Your senators should probably hear from you IF YOU EVER WANT TO SPEAK FREELY AGAIN.

- Christian Science Monitor

If we ever speak freely again, the terrists will have won.

[ December 14, 2005, 06:20 PM: Message edited by: twin58 ]

Remember to turn on the tap when you are speaking freely, you never know who is listening.

This is a very sad day in the history of this nation...all courtesy of the Rethuglicans currently running this nation into the ground. You're doing one heck of a job, Bushie!

Let me introduce you to the facts -- they're an amazing thing.

Yesterday's vote on agreeing to the Conference Report reauthorizating the PATRIOT Act (H.R. 3199) was 251-174 with 9 not voting. Among those 251 voting aye, are 44 DEMOCRATS (18 Republicans voted nay). Without the support of those 44 Democrats, the conference report would have failed.

FINAL VOTE RESULTS FOR ROLL CALL 627 (H.R. 3199)

It seems that those people you believe are running the country into the ground are doing it with the help of the Democrats.

That's right Penn, every Democrat in Congress calls me first before casting their vote. I'll just bet you never realized I have that kind of power. Give me a friggin' break. If you can't see that this country is in trouble, you are one of many sheep that is responsible for running this nation into the ground. Grow a pair and open your eyes.

PS4E is certainly correct that the Democlicans have aided Bush in his radical aims far too often.

They would be the ones I would consider to be Repug.-lite, which include the likes of Joe Lieberman in my book.

Partiot Act renewal fails as only 52 Senators vote in favor of renewal. 60 votes were needed to renew it.

[ December 16, 2005, 09:34 AM: Message edited by: FireMikeTiceNow ]

Yeah, and guess who is going off on the Dems??? None other than Mr. Scott McClellan, blaming them for all the ills of the world, and this one too. He needs to be slapped with a reality check here! Like hello Scott, what did your administration to regarding the 9/11 recommendations, and the followup report that just came out, with grades that were mostly F's?????
I have to OH THE HYPOCRISY!!!!! :

Today's Senate vote was on ending debate (cloture), not on the substantive measure. The result may be the same in the end, although I suspect that no Senator of either party will let the Act lapse (even Feingold is not opposed to renewal in principal, but not the version as it appears in the conference report).

For what it's worth, four Republicans backed the filibuster: Chuck Hagel (Neb.), Lisa Murkowski (Alaska), John Sununu (N.H.) and Larry Craig (Idaho).

Two Democrats voted to end the filibuster: Tim Johnson (S.D.) and Ben Nelson (Neb.). I noted that Rep. Stephanie Herseth (D-SD) voted in favor in the House -- watch for her to take on John Thune in 5 years. She is young, attractive, and importantly, VERY smart.

You can read the conference report to H.R. 3199 on Thomas -- the Library of Congress website.

Hey, remember the odious USA Patriot Act that expanded surveillance under Bush/Cheney, and that candidate Obama claimed he wanted to "reform"? Well a vote of cloture in the Senate just moved it toward extension, 74-8. Glenn Greenwald (the best political columnist currently working) nails the problem: bipartisanship, ie, little difference between the two corporate-fattened parties on the most important issues.

http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_gr...ship/index.html

Truer words...

So true.

Go to OpenSecrets.org & you'll see most of the Dems (including Obama!) have whored themselves out to corporations (we're "people" too!) just as badly as the Republicans have.

And we wonder why our nation has so many problems?

America: We're about as corrupt as a Banana Republic!

The vote to support the so-called "Patriot Act" was compared in its lopsidedness to that of any bill that is said to support Israel.

The connection is not a superficial one, nor is it coincidental.

If the same financial backers who claim unflinching support for Israel were to find it in their interest not to support the PA then I seriously doubt it would have passed.

Should those same laws allowing government invasion of privacy be used against the gangsters in the financial market - prompting them to contact their friendliest Senator or Representative I think support for it would decline precipitously.

However it is the average individual who is most likely to have his or her privacy rights violated.

Personally I have little fear of privacy invasion under the current administration. But should the Republicans manage to regain power I have little doubt that the new president would find justification for imposing a Mubarak-type security blanket over anyone deemed politically challenging. How will the POTUS's use the PA?

You're naive, then. All presidents use whatever power is handed them.

Obama signed the extension after saying he'd reform the law as a candidate. Once again, A LIAR.

Rather than simply casting aspersions Bill W you may want to consider the actual abuses of power by George W. Bush as compared to those alleged to Barack H. Obama.

Even using only the publicly available data would produce a considerably longer list for GWB in my opinion.

The executive executes the law. Who heads the executive is critical.

Considering it's far worse than under the previous administration, your stance doesn't surprise me in the least. Obama could eat puppies and little children for breakfast and you'd accept or excuse such behavior.




Hey! At least he did so via an auto-pen.

Extremist comparisons do not prove a point, whether they are used by the right or the left. Neither of you, CC or Bill W has presented a single case of abuse of his power by Barack Obama.

Which power of office has he abused so far? Which were abused by former presidents?

Would we be less or more safe without the Patriot Act?

Do these questions matter to either of you?

Are you familiar with Ben Franklin's view that those who would trade liberty for security deserve neither?

Yes, the FBI, NSA and CIA are telling me every day what they're doing with their expanded powers...

Congress still has its powers. It only has to exercise them. We still have a right to petition them. We only have to exercise that.

If Congress has been bought by those who would restrict or override our rights then their are ways we can try to fight that.

Obama can not exercise our right to restrict his behavior. We have to.