I don't follow Pairs skating quite as closely as the individual events, but I do like Berezhnaya & Sikhuralidze a lot. They have that impeccable Russian polish and line, plus all the big tricks. Gotta say too, Anton's pretty hot. If you haven't seen it yet, check out his outfit in the long program. His transparent top is the best thing that happened to nipples since J-Lo's Oscar dress.

Sale and Pelletier skated great at the GP Finals. I like them, but not quite as much as B&S. Does anybody know if they're doing "Love Story" or "Orchid" in the LP?

I really feel for Shen & Zhao sometimes. Every year, they get better and better. I think they've improved a lot more over the past three years than the other two top pairs, yet every year and every big competition, they come in 3rd. I can understand it, however, since they still seem to have a certain detachment from their music. But wow, they do the big tricks bigger and better than anybody else. I wonder how it'll pan out if they toss a throw quad salchow into the mix. As rigid as figure skating judging so often is, they could probably skate a perfect LP, nailing the throw 4s, and still place 3rd.

I love Ina & Zimmerman, but I'll confess it's really just because John Zimmerman is so damn hot. I'm praying that they medal, if only because all the medalists perform in the Exhibition. John wears a pair of jeans in their exo program that'll make your jaw crash to the floorboards.

Comments and predictions?

Wow, what an incredible short program last night for the Pairs. The top 4, including the Russians, Canadians, Chinese, and again Russians were excellent. Mon. night should be a real showdown. Hoping Sale and Pelletier take gold.

Did anyone else notice the really poor design of the rink? The audience seems to be pushed back and up, any close up shots of the skaters doesn't even include other people. Just a blank blue wall in the background.

If they can skate like last night, B&S are going to win the whole thing. They were just the best by far. The Canadians were great, but the Russians were transcendant. It was perfect. If they hadn't gone first, I bet there would have been a 6.0 or two.

I'm rooting for Ina and Zimmerman to pull a bronze. I think they're wonderful skaters and I want to see good things happen for them.

One question: Was with some friends and had the skating on in the background with no sound. Looked like the Canadians fell (the guy seemed to mouth ``f**k!'' to his partner as they lay on the ground) yet they got high scores. Can someone explain (I'm no skating expert).

I was over at a friend's house watching the Olympics last night. When the Canadian pair went splat, everybody gasped. I was the only figure skating "expert" there, and when I said that there would be no deduction, I got some puzzled looks. Sure enough, Sandra Bezic noted, "It won't affect the mark."

A fall only gets a deduction off the technical mark (first set you see) if it happens during one of the required elements (jumps, lifts, spins, footwork). A fall means a deduction off the second mark, presentation, if it disrupts the flow or choreography of the program. A funny thing about skating is that if you aren't attempting anything when you fall, and you manage to pick yourself up quickly without missing a beat, the deduction is very small, if they take anything off at all.

Since Sale and Pelletier had already come to the end of their skate, the fall didn't disrupt anything. It also helps that the mood of the program was fun and whimsical, so the pratfall kind of fit right in. If the Russians had fallen like that at the end of their program, it probably would have meant a minor deduction.

[quote]Originally posted by Jim at Outsports:
One question: Was with some friends and had the skating on in the background with no sound. Looked like the Canadians fell (the guy seemed to mouth ``f**k!'' to his partner as they lay on the ground) yet they got high scores. Can someone explain (I'm no skating expert).

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A fall isn't a bad as people make it out to be (except in ice dancing). It's really bad if its done during a footwork sequence or a jump because you have to get those elements in and can be a 0.3 or 0.4 deduction. But if you get the required elements in and fall during some insignificant part of the program, judges usually overlook it. ALthough I think the difference between first and second was due to that fall. The judges might have taken a 1/10th of a point off to give them second place. Another way to look at it is that they fell after they completed their programs and the music stopped, so its possible the judges may have considered the fall invalid (though its difficult to ignore it).


I would have given the nod the S/P if they hadnt fallen. THe long is a different story. Probably B/S if they skate perfectly. Zhen and Zhao can do all the flashy tricks but their skating basics are relatively bad. The judges arent going to fall for it even with the 4 salchow. The gold will go the the well rounded skaters. Their presentation is much better this year thought but I really want Ina and Zimmerman to get that bronze.

Thanks Savvy! Anytime you want some NFL pointers let me know!

To answer BoSoxRudy, Sale and Pelletier will skate "Love story" in the long program. The choice was made easy after they skated badly the other one at the nationals. They usually skate Love Story very well, it is emotional and it has a good choregraphy. The crowd should love it.

If they skate it perfectly I think Sale/Pelletier will win gold. (I hope so!) The Russians second and the Chinese third.

It's time to end the more than 30 year dominance of this event Olympic event by the Russians!

I never watch ice skating exept for the olympics. But the pairs were cool. Jamie and David from Canada were my favorites, even before they fell. Davids pretty hot, looks like a baseball player in the face. Hope he falls on me next time. minus the skates.

[quote]Originally posted by Zeno:
If they skate it perfectly I think Sale/Pelletier will win gold. (I hope so!) The Russians second and the Chinese third.

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If the Chinese can put a decent spin on the ice, they have as much a shot at the gold as the Canadians and Russians. Personally I find the Russians a bit dull. Certainly they are extremely technically proficient, but they don't inspire me. And remember, they have a tendency to self destruct in the long program.

I agree with Lev Stone, the leading Russian pair (B&S), was by far the best in the short program. Not to mention his ass, should get them major bonus points, butterscotch tight pants and all.

David Pelletier is extremely sexy on the ice, but Sale is just too Celine Dion freaky for me with all of her over excitability and pushiness. You just know that phoney lipstick print on his costume in the short program was her idea ("keep away boys, his straight!").

No one mentioned the other Chinese pair (they're both 17 years old) that received a standing ovation from the crowd. Their engery was so exciting.

Of course I'm pulling for Ina/Zimmerman too, if Prince Charming can just crank his triple around.

Overall, a very solid short for everyone, and an exciting free skate tonight. The Russians (B&S) skate more elegantly, and that is most often rewarded by international judges who lean toward the classic style of skating. However, the Russian team has had unexpected problems at other major competitions. They have to skate very well tonight.

The Chinese team in 3rd may try something very interesting tonight. They have been working on a quad throw salchow. I saw them trying it in practice this morning (on television) and it is huge. However, she could not stick the landing. (If we were thrown half-way across the rink and asked to land on one foot, we would find it hard too!!) If they do it tonight and it is clean, that will be a huge thing. I am not sure if it will be huge enough. Depends on the rest of their program.

Ina and Zimmerman skated well, but need to be even better tonight. I would love to see them medal, but it looks like it will be tough. They do not even get to skate in the last group (only top four teams), which would help them with the judges.

Looking forward to it. Also, the men skate their short program tomorrow night. That will be an interesting competition as well.

Personally, I was kinda disappointed in the coverage of the pairs' short program. I think they only showed 7 pairs. I remember when they showed almost every pair, even the ones who are not contenders. What happened with the Freanch pair, Abitbol and Bernadis? I didn't see them at all.

As far as the performances went, I think the placings were pretty much correct. The Russians should be in first and the Canadians in second, then the Chinese. I am pulling for Sale and Pelletier though. I just hope Sale doesn't let her nerves get in the way again. And David is waaay too hot.

Since Sale & Pelletier actually got slightly higher presentation marks than Berezhnaya & Sikhuralidze (S&P 6 5.8's and 3 5.9's; B&S 7 5.8's and 2 5.9's), it looks like the judges took no deduction for the pratfall at the end of their program. S&P lost on the required elements mark (S&P 2 5.6's, 4 5.7's, and 3 5.8's; B&S 2 5.7's and 7 5.8's). If I had to guess, I'd say S&P lost it on footwork because the other elements pretty much balance out. B&S's footwork was far more complicated with better edging and perfect unison while S&P's footwork sequence was pretty short and had a lot of simple forward stroking. Scott Hamilton noted that it was "shallow" and there would probably be a deduction. The higher presentation mark bodes well for S&P, however, in the free skate, where the 2nd mark is the tiebreaker.

I don't see Abitbol & Bernadis on the list of entries. Since they did qualify, I guess they must be out with injury.

I enjoyed the Pairs skating very much. I think that the Canadians have a great chance. I, too, like Ina and Zimmerman. Great legs on him! Were those leather skating pants? Grrrr

As for the coverage, we here in Seattle can get the cable CBC coverage from Vancouver. It is MUCH BETTER than the NBC coverage.

Ina and Zimmerman were awesome. That was one of the finest programs I've ever seen from an American pair.

All this talk about Zimmerman I thought that Canadian skater was one nice looking hunk of man

I could not agree with Lev Stone more, the Americans were so inspiring tonight. The Canadians were good, but I just don't like Jamie Sale. The Russians were not as good as they were in the short program. I only wish the Americans had skated a better short program so they could've skated in the last group.

I feel like watching figure skating is an excercise in futility. S&P deserved the gold. Ina and Zimemrman deserved the bronze.

So why were both of them screwed royally?

Wow, what can I say? I thought Ina & Zimmerman were clearly better than Totmianina & Marinin, and certainly Sale & Pelletier were superior to Berezhnaya & Sikhuralidze. But there must be something to that Russian style, line, and choreography that I'm not seeing. Another possibility is that "it" isn't there.

When it came out that S&P were skating to "Love Story", the decision really divided their fans. Everyone loves Love Story because it's a real crowd-pleaser, but "Orchid" is the more complex and technically difficult program. I do concede that B&S's program tonight was the most exquisitely choreographed pairs free skate I've ever seen, even better than Mishketounek (sp?) & Dimitriev's classic LP. But B&S just didn't skate that well tonight - Anton's stepout on the SBS 2x's and shakey landings on both throw jumps. S&P, on the other hand, skated perfectly. I logged onto the FSWorld message boards just now, and as expected, there are literally thousands of posts by fans distraught over the decision.

What really breaks your heart is the sight of Jamie and David backstage. They made a brave show of it in the Kiss & Cry, but afterward both of them broke down. Team Canada (coaches, commentators) were desperately trying to console them, but what can one possibly say that would make it any better?

Because I watch ice skating like once every four years I too get caught up in the immediacy of the event. It sure seemed wrong what happened tonight. But then I don't know enough to say the Russians were better than the Canadians, or the Americans skated fifth.

I wish we could see one whole event start to finish, with all competitors. Guess I have to go to Turin in 2006!

I'm appalled by what transpired tonight. First a Russian pair skate a slow, uninspired, technically flawed program and are rewarded with higher marks than Ina and Zimmerman. Then, with the announcers and spectators all rightfully assuming that Sales and Pelletier had won gold, the Russians are declared the winners, despite four - FOUR! - imperfections in their program. I agree with the NBC announcer tonight who said she was embarrased for her sport.

The announcer who said that was Sandra Bezic, a famed choreographer (she did most of Kristi Yamaguchi's amateur programs). She is Canadian though, not that this means anything.

As for me, I feel sick. I haven't felt this sick about figure skating since Michelle Kwan was robbed in Nagano. Or when Torvil and Dean were robbed in Lillehammer.

And by the way, the judges didn't do the Russians any favors either. B&S have live knowing they were not the better skaters, had a flawed performance, the decision will forever be a source of controvery, that the crowd didn't care for them, they had to witness their peers being robbed, and their victory is tarnished. How do you enjoy a win like that?

[ February 11, 2002: Message edited by: Lev Stone ]

I am so frightened for Michelle Kwan right now. For those who don't know, Michelle Kwan, who skated with 2 more triple jumps than Irina Slutskaya got royally screwed at the GPF a couple months ago with a 5-4 or 4-3 split as well(You can just guess how the East Europeans voted)


B/S did NOT deserve the gold medal. I do believe they are the best figure skating pair in the world, but not tonight. Their line and edging is beautiful, but almost all of their throws had shakey landings, one with a really bad tilted edge, not to mention Anton's two footing of that triple jump. Did you guys see the judge shaking his head after the results?

You just know that the ISU's investigation of the decision will just consist of making the judges fill out a report on their scoring, and then put in on file. In other words, they'll ignore it.

I do also feel bad for B/S. Especially when you could see the tears in Anton's eyes after the respectful reception he got and the relief that the audience did not jeer at him.

And Ina and Zimmerman atleast deserved fourth in not third.

[ February 12, 2002: Message edited by: savvy ]

Yep...I saw the head shaking by the judge. He definitely knew it was a bad decision. But just wait for the ice dance competition. Hopefully Bourne and Kraatz will skate as well as they did at the Grand Prix final. And better yet, I hope they get judged well for it. I do hope that the Italian team doesn't win with that God awful "I Will Survive" program.

Woody:

[quote] Hopefully Bourne and Kraatz will skate as well as they did at the Grand Prix final. And better yet, I hope they get judged well for it.

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Bourne & Kraatz are toast. Everyone knows the dance is a total fix, and apparently there is neither a Canadian nor a U.S. judge for that event either.

As for Sale & Pelletier: We was robbed!

Canmark:

I do feel for Sale and Pelletier. You're totally right about being robbed. I do hope you're wrong about no American or Canadian judges for the ice dance. If not, Bourne and Kraatz will be the next ones cheated. What is it about the North Americans that they (the judges) won't let them win?

I'm disappointed that Sale and Pelletier will not be defending their world title in Nagano this month... In a way I was hoping to see them perform one more time in the 'amateur' field without any controversy this time around. Now, I wouldn't be surprised if they turn 'pro', now they have an undeniable reputation among fans...