This pretty much does it for me with the local version of Holy Mother Church. Christ is Risen - You Stay Dead!

And yet they seem to have no problems performing services for mob bosses.

Maybe someone should work from within to effect change. I hear Inclusion Wins.

If I thought I had any chance of making a difference here, I'd do so, but this is just another nail in a coffin 52 years a-buildin'! The ONLY way change is going to come (with)in the RCC is after this Pope is gone - and that's going to take some time even then. The pure meanness of this act is what really galls me. :mad:

So it would take 52 years for you to give up on the GOP then? wink

LOL - no, I'm in that battle for keeps!

Good luck with that. Let me know how that works out for you.
wink

Concerning the subject at hand, it hardly surprises me that the RCC would deny a Catholic funeral for a gay man who owned a gay-oriented business. Many Protestant denominations fare only slightly better--you may get a service, but they'll be damned if they mention your partner! Hell, and if you died from HIV/AIDS, you might get a sermon warning of the ills of gay sex!

[ March 19, 2005, 12:56 PM: Message edited by: kalabro ]

The United Church of Christ welcomes lesbians, gays, bisexuals and transgendered persons.

As for that satanic bishop and the vile leadership of the RCC, perhaps they would do best to read the Gospels once in a while. Nothing holy, catholic or apostolic about the rigid, hate-drenched actions of this crowd.

Matthew 5:1-12 Now when he saw the crowds, he went up on a mountainside and sat down. His disciples came to him, and he began to teach them saying: "Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Blessed are those who mourn, for they will be comforted. Blessed are the meek, for they will inherit the earth. Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they will be filled. Blessed are the merciful, for they will be shown mercy. Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God. Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God. Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.

Matt 22:38-39 Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. This is the first and greatest commandment.

Matt 25:40-45 The King will reply, 'I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.' Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.' They also will answer, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?' He will reply, 'I tell you the truth, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’

Luke 6:27-28 But I tell you who hear me: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you.

Luke 6:36-37 Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful. Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.

FT, this Bishoprick seems to rely more on Church doctrine than Scripture, so I think your thoughts are wasted on him. Nice summary, though.

A local letter writer observed that the RCC had no problem burying convicted MA child molester/ex priest Geoghan (sp?) with "the full honors of the Church," but can't find it in its heart to even allow a Mass of Christian Burial for this dead philanthropist. Crap like this brings back all the memories of overbearing nuns, sanctimonious priests and ass-kissing parishoners that gave me such a bad impression of the RCC as a young kid. Too bad those first impressions are turning out to be lasting ones.

In a letter to John McCusker's family, Bishop Brom has recanted, apologized, and offered to preside at a mass in his memory. Good for him.

Bishop apologizes for barring Catholic funeral of gay nightclub owner

[ March 22, 2005, 03:40 PM: Message edited by: redsoxbreath ]

Thanks for being hot on our local news, RSB. I hadn't heard of his recanting until I read your post. Frankly though, the damage's been done; sometimes timing is everything and the Bishop did the worst possible thing at the worst possible time. Yeah, I know all about forgiveness, but first I'm going to have to give this a lot of thought.

Well I am glad the Bishop came to his senses and apologized. While it was too late for a dignified burial, at least he came around. It always amazes me when the clergy goes so against the teachings of Christ.

The Bishop said:

"I deeply regret that denying a Catholic funeral for John McCusker at the Immaculata has resulted in his unjust condemnation, and I apologize to the family for the anguish this has caused them".

He regrets that denying it resulted in condemnation?

That's NOT an apology. That's an excuse. He is not saying that he is wrong to deny him a funeral mass. he is not saying that he was wrong in doing it at all, he is saying that he is sorry that he got called on it.

Typical RCC double speak. They bury a short-eyes with full mass, and deny this man mass.

Frankly, that "apology"? ain't worth the bandwidth.

Besides a living will (which my partner and I just did late last year), I am stipulating to my very catholic family that I do not want to be buried by the catholic church!!!

I have seen enough hypocrisy by the catholic church that I don't know how any one remains an active member in this institution. Two instances for my feelings immediately come to mind..1) when they refused to bury my uncle because he was behind in his kids' tuition at the time of his death. Mind you, he had 10 kids because the church doesn't believe in birth control...and 2) when my catholic high school refused to let my cousin (who was in my class) put her 'discounted' class ring (not the official class ring) into a box with the rest of the our class's rings to be blessed on Ring Day, and also tried to ban her from attending the prom because she was receiving tuition assistance!

Oh and two more just came to mind...3) when they refused to grant my sister an annulment because she did not have the $300 to pay for it, and then told her that she could not receive communion at her daughter's communion service because she was divorced...and 4) when my aunt went to confession after many years (10 or more) and came out of the confessional crying her eyes out because the priest berated her for having not confessed her sins in so long and then had the nerve to tell her she was not a good example to her kids and should be ashamed of herself.

I'm sure I could think of more reasons why I think the catholic church is a mockery...but I'm sure I probably overstated my point already...

Amen

Ummm, can someone explain to me why being behind on tuition at time of death is a reason to not be buried by the church? I'm sure I'll get an answer that makes oh so much sense...

Another question: Will all these child-raping priests receive a funeral by the church?

Probably. One looks out for the other you know

Di, I'm really sorry to hear of all the horrible experiences you've had in the Catholic church. The stories you told would have made me an ex-Catholic as well. I guess I am really lucky to have found the Catholic church that I have found. I can't explain why my church is the way it is, I'm just glad that it is the way it is. Please understand that the wrongs that have been done to you by the Catholic church are not right...they fly in the face of everything Jesus taught and stood for. The people that wronged you and your family are worse than hypocrites...they are using the Catholic church to further their hypocricy. In my eyes, that is worse than committing a mortal sin. I will certainly not offer any defense of them just because they are "of the cloth".

Thanks millerbeach! When I think about all the wrongs I have experienced with them, I can't reconcile belonging to any church that calls itself catholic. I'm glad though that you have found one that accepts you and makes you feel comfortable. I know we can't lump all churches or all catholics together. Some of my greatest influences in high school and with whom I eventually became friends were 2 wonderful nuns that I had in high school. I hung out with them at the convent, they took me to visit college campuses, came to dinner with my family, supported me through college, etc. They touched my life in such a deep, profound way and at some point, I even considered entering religious life.

Oh well, that's all water under the bridge...I won't even go into my experiences at the non-denominational, born-again church I joined after college!

[ March 23, 2005, 05:33 AM: Message edited by: Di ]

Di, thanks for reminding me of some of the petty crap that marred my two years of Catholic grade school. My own favorite: at my First Holy Communion breakfast in 2nd grade, I found myself seated next to the Pastor who'd just given us our FHC. He and I were in the middle of a nice friendly conversation when the g-d nun who was my teacher - and nemesis - saw us enjoying each other's company, strutted over and removed me to the opposite end of the table, replacing me with some little brat whose parents gave lots of money to the parish.* Thankfully, my parents saw the whole event - which left my mom in tears - and pulled me out of that hellhole at the end of the school year, which as all good Catholics know wasn't far away since FHC is held in May.

There will be a march and vigil this Friday here in SD starting at 6 p.m. to commemorate McCusker and show support for his family. Look for the deets in the GLT that comes out tomorrow.
_____
*Think the relegation of Shirley Temple from her honored seat to the kitchen in "The Little Princess."

[ March 23, 2005, 08:50 AM: Message edited by: gmginsfo ]

GMGINSFO (btw, what does this abbreviation of your name mean?):

I'm sorry I forced you to relive the nightmare of your Holy Communion day, but be thankful you only spent 2 years under the catholic "guilt and feel bad" spell and not 16 long years like me! wink No wonder I have issues!

Good counsel MB-.... there are ass****s everywhere in the world - even in churches. But there are good people in many churches too- If you shop around - you may find one where you are comfortable. AND before anyone attacks I DO realize everyone does not feel a need to go to a church.

Thanks, Di. My handle's nothing fancy, just my initials followed by SF's airport code, since I used to live there and never bothered to rewrite this one aspect of my personal history. wink

To this day, the mere sight of a nun incenses me, as well as my 4 younger sisters, none of whom ever even had to attend dreaded "Catholic School." :mad:

Well we do have to at least give the Bishop some credit for acknowledging his error and for announcing he will be performing the memorial mass himself. Usually it takes a few centuries for the Church to admit errors in judgement.