I've said it before, DOMA will NOT be a problem for PhillyFan.

AHHHHHHHHH! i've been waiting for this one... OK, so if DOMA is now a republican act.. then the entire boom of the 90's was strictly due to republican legislation that bubba merely signed away on... you cant have it both way. Proclaim bubba created a great economy and such, but doma was republican. Fact is... if bubba doesnt sign DOMA, it doesnt go in. HE is the one with his name on it.. his endorsement. When you boil it all down kids.. Dont ask dont tell.. DOMA hurt you more than any non-pic-nic ever has. So as much as i get bitched at for my poliitical beliefs, when push comes to shove... you are neglected totally by your party... but yet you celebrate some "gay pride" month... Is that really acceptance to you? Honestly...

PS you guys still havent shown me one piece of legislation the horrible GAY hater W has pushed through.... i've given you 2 prime examples what the dems did to you. HORN, answer that question.... or are you just happy with your free "happy" month?

Gay Pride was celebrated LONG before Bill Clinton was elected President.

PhillyFan,

Again and again and again, I ask you a simple yes or no question: Was Ashcroft's cancelling of the Gay Pride Event at the DOJ a part of that "inclusiveness" your party TALKS about (during campaign elections) and when Rick Santorum shows his ass?

[ June 10, 2003, 04:40 PM: Message edited by: HornFan ]

Then you GOPers need to take credit for the current Crappy economy. I never said Clinton made the 90's economy, but if that's the case. Then you need to admit the the current situation is the GOP's fault!

OH and DOMA was Veto proof, it would have happened anyway. You know what a veto override is don't you. You should be thanking Clinton for signing it, because it gave you so much ammunition instead of having your dear GOP senate overrided it.

You would be meaning that it was supported by enough people in BOTH parties, that it had the proper votes to go above the president? Arent you proving my point that this bill was supported by the dems? the inclusive party that supports you...

and Horn, im still waiting for exactly what legislation W has sent through that is anti-gay. I've given you 2 of Bubba's.

I'm trying to stay on topic. You haven't answered my question, which happens to be about the topic of this thread.

Phillyfan, that would mean all, ALL all GOP and a few Dems. Sounds like my odds are better with the Dems. It doesn't require a 100% vote. I bet none of the Repubs voted against it.

Sorry for allowing him a diversion Horn, I'll leave this thread to you and the Monkey who likes his closet. I'm done here, this guy is too thick to see the truth here.

I'm sure this is an exercise in futility, but here goes. PhillyFan, what are you trying to say? If the DODT and DOMA bills were sent for Bush II's signature, he would have vetoed it? If you heard Bush II say that Clinton shouldn't have signed those bills, let us know. The fact that he hasn't proposed bills to Congress to overturn these laws shows he's no better than Clinton on these two issues. And then on top of that, you have the list that CPT Doom provided also showing where Bush stands on gay rights.

Yes, I agree that Clinton shouldn't have broken his campaign promise about gays in the military, and stuck to his guns. And signing DOMA was double hypocrisy at its worst. Also, as I said on other threads, Clinton was, by far, my least favorite President. Despite all that, Clinton was much better than Bush II with regards to gay rights. Your emphasis on "legislation" and who's eating "pork chops" or whatever, doesn't change this.

I'm sure the world's not going to end because of the DOJ Pride prohibition, but it's another slap in the face by the Bush administration, even though this wasn't something that was legislated.

[ June 10, 2003, 05:03 PM: Message edited by: pat125 ]

No Phillyfan you are not answering questions, you are using basic debating skills, and that is ok. You say things like what Ashcroft did is petty, and that freaks are the main attendees at pride, whatever. The bottom line is that you either like baiting people, or your unable to defend your positions, and thats fine too. There is always a place for comic relief, and as a court jester you do excel

OH GOD THANK YOU! I LOVE YOU.

I'm sure bush would have signed that DOMA bill also, but that was not the case. It had already been signed. My point is the head of you party is the one who actually slapped you in the face with actual legislation. W has not.

W did not run on defending gay right. He also did not run on bashing gays. The man has appointed gay folks to posts. he's not pushed through anti-gay legislation (given the fact he's got the majority in both house and senate).

Now, what Ashcroft does in his department... I'd guess that is up to him, and everyone knew he was a do-do. Altho, there is probably no better bulldog to go after terrorists.

Appointing conservative judges? eh, we'd agree this court is more conservative than it is liberal... so if they overturn the texas law... sorta destroys your conservatives judges are anti-gay now doesnt it? They just need to follow the law.

I'll also say that many of the "militant" gays are just as bad as the christian right. Where the christian right runs their life on abortion and anti-gay... the militant gays will allow no deferring opinions.

First, Clinton is not the head of my party. And despite this legislation kick you are on, W has been much worse than Clinton on gay rights. Let me know when Bush II proposes actual legislation to overturn DOMA. Thank you.

Oh, well. I tried.

[ June 10, 2003, 05:30 PM: Message edited by: pat125 ]

Perhaps there would be less militant gays if they had equal rights?

Looks like ASScroft caved, they are giving them their event, but without department sponsorship. No official speaches and such.

Even though Colin Powell's State Department Pride event get's full validation from them. The DOJ will continue to disciminate, just quiter than they wanted to.

DOJ is billing the GLBT employees for the use of the auditorium.

Ok so the first group that uses it without being billed will end up in court

I am thrilled that the event is back on, but appalled that the Administration is trying to back-pedal and claim it was all a misunderstanding. They simply said they wouldn't pay for the event (the $600), but never implied they wouldn't let DOJ Pride use the facilities - yeah right!

posted by Phillyfan:
You want legislation, I will give you legislation - the law the created the special fund for 9/11 victims - yep, that was a Republican law.

How about the Federal Employee Benefits Program - when the question came up regarding equal benefits for gay federal employees, it was a Bush appointee that made the call to screw them. That was not explicitly legislation, but it in some ways is worse - with appointees who run cabinet departments, they don't need legislation to screw gays and lesbians.

AIDS funding - triples the amount spent overseas, cuts the amount spent here (remember, we're evil sick f**ks who deserve to die, the Africans are innocent women and children).

You want more legislation - how many states with equal rights laws for gays and lesbians were controlled by the Republican party when those laws were passed (I believe it is 1 out of 14). In Maryland, it took a Democratic Governer three tries to get the legislation past some anti-gay Republican lawmakers.

But don't worry, I know your response "DOMA, DOMA, DOMA" - which by the way even the "pro-family" movement knows is unConstitutional - that is why they are desperate to get every state to pass their own version.

Now that DOJ is allowing the pride to take place, can we now get the DOJ to rescind the Patriot Act?

Good luck.

Commentary, USAPA

- - - - -

NYT Times article, decrying Ashcroft BS

[ June 13, 2003, 05:56 AM: Message edited by: bluebird48234 ]

"Take your bigotry and shove it!" -- DoJ Pride has announced that this year's awards event will be held in the Russell Senate Building, rather than the Great Hall of Justice. Gotta love their official release about the decision to relocate:

I am proud of their actions, perhaps that should be all of our motto, I for one and tired of second class status. I wonder if there is a case to be made for if I do not enjoy the same rights as others why do I have to pay taxes at the same rate?

I have some friends at FDIC here in Dallas and I attended their Pride event today. The Featured Speaker was none other than Dave Pallone, former MLB Umpire. He provides a very inspirational and motivational message. About 100 people attended and only a handful were Gay which I consider a BIG positive.

Some folks (in GOP lockstep) :mad: think there's nothing of value in these little "pride get togethers" and "pic-nics", but I have to say I've been pumped all day since hearing the man speak. The best part is seeing all of these straight people actually getting his message and admiring him on his merits.

If you ever have the opportunity to attend one of his seminars or presentations, GO! I have not read his book, but I'm going to now.

www.DavePallone.com

Kewlio... you went to the pic-nic. Potato salad or mac salad for you horn? Freedom Fries?

HEY! if this was sponsored by the FDIC, you just run up the deficit too damnit! you'll need to send in double your tax cut young man!

Pizza and sodas....Jerk!

Horn, i woulda been sure any govt event would have served pork....

Was Raze there? If so, then it would been one hell of a party.

Now THAT was actually funny, PF!

[ June 19, 2003, 06:05 PM: Message edited by: HornFan ]