I am still in shock over the whole thing.

I'm begging everyone to write their senators and congressperson to let them know how you feel.

Even if you know that they're in favor of banning gay marriage, make them say that.

Take the time out of your day posting on this board or doing whatever to write them.

Unfortunately, it does not help for me to write my federal representatives - I don't have any, other than a non-voting delegate in the House. However, I have written to straight friends and family members across the country, asking them to write to their representatives.

Here is another way...





“I believe a marriage is between a man and a woman. And I think we ought to codify that one way or the other. And we've got lawyers looking at the best way to do that.”


-President George W. Bush
July 30, 2003 Press Conference


When asked his views on homosexuality in a July 30 press conference, President Bush stated "we're all sinners”. He went on to indicate his support for building further discrimination against gay and lesbian couples into law. The time to act is now!


1. First, sign the pettion for marriage equality—tell the president that you disagree with him on this issue. As the debate on marriage equality grows louder, we need your help every step of the way.

2. Tell your friends!—If you have already signed the petition, thank you, now we need you to spread the word.

3. Support HRC—our opponents are already outspending us. Fight back. Please, make a "Wedding Gift" in honor of our struggle for marriage equality.


BE HEARD! Join the Million for Marriage movement today!



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thanks p2insdca for the HRC link

Dont worry guys, Im sure Log Cabin will have this under control in no time. You know they have soooooo much influence with Bush.

This may have been previously posted but it's a good reminder that knowing someone gay who is close to you can make a difference even in the most conservative circles.

From Vice President Dick Cheney as qoted in a Philadelphia Inquirer article:

I'm sure he'll switch to the "proper" rhetoric soon enough, Lesbian daughter be damned.

the amendment now has 75 co-sponsors in the house

I wouldn't be surprised it it hits 100 by next week.

Get those letters out.

I also suggest writting CNN, your local papers AND state officials

John from "The List" and dontamend.com have provided a way:

Use the link below to sign an online
pledge to OPPOSE any political candidate, of any political party, who supports adding anti-gay prejudice to the US Constitution:

http://thelist.c.tclk.net/maabjtIaaZzqNb4EetEb/

Me either. One of my senators is George Allen. He'd probably like nothing better than to beat me to death with a baseball bat for the good of the country.

[ August 01, 2003, 12:15 PM: Message edited by: twin58 ]

I appluaded Cheney when he made this remark, I remember it very well. Problem is, that was 3 years ago - I guess his boss Karl Rove wont let me stray from the approved talking points. To bad Cheney cant come out of his bunker and make a similiar statement today.

thanks Bryan for the link


and for the rest of you who don't think that your letter would matter--make the bastards take a stand on the issue. Too many of them are going to try and wiggle out of it. Anyway, who knows--you may change someone's opinion.

[ August 01, 2003, 02:05 PM: Message edited by: theodoresdaddy ]

Thanks for the link, I have gone on line and signed, now I am going to copy the link and email to everybody I know.

I find it interesting who is and who is not posting on this topic.....

I'm not sure what conclusions you've drawn, but maybe people are on vacation and not reading the message board as they usually do.

BTW, signed the petition and HRC's Million-for-Marriage petition as well.

I sent Kay Bailey Hutchison an e-mail, but there seems to be a problem with Cornyn's site ("in transition") and attempts to send keep failing. Much the way I feel about my wishes and these Texas Senators. :mad:

Beachjock no, they are posting away on other topics...just not this one, just like other take action ones.
Hornfan, wow I guess that is fighting an uphill battle. I think that the on line pettions maybe the way to go for you as well. But my hats off to you for writting to them.

You know...

I'll take some heat for this, but i dont see anything wrong with W's position. In Fact, i solute him for standing ground, but not going over-board. Unlike previous administrations, you know where he stands.

I man not agree with his position, but i respect his right to have that opinion.

I dont even see what he said as wrong. I think it has been twisted into being worse than it is. You see, he just said "sinners" in general and said everyone is a sinner. Which we all are.

by W saying he would support the whatever law or ammendment... blah blah... it doesnt mean much at all cause it will never happen. If you read his statements, it sounds like he's saying.. live and let live. Dont go overboard as a anti-gay... dont go overboard as being pro-gay. Honesty.

go head and cry bloody murder now.

Actually, PF, you may be right. Initially, I bristled at his "we're all sinners" comment, but then began to see it as a direct answer to those who have been screaming at him about the "immoral homos". He's basically telling them to get over it and tend to their own "sins". The "lawyers are looking into it" comment was a sop to the same constituency.

I also agree that an amendment is highly unlikely to happen. Of course, we need to be involved in seeing that it doesn't, because it will be debated. We need to address people's honestly-felt concerns about gay civil marriage, and present them with positive arguments and examples, not just get all strident about it, as some organizations may tend to do.

[ August 01, 2003, 05:15 PM: Message edited by: redsoxbreath ]

PhillyFan, No heat from me regarding your post, IMO he did address the question, and since he was rather middle of the road, I can not throw ( too many) stones.
The 2 point I do disagree with you on is
1) I was (some what) offended by the we are all sinners...but I am a bit touching on this for other reasons not directly related to this topic.
2) I think there is some chance of the ammendmet, the Ma ruling will have some bearing on that. I think IF the house passes and it makes its way out of the senate we could be in real trouble. Based on that I encourage everybody to write/sign as a bit of a preemptive strike on our part.

P2, i have a problem with one thing in the gay movement and that is this...

NO ONE IS ALLOWED TO SAY ANYTHING THAT DOES NOT FIT THEIR THINKING. If you do, you are a homophobe. No matter what anyone says, as a republican, it is taken as anti-gay...

This is a middle of the road statement which is consistant with everything W has done in the past.

I'll say it again, give me a W any day of the week. You know where he stands, rather than say an ex president who would say they love you to your face, then sell you out for some votes... and we all know that is true.

W does the same thing. He has said he didn't want to politicize people's sexual orientation, but here he is doing it again, just as he did when he said he would veto an attempt to repeal Texas sodomy laws.

Phillyfan, HUH?
You said "NO ONE IS ALLOWED TO SAY ANYTHING THAT DOES NOT FIT THEIR THINKING. If you do, you are a homophobe. No matter what anyone says, as a republican, it is taken as anti-gay..."
I did not call Mr Bush a Homophobe, I said I did not like the we are all sinners, but admitted I have issues with this out side this topic ( being catholic)
Regarding the honesty issue, I do not think Mr. Bush is 100% truthfull ( I do not think any one in Washington is) Nor do I think Mr. Clinton is a 100% dishonest.IMO I think Mr Bush is worse, I know you feel just the opposite I think on this point we can agree to disagree- correct?
I do think there are more people in the republican party that are actively against gays having equal rights, where as I think the are a fair number of people in the Democratic party who don't care one way or the other by will vote based on what is good for their skin. I am not sure which I view as the greater evil

I DID sign the petition and I DARE PhillyFan to do the same. Come on man, nobody is going to take the hinges off your closet door if you click on the link and sign your ass up like you KNOW you should. It's the (very) least you can do after supporting W. no matter how hard he slaps you around.

If not for me (your favorite Cowboys Fan), do it for Dick Cheney's daughter (the Lesbian one, not the breeder). wink

I am pretty lucky with my national reps- for Senators I have Debbie Stabenow and Carl Levin, and my Congressman I have his brother Sander Levin. All are fairly gay friendly... all Dems of course.

I'd rather not. Click on the link to be redirected to http://www.c/campaigns/votepledge/

The privacy policy says:

Maybe, but what does Ipetitions.com do with the info? Nothing?

http://samspade.org/t/lookat?a=Ipetitions.com says:

So let's go to http://samspade.org/t/lookat?a=balic.com .

Novalidemail@stargate.com? What an unusual e-mail address. All those Hotmail addresses and none at Balic.com also raise doubts.

I don't like that the traceroutes disappear into a fake rDNS and a string of DNS errors.

Further, since when is 212 a telephone exchange in California? The USPS does, however, verify the nine-digit ZIP for 747 Delores Street.

Ladies and gentlemen, do as you wish.

Well here's a very safe way to make your voice heard especially for the point and click crowd.

It's easy:

http://www.senate.gov/index.htm

http://www.house.gov/


No matter your political affiliation, please support your Gay Brothers and Sisters.

[ August 02, 2003, 09:20 AM: Message edited by: HornFan ]

I found it both humorous, and perhaps deliberately arrogant, that the President, in the same press conference, proposed outlawing gay marriage and campily referred to Rice as "fabulous".

I think both VP Cheney and President Bush are simply shallow insensitive opportunists. Cheney's sympahty for his daughter and Bush's religious convictions are authentic. But their logic is flawed and their motives seem to be material gain and power. The usual selfishness.

I still find it ludicrous that anyone feels the need to defend and define marriage. How exactly would gay marriage threaten anyone, besides their religious convictions which are allowed and to differ under the laws of the United States?

"We're all sinners." Since everything fun in life is considered a sin by religious folk, I say: sin away! :cool:

I find it mystifying and disgusting everytime I hear the "praising" of bigots for letting there views be known. Should Hitler then have been praised for at least "letting us know" that he hated jews and gays? Come on! Comment on what they say and not that they said what hate was in their heart. And pleeeaaase, when asked a question about gays and his first words out of his mouth is about sinners, I am truly offended and disgusted.

Im not sure why you think you would take heat. In this case you're being totally consistent - W does nothing wrong, ever, no matter what he does there is some way to spin it that it's ok.

As far as the "sinners" thing, I think the thing that bothers alot of us is that when asked about homosexuality the first thought that came to his mind was "sinners" that was the first thing he said, but hey, thats ok too, right?

raze: thats true, with your comments about sinners. The other thing about the right wing that makes me angry is the "what next" question they always need to ask, in this case we, meaning gays and lezbians are compared to pedophiles, or beastiality is mentioned. Why must they always bring these things up? Maybe because they don't know any better.

Chances of an amendment passing? Remote.

The legal effect of an amendment passing? Monumental. Why?

Once an amendment passes, it allows the Supreme Court to base future cases on said amendment.

This could place at great risk the small gains in "civil union" recognitions in some states and municipalities. The amendmanet won't simply prevent future freedoms; it could be used as a tool to roll back what meager steps have been taken in recent years.

Of course, all this is mental mastrubation - to attempt an amendment would be foolish unless POTUS is convinced he can win. To try and fail would look very bad indeed. I don't believe POTUS has enough political capital at present to pull this off, which is why I think they'll stick to treating the issue via normal legislation.

I have my opinions, and I base them on what I believe is right or wrong, not just to follow along with some herd mentality, but I can't remember if I've ever written a letter to an elected official. I guess I always felt it would be a waste of time and energy. But after reading the title of this thread, I decided, 'well why not?' and typed up a letter to my house rep (Beauprez) and one of my senators (Campbell, because at least he used to be a Democrat and I hope he hasn't completely forgotton those of us who voted for him the first time). It felt good to get my feelings out on paper.