For all you Rush Apologist: Do you bother to take into consideration that McNabb was offended and "shocked" by Rush's remarks when stating your opinion? If so, how do you continue to stand behind Rush without admitting to being a mindless Rush ditto head?

I don't think ESPN made a wise choice in Rush, I did not tune in to find out, but I'm glad he's gone.

fantomas is exactly right, sports commentary should be left to guys who are experts, either through devoting their lives to the sport itself. Irvin is an expert, he has lived the sport, so his opinions should be important. Don't like his personal life, but I am there to hear about football. The Dennis Millers and Rushes should stick to comedy and political commentary. If you find an articulate sports guy who is also funny, great.

Dr. Laura would make a great replacement for Rush Limbaugh at ESPN. NOT!! At least Rush had the ballz to speak his mind. That is more than I can say for the mealy-mouthed commentators like Steve Young and the other ESPN commentators who were too scared and "chicken" to tell Rush he was perhaps a tad bit out of line.

I actually thought TJ got upset at him. Then he held back.... funny. I think TJ would take out rush, heh...

Once again, i think if you forget his politics.. look at the show... and what he brought, opinion. He would have been perfect for the show. I think they should try it with someone else next year.

Well, he's gone, but here's a bit more on his history of comments about black people and people of color:

FAIR: Limbaugh, a man who has a problem with color?

Originally posted by MIB:

Of course Razor believes this, as it was originally revealed by Razor's bible, The National Enquirer.


The only time I check out the National Enquirer is if the line at the grocery story is real long, but hey MIB you might want to switch over to the NE, they seem to be more accurate than your sources.

I've read that ratings for the games themselves are up so far this year. I don't know about the ratings for the Fox and CBS shows, but if they're up as well then that indicates more of an interest in the NFL itself, not an increase because of Limbaugh.

Well, I DID see a headline today that said "Osama and Saddam's gay wedding." It was accompanied by a picture of the two, one in a wedding dress.

It could have been your other impeachable source, razie, The Weekly World News.

Every once in a while, if I'm feeling particularly masochistic, I'll try to stomach a few minutes of his show, but that's all I can stand. I don't see how Al Franken managed to listen to so much before writing Rush Limbaugh Is A Big Fat Idiot, nor to watch so much Fox News prior to the new book Lies. Which is a wonderful book, by the way...

Does Rush have the right to say what he wants? Sure. We all do. Am I sorry he resigned/got fired/whatever? No freakin' way. I'm a little worried, however, that all the media attention he's getting out of these stories is just going to add to his popularity and not, as I would prefer, be the last straw for millions of people who are ready to start thinking for themselves for a change.

Go ahead; try to find any other paper that's done as good a job covering the batboy story.

Speaking of blood-sucking mammals that live in a cave:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/artic...-2003Sep28.html

This whole story bugs me because it's so clearly spawned by a bunch of people who don't want Rush Limbaugh there who have taken some of his comments and blown them out of context and out of proportion.

I love how this post is titled, "big fat idiot..." oh yes, we're incredibly open-minded here.

For those of you who think Rush is such a racist, did you know that Rush used to have Alan Keyes sit in for him when he was on vacation? If he's a racist, he must be a blind one.

For those of you who say he wasn't worthy of the position - consider that he had a stint with the Kansas City Royals in the early 80s; and, when MNF was looking for a third man (when they eventually hired Dennis Miller), Al Michaels said he was very impressed with Rush's ability and knowledge of football.

With some of the jokers who presently preside over football on television, he couldn't have been the worst.

[ October 03, 2003, 12:31 AM: Message edited by: Cyd at Outsports ]

Cyd: Cmon now, this is just ridiculous, how can you say that Rush's comment isnt racist. If anything the media has been looking for White athletes to put up there and idolize even though they dont have much talent, a perfect example would be Jason Williams of the Grizzlies, formerly Kings. What about Dilfer getting the superbowl promo for DisneyLand?? He obviously wasnt even close to 2nd most talented person on that Raven team. Maybe I could understand just a little bit, if he had chosen someone like Shaun King. But not with the extreme talent and ability of McNabb.

As for Allen Keyes, I'm not even going to go there, from what I've seen of that character, you may as well be a kiss ass punk for the 700 club and Pat Robertson's crusade against the evil gay agenda.

I admit I dont listen or watch Rush much, but what I do know about him is that he is an elitist who laughs at minorities who want to compete on equal ground. And I think this ridiculous statement just exposed him obviously for what he is. Maybe he doesnt even believe he is a racist. But such an obsurd statement like that makes me believe that maybe its time for him and people that think like him to take a good look at themselves and rethink how much of what they believe or know what minorities go through.

Hey, now, back off about Jason Williams -- he's my favorite little basketball-playing smoothie pot-head. Unfortunately, he went to Florida -- the university where they don't know the difference between an alligator and a crocodile.

[ October 03, 2003, 06:02 AM: Message edited by: bobby78751 ]

None of the other Rush defenders will answer this, maybe Cyd will - if he did nothing wrong, why resign?????

Razorback, he resigned because he knew he was going to get fired because of his racist comments. Rush Limbaugh had to learn the hard way that radio and television are 2 different mediums. On his radio show, he can say whatever he want to his targeted close-minded audience.

Television, however, is a different medium. What is swept under the rug on his radio show will not go over so well on television. He has a prosperous career as a host of talk radio, but his short-lived career as a television sports commentator is over. The one good thing to come of all this is that no sports station will ever hire this joker again. Out of sight. Out of mind.

[ October 03, 2003, 07:09 AM: Message edited by: Nascar007 ]

There is an excellent commentary from Thomas Boswell, Washington Post sports commentator, about the story:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/artic...3-2003Oct2.html

I especially like his quote: "The level of sophistication that we should, perhaps, bring to politics, we do, in fact, bring to talk of power forwards and quarterbacks." In other words, in politics you can spin anything because most people don't follow it from day to day, but don't f*** with football, where everyone who watches the sport has a certain level of expertise, that you can't spin unless you REALLY know what you are talking about.

Rush's comments are especially funny given that, arguably of course, 2 of the best qbs in football, McNair and Vick, are african american, and there are, to use Boswell as a source, 7 starters and 2 hurt starters in the NFL. Why would "the liberal media", I guess the liberal sports media, if is such a thing, try to protect an underachieving black quarterback when there are so many out there? Just shows you can't use political agendas to apply to sports.

Also, it is interesting that those who support Rush's right to make those statements have not also said he was right. Because he was not right, he was stupid.

Posted by Cyd:

Hardly fair. Only one person started this thread and therefore titled it. To lump us all together as closed minded is, well, closed minded.


I'm with you on the fact that alot of the others are glad to be rid of Rush just to see Rush fall. However many of us are glad he's gone because he was a distraction on the ESPN show. Just because someone is a football fan does not mean they know what they are talking about. I mean, you have read soem of the posts in the Pro Football forum on this board, haven't you? wink

His "stint" with the Royals had nothing to do with baseball itself. Wasn't he in advertising sales or marketing? Hardly makes him a football expert. As for Al Michaels being impressed, I think you'd have a hard time getting Michaels to go on the record saying anything bad about Charles Manson if he'd auditioned. These TV personalities/actors are constantly going on and on about how fabulous their peers are that you can't take anything they say seriously. I mean, what's he going to say, "Oh well Rush was just dreadful"?

Regarding Rush's statement/comment/opinion about the over-promoting of black QB's by the media, I've read that there are around 19. Other than Michael Vick and Donovan McNabb, which ones have been the beneficiaries of this liberal media bias? Kordell Stewart, Daunte Culpepper, Jeff Blake, Charlie Batch, Rodney Peete, Shaun King, Akili Smith, Tony Banks, Aaron Brooks and Quincy Carter have all received more than their fair share of criticism. Is this the same liberal media that has been accused of propping up over hyped/rated white NBA players?

[ October 03, 2003, 07:38 AM: Message edited by: George_vikingfan ]

George is right. Rush worked in marketing for the Royals. I don't see how that would make him a football expert. Rush on ESPN was clearly out of his league, no pun intended. Everyone knew that foul-ass mouth of his would get him into trouble sooner or later, everyone except ESPN.

Rush is scheduled to be back on the air on the radio today, for the first time since the debacle. I'm halfway tempted to tune just to see what, if anything, he says about it, and to see if he takes any calls on the issue. But given the new developments with the drug investigation, maybe he won't be on afterall.

Rush said the fact that there was such an uproar about his comments proves he's right. So by the same token, the fact that people think Rush is a racist must prove they're right about him.

Now he'll run back to his radio show and take calls from only his dittoheads, since we know that they'll cut off anyone who tries to challenge him. He won't stand and actually try and defend his position. He'll just continue to blame "the liberal media." Look in the mirror, Rush, and face the fact: you're a pussy.

(Apologies to those offended by that word, but it just fits so well.)

I wonder if McNabb ends up on the Bengals as a back-up Quarterback in a couple years, how many people that posted here, would have the guts to say "Geez, Rush was right!"

Like Cyd so boldly noticed, people took what was said, spun it in a way to fuel their hatred of him, and used it to stir up a racially divided country.

Not One person wanted to comment on WHY there are not more black coaches in the NFL. Each one of you ignored the fact that 80% of all quarterbacks in the NFL are white, when there are 1650 african-american players, compared to 550 anglo.

I find it hard to beleive, that the posters on this board...the obvious 100% left wing supporters, aren't up in arms by the lack of star black quarterbacks or head coaches in the NFL. You don't want to tackle the issue that in a league that is over 70% black, the coaching fraternity is 80% white.

Art Shell, Dennis Green, even Ray Rhodes who has received accolades everywhere for his defense, sit on the sidelines getting passed over for job after job...yet you give a LOSER, retread like Erickson the head coaching position in SF?

It wasn't the message that got Rush the axe...it was the fact he was the messenger.

I wish DMAC all the success, and hope last weeks performance is what we will get for years to come.
A few more weeks like the first two tho, and he'll become the next Tony Banks...then Rush would have been 100% correct in everything he said, yet will no longer have a job.

In closing, I too, am glad he's gone. I'm far from a Rush Fan. He didn't belong on the show. But he was alot more accurate with what he said than what you are giving him credit for, political affiliations aside.

Meatman, I understand your points about the shortage of black QBs and coaches. I just don't get how they tie into what Limbaugh said.

If McNabb fails it will only show that McNabb is overrated. It will not prove Limbaugh's assertion that McNabb is overrated by a liberal media because he's black.

I think most will agree that there is a serious lack of black head coaches in the NFL. But Rush's comments had nothing to do with being outraged over the lack of black QBs or coaches. In fact to me they were quite to the contrary. How does a black QB being overrated and undeseving of his job translate into outrage over a lack of black QBs? Seems to me he was saying there is one-too-many black starting QBs.

I agree with you meatman....
This article was writen back in Mid-Sept before this whole "incident"...


Ripping on Eagles quarterback Donovan McNabb now is like being that last kid to take a shot during a fight after one of your friends has already put the other guy on the ground.

"There, take that."

That's piling on, too easy and not entirely fair. So as an explanation to this column on the most overrated players in the league, here's a preface: McNabb was the choice as the most overrated player before his Stink at the Linc on Sunday. McNabb was awful in the Eagles' 31-10 loss to the Patriots, which dropped the Eagles to a surprising 0-2 heading into their bye week.

Donovan McNabb's passer rating is a dreadful 41.1 through two games. (AP)

McNabb is still a good player, despite his pedestrian numbers from the first two games. He's just not a great one.

And that's why he earns the Most Overrated Player Award.

On most player ranking lists heading into the season, McNabb was ranked in the top 15-20 players. One had him as the third-best overall, and he is often considered one of the top three or four quarterbacks.

That's wrong and wrong.

McNabb has never been an accurate passer, doesn't seem comfortable in the pocket and has a tendency to make bad decisions. That is not how you earn high grades as a quarterback.

He does have the ability to run, but he now seems to be trying to stay in the pocket -- actually not a bad thing, since it's safer there -- and that seems to have taken away some of his confidence. He looks too heavy, too sluggish.

In fairness to McNabb, he is hamstrung by bad play-calling, has receivers who can't run or beat man coverage and a running-back-by-committee approach that led to just 11 running plays against the Patriots.

But McNabb isn't doing his part, either.

When he had receivers open Sunday, he missed them high and wide. He looks unsettled as a passer, often short-arming balls and not using proper mechanics. It's hard to believe anyone would put him in their top 100 players, let alone top 10. His passer rating is an awful 41.1 for an 0-2 team that some had pegged for the Super Bowl.

Is this current phase a slump? McNabb says it is, and his coaches are sticking by him.

"It's a team effort," said Eagles coach Andy Reid. "It's not about Donovan. It's about the team. We all need to do better. It's not just Donovan. Please don't point the finger at him. It goes around to everybody."

Try and as he might to defuse the situation, Reid knows better. He knows McNabb is the guy who has to click for the Eagles to win. He still has the ability to be a quality starter, but he isn't -- or will he be -- the superstar that many have him pegged to become.

McNabb -- classy as he always is, which makes him one of the more likeable players in the league -- stood and took his poison after Sunday's game. He never flinched when asked the questions, never fired back at the questioner.

"I point the finger at myself," he said in the no-kidding quote of the year. "You know being the quarterback of this team, if the offense is out there, I'm the one who has to get everything going. I'm the one who has to be accurate with the ball; I have to be the one making the right checks, and make the right reads. I'll never lose confidence in myself. It's just the reality of the whole deal that I'm not playing well. I've been in this thing five years now, and these last two weeks obviously is nowhere near the way I've been playing the last couple years. I have to do is refocus myself, watch some film, maybe watch some team from last year."

McNabb will regroup from his tough start. He's resilient, having bounced back from a broken leg last season to play in the playoffs. He's also a hard worker who probably won't let this get him down.

But something is wrong. When you see fans in Eagles jersey No. 5 -- McNabb's number -- yelling for backup A.J. Feely during a game, there are issues.

To some scouts, McNabb has always been overrated. One recalled giving him a third-round grade coming out of Syracuse. When McNabb was getting all the plaudits, that scout was the one his peers were laughing at.

Now who's doing the laughing?

Donovan McNabb: Good quarterback, but don't even think about using the word great.

Please explain why that was "bold."

Never will happen. He's got a $115-million contract. The Bengals would never pay it.

Ray Rhodes had two head coaching jobs and flopped in both. Dennis Green's Viking teams managed to choke when they made the playoffs.

Rush didn't complain about the lack of black quarterbacks and black coaches. While it's important, it's NOT the issue here. And the issue isn't whether McNabb is overrated or not.

No one should complain if he's called a racist. He's doing the same thing. He basically accused the media of reverse racism--supporting McNabb just because he's black, wanting blacks to succeed.

OK... if you are not happy with the number of black QB's in the league... Why doesnt jesse jackson change this from the bottom up? ie HS football, where players begin to develop their skills for the future. If 90% of HS QB's are white, you should not expect to have 50% of the NFL QB's to be black. You see, by going bottom up, these people dont make headlines by complaining. Same goes for coaches. You have to work your way up. Change does not happen over night.

As you can see... this is slowly changing, it just takes time.

As far as your coaches go... If you think Ray Rhodes deserves another head coaching job, you are NUTZ. You are the blind one. The guy sucked in philly, then GB saw their team taking the same road as philly... and fired him. Black, white, blue or purple.. he sucked. Some guys are bad head coaches, but great def coords. That is ray rhodes. He's not been out of job once, has he?

Dennis Green was up the niner job before mooch got it. However, he wanted more power than the org was willing to give up. There were grumblings all over the place about him going here or there... Green definately would never take a job like say, cincy. He's picky and would only take the right situation.

At the end of the day, i'd be pissed to have a shitty coach merely cause he's black, white, or orange.

[quote]PhillyFan:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by la_meatman:
[qb]At the end of the day, i'd be pissed to have a shitty coach merely cause he's black, white, or orange. [/quote]Wow! I'd like to see an orange person! That would be as awesome as a purple or green one.

He looks pretty orange to me in this picture. wink

Steven Segal

[quote]bobby78751:
[quote]PhillyFan:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by la_meatman:
[qb]At the end of the day, i'd be pissed to have a shitty coach merely cause he's black, white, or orange. [/quote]Wow! I'd like to see an orange person! [/quote]Check out Cameron Diaz in Charlie's Angels: Full Throttle.

Why Dennis Green wasn't fired 30 seconds after the Vikings 42-0 (I think that was the final score) capitulation to the Giants in the playoffs a few years ago ended is a mystery that no detective could solve. The NFL crowd I hang out with, the only thing we could figure is that Green had blackmail photos of Red Coombes with a live boy or a dead girl.

Here's a good take on the Limbaugh situation.

And, just to prove that Rush Limbaugh isn't the only one with foot-in-mouth disease: What a cementhead. In the middle of the Limbaugh flap, he says something like that.

[ October 03, 2003, 03:05 PM: Message edited by: Jim Allen ]

If I am correct, Cyd is the entrepruner behind this site. It is bold, when you make a statement that goes against the vast majority of the readers here. Especially with such a volatile sujbect as Rush Limbaugh.

50 posts later, people still calling Rush a bigot, yet bigots wouldn't allow a BLACK COMMENTATOR to host his own Syndicated RAdio Show now would they.

You guys just hate the messenger so much, you want to twist the quotes to fuel you're hated of him, which really doesn't make you much better than the messenger.

I do not hate rush, infact i agree with him 90% of the time.

The fact that this is the year 2003 and statements like this are still being made without any sensitivity whatsoever, is utterly ridiculous to me!! I am big fan of ESPN, but why they hired this nitwit in the first place is beyond me. They weren't suffering that much in the Sunday morning ratings dept. were they? I am an African American and I have listened to Rush's show before and I can attest to hearing disparaging remarks about minorities(black, hispanic, gays, etc.), women, and other groups in more extreme terms!! He normally does this without little to any backlash! I am very happy that he is no longer on television feeding Americans his filth!!

Some analyst stated that if Rush had just left it at "McNabb is overrated and has not played to his previous abilities" without using the word "black" or that "the media just wants a black quarterback to see a black quarterback in the NFL", he wouldn't have caused such a stir and would still seen on Sunday mornings!! Ya think!!

la_meatman, it is amusing listening to you kiss Cyd's ass. Is that available on D.V.D.? wink As far as Cyd being bold to defend Rush on this website, I disagree. Cyd is the entreprenure behind Outsports. So he knows he can do whatever the hell he wants on this website without any penalties. A bold move you say. I think not.

Smooth Ron is right. Rush should have simply said he thought McNabb was an overrated player. But to add racial overtones to his comments, he must have known there would be some kind of backlash.

I am curious if the Rush defenders would still defend him if he had said something deragatory on national television about GAYS. But since he is picking on a different minority, that makes it O.K. What hypocrites.

[ October 03, 2003, 04:58 PM: Message edited by: Nascar007 ]

"yet bigots wouldn't allow a BLACK COMMENTATOR to host his own Syndicated RAdio Show now would they." (la_meatman)

I always get a good chuckle when I hear lines like that one! It's a clever ploy - Rush can't be a racist cuz heez got a black employee.

I think we all have met a few homophobes in our lifetime and the first thing they'll tell you - "I am not a homophobe - my Uncle (or first cousin, or mailman) is gay!"

Thanx for the laugh!

PhillyFan (God help me) is right about starting from the ground up for black QB's and ESPECIALLY black coaches. How many black coaches are heading up Division 1 football programs today? How many Head Pro football coaches have come up out of the College ranks? Bunches! As sad as it is to look at the calendar and see the year 2004 almost upon us, some things take time.

If Ray Rhodes were hired as the next Cowboys head coach, I'd be just as upset as I was with Barry Switzer. I was NOT a happy camper. (At least Barry won a Super Bowl with Jimmy's team, a feat I'm not sure Rhodes could have accomplished).

Has the "liberal media" caused all of the owners of Pro football teams to sign contracts and spend big bucks with numerous black quarterbacks? NO.

Rush's main mistake was carrying his constant "liberal media conspiracy" whine over into football and adding race into his potion of disaster. Not smart, but I admit he's a hell of a lot richer than me and obviously has some good drugs in his medicine cabinet.

As far Rush scoring brownie points for having Alan Keyes sub on his show? That's like having Andrew Sullivan pinch hit as the "Conservatives of American" (made that up) spokesman. Score one for the gays....not. Now if Rush gives Andrew his show while he's rotting in jail for his hillbilly heroin habit, I might change my tune.

[ October 03, 2003, 06:52 PM: Message edited by: HornFan ]

Pretty big difference in having a minority employee, and turning over an entire listening audience of 50 million complete with an open mic, to another minority. A racist sure as hell wouldn't wouldn't do that.

I find it hillarious I'm defending a man I've been at odds with for years myself. But I'm defending the message, not the messenger.

The majority of you, just want to bash away at him. Fuuny, Michael Irvin, Chris Berman both state "hearing Rush say it" didn't sound, nor even imply racisit. Only after they "read" what was said, did they even think about it.

Probably 1/2 of the people who are so vocal against what was said...didn't see it, nor hear it, and have viewed completely rewritten quotes, ie the clark campaign, or rewritten quotes to the effect that Dononvan is overated because he is black.

Reminds me of what jimmy the Greek said.
Again I have never like Rush, but I do not understand the big deal...

Let's leave Cyd out of this. He's just expressing his opinion, just like everyone else. It has nothing to do with his being a co-founder of Outsports.

posted by Hornfan:
You're totally right on both points Hornfan (and trust me, it creeps me out to agree with Phillyfan as well wink ) but that is actually why Rush's comments were racist (and one can be a racist - believe that people of a certain skin color are, on average, less qualified than people of another skin color - w/out hating every person with the supposedly inferior skin color).

We know that there is a shortage of African-American QBs and coaches in the pro leagues, and the racist interpretation is that blacks are somehow not intelligent enough for either position. But didn't Rush essentially agree with that position? - at least where McNabb was concerned?

Think about it, if McNabb is over-rated (i.e., unqualified for the QB position) and is considered a "great" QB only because the media wants to see blacks succeed, it implies that blacks CANNOT succeed in the role without being shored up.

He is assuming that because there are few black QBs it must be that blacks are not capable of the position. The alternative explanation - that a mixture of racism on the part of coaches when selecting QBs and poorer schooling, which could leave black QBs at a disadvatage at the college and pro levels - would imply that McNabb MUST be qualified to be a QB, because it would be so difficult for any black QB to overcome the obstacles that only a superior athlete could make it.

I, too, shudder when agreeing with Phillyfan, but change takes time. There are about 6 times the number of black quarterbacks now than there were 10 years ago. Same with head coaches. Gradually the system of a glass ceiling is changing. We are moving to a place where the qbs and coaches are judged by their abilities, but clearly based on Rush's comments, we have a ways to go. Normally I am a fan of major affirmative action, but sports is one of the few arenas that is coming close to a level playing field for all people, including african-americans and other ethnic minorities. I hope that pro sports continues in that direction.

And Joe in Philly is right, Cyd's opinions on the discussion board should have nothing to do with the fact that he is part of Outsports. This is a discussion group. If he used the website to advance an agenda, which I have never seen him do (other than putting a positive light on gays in sports, a laudable action), that would be a reason to mention his affiliation. On the discussion board is the place where everyone can say what they want, even MIB, Phillyfan, William1865, and the other reactionaries!

Thomas George has an excellent commentary in today's NY TIMES that point out just how fallacious and ignorant Rush's comments are.

First, many younger black quarterbacks still are pushed by coaches to try other positions to take advantage of their "athleticism." Sometimes this is well-intended, but it also results from the continuing belief that blacks simply do not have the intellectual capacity to QB.

Second, which media are these that want to see black QBs or coaches succeed? As George points out and as I've witnessed time and again, the media don't hesitate to tear down black QBs and coaches as quickly as they can. This doesn't just happen in the NFL, but in MLB as well. Dusty Baker's successes both in San Francisco and Chicago, like Cito Gaston's in Toronto, for example, may someday result in more black and Latino MLB managers, but the media isn't banging on any drums (pun intended).

As George notes, black QBs in 2003 still have a hard row to hoe. It is a white conservative fantasy to believe that the situation is easy for these men, and Rush just uttered this fantasy, which is why ESPN canned him/he resigned. There are some bad black QBs (Kordell Stewart's skills have just fallen off), but I can't think of ANYONE in the Chicago media--and Chicago is a fairly liberal city, by many measures, as are its suburbs--that is hoping Stewart will succeed. They seem more transfixed by the new stadium and counting down the games till Head Coach Dick Jauron is fired rather than plumping up Stewart (or any of the Bears). Maybe people have media contacts who really are pulling for these QBs, but I have yet to see it.

[ October 04, 2003, 09:31 AM: Message edited by: fantomas ]

Umm, Jim Allen, whether it's in the middle of the Limbaugh flap or not, the comment is highly offensive. But not atypical...and especially not for Boston (which is, by the way, now a mostly non-white city (over 50%), though you'd never know that from the media).

Just so you know, Cyd and I disagree on this, which is why we are confining our comments to the Discussion Board and not the main news part of the site. These opinions on this issue reflect us personally and not Outsports.

What Limbaugh said continued a pattern of racial insinuations he's made over the years, so he needed to be called on them. Plus, he was flat-our wrong in his assertions. He deserved what he got, which was to be booted off ESPN.

[ October 04, 2003, 10:50 AM: Message edited by: Jim at Outsports ]

meatman: "It is bold, when you make a statement that goes against the vast majority of the readers here."

Gee, I didnt realize it was that big of a deal, hell, PhillyFan does that everyday.
--------------------------------------------
Im surprised no one "got" why I titled the thread as such:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detai...595915?v=glance

It hasnt been that long ago that Warren Moon was getting heckled at Husky Stadium because he was a black QB for the Huskies. Then he couldnt get drafted in to the NFL for the same reason. Just think he might of ended his career a few years ago with every NFL passing record if given the chance from the begining. For Rush to be insinuating that black QB's have some unfair advantage because of some liberal media bias, I just dont think it can be said enough how ridiculous that is. And yes I think everyone has seen the clip either that Sunday morning or rerun on some other sportscenter, newscast or the internet, so I dont think people are just twisting one line around. And the reason why I dont think Irvin, Jackson or Young responded to it, is because they were still probably kind of shocked at what they were hearing.

As for politics and talk shows, there is one that I listen to a lot here in Seattle, Duck Boy probably knows him, Dorey Monson, but he is like a political moderate and listeners range from all over the board left and right, kind of like this board. And he doesnt call minorities things like "femynazi". Plus I understand that Rush screens his calls so that only people who agree with him can call in, I dont understand what the point to that is. Anyways I like sports and dont like politics much for reasons like this, and obviously they dont mix.

I always wince when I hear the "athleticism" label applied to black athletes in any field, not because the speaker necessarily intends racism, though it has taken on that connotation, but because what I think they really mean sometimes is "agility" rather than brute strength.

Agile is I suppose a tonier word that doesn't slide easily off the tongues of some sports commentators or occur to them, but it suggests that the skill expressed may be as much mental as physical which may in fact be the case - or is it?

TJ on ESPN Sunday Countdown, did what nobody else could do this morning.

Show me where I was wrong in feeling it wasn't racially insensitive.

Glad this is finally over.

What did he say or do? I didn't see it.

It was reported in the paper the other day that he intended to quit the show if Rush hadn't done it first. Apparently he felt really bad about not confronting Rush more directly on the racial angle.

Pat Robertson defends Rush on the 700 club by bringing up actor Morgan Freeman. Quote can be found at Quotable in WaPo. (scroll down)