not getting a call against UCONN is karma. It comes back around my friend. I hated Tommy Amaker until he coached Michigan, now he's an alright guy. I'll hate Tragon Langdon until he puts his penis in my mouth. And finally, while a great Oklahoma team did defeat Michigan in tournament play in their final matchup of the season MICHIGAN DEFEATED DUKE 81-73! Which in all honesty made my year even before the NCAAs!
Go Blue!!! (That's a Michigan chant, I know you Dookies get confused)
When I would hear Billy announcing it seemed he couldn't contain himself when he felt Duke would be upset. When Duke pulled it off he started getting upset about calls before he even saw the replay. I have heard him rail and then when he saw the replay and humbly said "I stand corrected". If it was a bad call he doesn't quit. He was not the only announcer that would feed the myth that one call is the only reason Duke won. When a call goes against Duke it is just casually mentioned a brushed off and never considered a game changer. When you are confusing is the Media's fascination of Duke hating with loving Duke. This was most evidence the last time Duke won the tournament. Instead of talking about the clutch three point shots that made they focused on a no-call. Yes that no-call would have taken out Duke's point guard after he had several touch fouls called against him. They didn't mention the touch fouls but boy the no call was pretty much all the sport casters talked about. Then they ran a poll to see how many people think Duke gets all the calls. They not only rained on Duke's parade, they blew enough wind to start a cyclone. I could tell by the disappointment in their voices how bias they were. It was confirmed when I started reading two or three articles by different sport writers justifying why they hate Duke. The media use to love playing Duke games because they know so many people will watch to see them lose. In the past they have catered to the haters because that is where the money is. By inflating the players the public hates they are only helping the hater's cause. I will admit that C.L.'s stomp was wrong but it seems a bit obsessive to be still talking about it more than 15 years later. Any incident where a Duke player steps out of line is played ad nausea. Why? Because for the most part Duke runs a clean program when they do something wrong haters will inflate it to a felony. Consider the screen that a Maryland player made against Nolan Smith this season. NS suffered a concussion and was out for three games but there was no mention about whether the MD player was being too rough. If that had been a Duke play setting a screen Duke fans would never have heard the end of it. Games with Maryland have often led to Duke having a player injured and out for several games but I suppose you will just claim that it is karma.
As far as BP's affection for JJ perhaps he has a crush on him. Maybe he say him taking a shower and now can't contain himself. That doesn't change his feeling towards Duke.
I completely take the high road with sports. I admire athletes for their discipline and I am particularly impressed when they are able to take their success on the court to do great things off. Grant Hill is a portrait of that type of athlete. When they play for the other team I may still want them to lose but that doesn't change my feeling towards the individual or the fan base. These days UNC is being raised to god-like status as is Hansbrough. Strangely that doesn't seem to be a problem with the public. Still I admire Hansbrough. I briefly met his Dad once and he seemed like a down to earth approachable guy. I had a very good working relationship with Roy's son. A lot of people found him too cocky but he was professional, very easy to work with and told me once he was a big fan of my work. Duke and UNC students, attend select classes together through an exchange system (there is a bus connecting the two campuses). Obviously it is not uncommon for them to date each other and marry. I'm sure it is the same with OSU and Mich. Of course that only makes the tit for tat game more intense. I really don't have any preconceived opinion of UNC students, their players, or their coach. I do believe it is a top-notch school so I would hope their alum have above average intelligence. So you see I can completely relate to people wishing Duke would lose (I'm that way with many teams) but when they make stereotype assumptions about the fan base and the school that ticks me off. And I still feel hating your rivals' players simple because they play a good game is wrong and unsportsmanlike. Claiming they get all the calls is like believing in some strange conspiracy theory and yet those are the first words out of a Duke hater's mouth. It never occurs to them that if they were a Duke fan they'd see all the calls that went against them and how the media play down those calls and hype the others.
As far as BP's affection for JJ perhaps he has a crush on him. Maybe he say him taking a shower and now can't contain himself. That doesn't change his feeling towards Duke.
I completely take the high road with sports. I admire athletes for their discipline and I am particularly impressed when they are able to take their success on the court to do great things off. Grant Hill is a portrait of that type of athlete. When they play for the other team I may still want them to lose but that doesn't change my feeling towards the individual or the fan base. These days UNC is being raised to god-like status as is Hansbrough. Strangely that doesn't seem to be a problem with the public. Still I admire Hansbrough. I briefly met his Dad once and he seemed like a down to earth approachable guy. I had a very good working relationship with Roy's son. A lot of people found him too cocky but he was professional, very easy to work with and told me once he was a big fan of my work. Duke and UNC students, attend select classes together through an exchange system (there is a bus connecting the two campuses). Obviously it is not uncommon for them to date each other and marry. I'm sure it is the same with OSU and Mich. Of course that only makes the tit for tat game more intense. I really don't have any preconceived opinion of UNC students, their players, or their coach. I do believe it is a top-notch school so I would hope their alum have above average intelligence. So you see I can completely relate to people wishing Duke would lose (I'm that way with many teams) but when they make stereotype assumptions about the fan base and the school that ticks me off. And I still feel hating your rivals' players simple because they play a good game is wrong and unsportsmanlike. Claiming they get all the calls is like believing in some strange conspiracy theory and yet those are the first words out of a Duke hater's mouth. It never occurs to them that if they were a Duke fan they'd see all the calls that went against them and how the media play down those calls and hype the others.
Thom, I can't take anymore foreplay! Please stop it! 
If Duke isn't being unfairly targeted here, then why does Tyler Hansbrough not get subjected to the same kind of homophobic vitriol as Duke players?
QUOTE(jay original @ Mar 23 2009, 02:57 PM)
Thom, I can't take anymore foreplay! Please stop it!
Point taken, I've said everything I need to. Now bend over
. I warned you I only take the high road.
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