Good God. You would think that being a nationwide joke would prompt at least one of Shrub's handlers to sit him down for ten minutes one day and teach him how to prononce the world, "nuclear." But no.

Jesus, that man scares me.

The Turnip-in-Chief probably thinks that pronouncing it correctly might make him come across as an intellectual which, in his tiny little mind, is a bad thing.

The man can't complete a sentence if it is written down for him, no great surprise he can't say nuclear correctly.

He's to busy fighting his war on "terra"

[quote]Originally posted by RazorbackTX:
He's to busy fighting his war on "terra"

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Are you "too" (note spelling) busy to put a period at the end of your sentence, Raze?

[quote]Originally posted by m1011:
The man can't complete a sentence if it is written down for him, no great surprise he can't say nuclear correctly.

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That's a run-on, L1011.

If you guys are going to nitpick about Bush's pronunciation of nuclear and his grammar/intelligence in general, I'm going to nitpick about your sentences. I'll lighten up when you guys do. (There's some Simpsons joke about the oft-mispronounced "nuclear." I forget what it is but it also involves the word "foliage" ("foilage").)

[quote]Originally posted by Jim:
Good God. You would think that being a nationwide joke would prompt at least one of Shrub's handlers to sit him down for ten minutes one day and teach him how to prononce the world, "nuclear." But no.

Jesus, that man scares me.

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It's pronounce. So you want Bush to pronounce the world nuclear? It's a nuclear world, and we're just living in it. How's that?

I suspect Bush's handlers don't agree with your assessment of our President as a "nationwide joke."

William, what's your point? That those in glass houses shouldn't throw stones? Well, maybe. But then again, I don't recall anyone having elected RazorbackTX or m1011 to be the leader (and thereby spokesperson) of our country!

On second thought, I guess you do have a point after all...

And I may have made a spelling error in my initial post, but trust me - I pronounced it beautifully.

There is a distinction here - a speech made by the President of the United States to the entire nation and the world, vs. a message left on in a chat group on the Internet, where everyone knows spelling and punctuation are often the first to go.

On a Simpsons note: Lisa finally convinces Marge of the proper way to say "foliage" (rather than "foilage"), and Marge says "See, it doesn't take a nucular scientist to figure this out." And Lisa cringes.

Apparently this is an example of "metathesis", transposing two adjacent sounds. Also, the "ular" ending is much more common in English than "lear". And according to Bill Safire, at least three other presidents - Eisenhower, Carter, and yes, Clinton - also said "nucular" at times.

Slate article: Why Does Bush Go \"Nucular\"?

Good Lord, I'm defending George Bush! I must not be feeling well...

[quote]Originally posted by conor500:
On a Simpsons note: Lisa finally convinces Marge of the proper way to say "foliage" (rather than "foilage"), and Marge says "See, it doesn't take a nucular scientist to figure this out." And Lisa cringes.

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Excellent. So obviously it is a frequently mispronounced word, so much so that its mispronunciation has seeped into the pop culture. In the scheme of things, it's really not a big deal at all.

Except, William, you can hardly say this is the first time Dubya's mangled a word. This is representative of a far larger problem.

(Now that feels better!)

I think a big deal is being made out of Bush's speaking ability, or lack thereof. As part of my job, I get to flap my gums several hours a week in front of 10-30 people, and I'm sure I have said some beauts rivaling Bush. Nobody, as far as I know tape recorded me and/or kept a record of any quotes of mine. I'm sure that's true for most of us here. If you can speak that many times in front of people, impromptu or otherwise, without making glaring errors, good for you. I don't we should limit who should be President to only those with extraordinary speaking skills.

William,

Are you saying that we have misunderestimated the guy? Or is this some subliminable message on your part?

William- you can correct me all you want. I don't care.

As for Bush, I would feel a great deal better if he would, at long last, make a convincing argument for this war.

I would feel a great deal better if he would abandon the fund raising for the GOP to concentrate on this imminent threat.

He can screw up any word/phrase/sentence he wants if he were giving us a compelling reason to add this war to the priorities (the economy, the war on terror, the environment) that affect us in our daily life.

He still has not made the case and he is attempting to deceive us. His deceptions are more serious and far-reaching than Clinton's were.

I'm almost certain I've never pronounced "nuclear" as "nucular". Having read through this thread (against my better judgement), the error has been suggested to my simple brain enough times that I can now only sit and wait for it to seep into my own vocabulary. Even the little voice in my head that has been reading along with me is confused. I can't tell which pronunciation it's using. Oy. The power of suggestion.

More importantly, Mr. Bush is doing everything he can to keep America in a state of fear and dependence; that's the only way his administration can take us back to their archaic cold war ways. They want the power over everything and virtually everything they're doing has this goal in mind. We become irrationally dependent upon the government when we think we're about to get hit from every side from every terrorist from every enemy...

check out www.workingforchange.com to send emails to senators to get them to vote against the far right judicial nominees that Bush is trying to sneak through....

Guys:

I don't think we should critize W's pronounciation of nuclear. It is simply his Texas dialect; just the same as people in the Northeast adding an "r" the ending of words (Laurer=Laura).

Now, William, please grade my paper and let me know my score.

There aren't too many words that end in "lear"--cochlear? Or even "ear"--linear"? (I guess if you know the Latin words that terminate in "eus" or "ea," you'd be able to produce a list.)

I don't get the butchering of this word, which isn't that tough (I mean, it isn't "perspicuous," or "chiasmus" or "indefatigable" or "peregrine," etc.), but then people pronounce (or "pernounce") things however they feel nowadays. "Heinous" becomes "henious." "Ornery" becomes "on-ree." There's the interminable "liberry" for "library." Etc. Trent Lott loves "heighth" (HEIGHT, Trent, Height). Of course if you mixed up "eight" and "eighth" you'd be pretty confusing, but I guess somebody eats up his folksiness like fondue.

BTW, we're also back to "Suh-DAHM" as "SAD-um," like *Haddam*, Connecticut. That was one of my favorite George H. W. Bushisms. And I'm not being facetious. Dana Carvey's imitation of Bigshrub saying "Saddam" was and remains hilarious.

[quote]Originally posted by m1011:
His deceptions are more serious and far-reaching than Clinton's were.

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I don't remember the staffer (Karl Rove?) who said you don't roll out new products in the summer, referring to why the Bush administration was waiting until two months before a nationwide election to bring his Iraq policy to the Congress, but that idea was entirely chilling. I find it disgusting in the extreme that vital foreign policy is being treated like a new model of automobile.
However, blowing up an asprin factory in Africa on worse than quesitonable intellegence to bump a sex scandal from the front pages is definitely a more serious deception than anything Bush has done.

I think that getting us into a war for oil and revenge, where many thousands may die and can turn into a quagmire like Vietnam is worse than Clinton's actions. Clinton's deceptions were mainly about his own personal life. Bush's deceptions concern the trifecta of ills he has brought to us since he has been in the White House : recession, repression and war.

Another Bush - another recession.
Another Bush - another war.

More on "nucular": about ten years there was a comedy about bugs who transformed themselves into humans to take over the world. One way they passed for actual humans was by saying "nucular" instead of "nuclear." Don't remember the film's title,but it may have been "Meet the Appletons." It did a=star Ed Begley, Jr. and (shockingly) Stockard Channing.

~Adam

RazorbackTX wrote [quote] He's to busy fighting his war on "terra"

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Implying, I suppose, that he is fighting Earth. Probably more disturbing than what I had been thinking, which was that he had been fighting TARA!

"Jesus! The Civil War's been over for 130 years, and he's declared war on Miss Scarlett?"

[quote]Originally posted by Lots-of-us:
William,

Are you saying that we have misunderestimated the guy? Or is this some subliminable message on your part?

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Watch out, Lots. There's an old saying here in DC: Fool me once, uh, uh . . . won't be fooled again.

[quote]Originally posted by Aubie in Bham:
Guys:

I don't think we should critize W's pronounciation of nuclear. It is simply his Texas dialect; just the same as people in the Northeast adding an "r" the ending of words (Laurer=Laura).

Now, William, please grade my paper and let me know my score.

---

A+

[quote]Originally posted by William1865:


Are you "too" (note spelling) busy to put a period at the end of your sentence, Raze?

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i are sorry that werent right english Dont 'misunderestimate" me though; some day i may be talkin as gooder as the president,

"Is our children learning?" GWB

Along with the very frequently used "tera, tara, tear" pronunciation, Mr. Bush has added a very similar spin to "hora, hoar" for the much more distinct word "horror".

Dialect coaches exist all over the place. Even if this is an issue of where he grew up and lived, it can be corrected. The man did attend Ivy League colleges, so it is not like he has not spent time around people with different speech patterns.

The President is first and foremost the chief executive of the country. One of his primary functions is to represent the country and its people in public both domestically and internationally. His staff could make an effort. Simple and folksy does not work for someone who is leading the most influential country in the world.

So if you have an accent you can't properly represent the people?

This whole thing is ridiculous. By concentrating on silly misstatements and pronunciations, people are just undermining their own arguments about the policies and actions of the Bush administration.

Well put, JIP.

The fact that so many are spending so much time making fun of the way someone speaks tells me much more about the people making the commentary.

You guys have NO sense of humor.

"Teach a child to read and he or her will be able to pass a literacy test."
GWB

Here he's making up new words:

"Let me tell you my thoughts about tax relief. When your economy is kind of ooching along, it's important to let people have more of their own money." —GWB, Boston, Oct. 4, 2002

Hmm, I never learned the term "ooching" in macroeconomics...

And yes, this is mostly all in good fun. If we really wanted to attack Dubya, we'd base those attacks on his policies and beliefs, not his grammar.

I think most of us have a pretty fine sense of humor. But when you tell the same damn joke over and over again... Okay we get it Bush is a dolt. Tre originale!

So, it is really just defensiveness that makes people defend his gaffes and faux-pas? After all, we are not making fun of people with accents/dialects. We are pointing out the importance of our leader having a working command of his native language. There is a major difference between those two points. It would be like the Prime Minister of France pronouncing "merci, beaucoup" like "merky buckups". Not really appropriate in any setting.

[quote]Originally posted by charliecstl:
It would be like the Prime Minister of France pronouncing "merci, beaucoup" like "merky buckups".

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Wait. How is this supposed to be pronounced?

from W1865 in the immigration thread
[quote] Also, people who refuse to learn the language should not be allowed to make things more difficult for people who were born here or who have learned English. You can speak pig latin in your home, as far as I'm concerned, but learn English if you're working with the public.

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does this mean we have a higher standard for immigrants than for the president of the united states?

Any given POTUS deserves the right to have an accent. But POTUS should not be making frequent syntax errors that lead one to believe he doen't understand the finer workings of verb-noun agreement.
This has nothing to do with my disagreements with Shrub on some of his policies - Not a week goes by that I don't hear some fool trying to "ax" me a question, or thinking that "is" and "are" are interchangeable based on personal whim.
And I routinely form the snap judgment that those folks are completely ignorant, lazy, or "slow that way."
I seriously doubt that I am alone in that belief, and thus my opinion that Bushlette leaves himself at the mercy of all we kindred cynics in the world.

[quote]Originally posted by thersis:
from W1865 in the immigration thread


does this mean we have a higher standard for immigrants than for the president of the united states?

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I think there's a slight difference between saying "nucular" and not being able to comprehend basic English. I mean, c'mon. You're getting desparate here.

I will agree whole-heartedly that W should be called on the carpet for his problems with basic grammar. However, as a man with an accent, I am personally offended by those on here critizing Bush on his pronunciation of certain words; especially when CharlieSTL suggests a dialect coach to "erase" his accent.

edited to erase smarta** comments

[ October 10, 2002: Message edited by: Aubie in Bham ]

I have to agree with Aubie. I'm always disturbed by the way certain accents are stigmatized. I'll always remember Holly Hunter's remarking about "Broadcast News" that she was so happy that she was allowed to use her natural accent to play an intelligent, educated woman who happened to be from the south.

"I was proud the other day when both Republicans and Democrats stood with me in the Rose Garden to announce their support for a clear statement of purpose: you disarm, or we will."—Speaking about Saddam Hussein, Manchester, N.H., Oct. 5, 2002

WAY funnier than "nucular," despite the debt it owes to "Duck Soup."

The Complete Bushisms

I think the way Bush was pronouncing the word was more "nukeelar" instead of "nucular"..... I practiced with him the 450 times he said it in his speech to be able to imitate it.

I feel the same way now that I did when Carter regularly left the "L" out of the word, and pronounced it "nukeear". It matters not to me what their stance is as much as the fact that it's being horribly mispronounced. Likewise, I possess a southern accent and pronounce it correctly. You're smart enough to become POTUS, so SAY it the right way!

But it took me through graduate school to learn to leave the "e" off the end of the word "potato".

[quote]Originally posted by Joe in Philly:
So if you have an accent you can't properly represent the people?

This whole thing is ridiculous. By concentrating on silly misstatements and pronunciations, people are just undermining their own arguments about the policies and actions of the Bush administration.

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Pronunciations I agree with, but misstatements? I mean, if you're POTUS, you are held to a higher standard. I'll say it again: Bush caused a temporary drop in the yen because of a misstatement. He should take Calvin Coolidge's example and say as little as possible--all the time. Of course Coolidge had an economy roaring like Clinton's, whereas Bush has been placed in the same position as both Hoover and his father.

Speaking of accents, is anyone old enough to recall press accounts of President John F. Kennedy's accent? I love Baby Teddy's blustering Cape Cod version, and adored Boston's (and New England's) various accents when I lived there, just as a love New York accents. (When Bostonians like William Bratton or Mike Bloomberg or Jeremiah Healey or Carl McCall speak, you can hear that "a" that is unique to that area.) Of the midwestern accents I know, I think I like the one I know from Saint Louis the best; the Chicago accent--where Addison is pronounced sort of like "E(YA)D-uh-sun" is fascinating, but it grates after a while. I love Chicago though. Go Bears (and Mike Brown)!

[quote]Originally posted by conor500:
Here he's making up new words:

"Let me tell you my thoughts about tax relief. When your economy is kind of ooching along, it's important to let people have more of their own money." —GWB, Boston, Oct. 4, 2002

Hmm, I never learned the term "ooching" in macroeconomics...

And yes, this is mostly all in good fun. If we really wanted to attack Dubya, we'd base those attacks on his policies and beliefs, not his grammar.

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My favorite word that Dumbya has made up is "crawfished."
"For 11 long years Saddam Hussein has sidestepped, crawfished, wheedled out of any agreement that he had made."

[quote]Originally posted by William1865:


I think there's a slight difference between saying "nucular" and not being able to comprehend basic English. I mean, c'mon. You're getting desparate here.

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I think you mean "desperate."