Full Version: Lesbian Couple Married in California
...or "hypocritical".
The judges who bravely stand up for our rights should be applauded! They do the right thing, which is stand up for a minority in the face of oppression. They are fighting for us in the way that they can.
When slavery was coming to an end, the south did not give up easily, hell they still haven't quit fighting. The country was torn in two over an issue that we now think is rediculous to be fighting over. When it came to civil rights issues in 1948, 37 southern democrats walked out of the national convention to protest the inclusion of civil rights planks. The dixiecrat party was born and they propped up Strom Thurmond who recieved over a million votes or 7% of the national vote.
We are in a minority and we face the same prejudice as Blacks in post reconstruction. If you are Black and gay you are facing double jeopardy. That blows! We cannot gain rights equal to straight couples if we rely on the legislators in states to do the right thing. If that were the case, there were be no civil rights in Georgia to this very day. Courts have to and are forced to intervene and do what legislators will not do. Legislator are soooo worried about what the majority of their constitients are going to think. They place a vote above doing the right thing. They play politics with our lives! We need to speak up and let law-makers know we are here and will be heard. And we need to thank the judges that stand up for minorities in the face of persecution.
[ February 28, 2004, 07:34 PM: Message edited by: wade n atlanta ]
When slavery was coming to an end, the south did not give up easily, hell they still haven't quit fighting. The country was torn in two over an issue that we now think is rediculous to be fighting over. When it came to civil rights issues in 1948, 37 southern democrats walked out of the national convention to protest the inclusion of civil rights planks. The dixiecrat party was born and they propped up Strom Thurmond who recieved over a million votes or 7% of the national vote.
We are in a minority and we face the same prejudice as Blacks in post reconstruction. If you are Black and gay you are facing double jeopardy. That blows! We cannot gain rights equal to straight couples if we rely on the legislators in states to do the right thing. If that were the case, there were be no civil rights in Georgia to this very day. Courts have to and are forced to intervene and do what legislators will not do. Legislator are soooo worried about what the majority of their constitients are going to think. They place a vote above doing the right thing. They play politics with our lives! We need to speak up and let law-makers know we are here and will be heard. And we need to thank the judges that stand up for minorities in the face of persecution.
[ February 28, 2004, 07:34 PM: Message edited by: wade n atlanta ]
QUOTE
A more cowardly bunch of judges I have never seen in my entire life in that state. Just another reason for the Big One to hit and make eastern CA. beachfront property.
Isn't that sort of like Pat Roberston (or was it Jerry Fallwell?) telling Orlando that they risked God's wrath - through hurricanes or terrorist attacks - if they allowed Gay Days at Disney?I mean, it's apparently impossible that the judges might actually think the mayor and the city have a case here. What if the ultimate judgement is for Newsom, MIB? Will you still be so angry at this "lawlessness," particularly when the "crime" being committed has no victims?
What the gay rights movement is trying to do is right one of the worst wrongs in the history of civilization - the rejection of the essential humanity of gay and lesbian people. Newsom has taken the next, boldest step, and I appreciate that he was willing to put himself and his career on the line for us.
And no matter how you feel about Newsom's actions, MIB - you cannot be ignorant of the larger social effect his actions will have - and I have to believe they will be nothing but positive. Gay people are getting married, America has seen more same-sex affection in one week than in the history of our country, and the sky is not falling. The world is not crumbling, civilization is not in peril - hell even the Governor of California can barely get his panties twisted over this one.
[ February 29, 2004, 11:43 AM: Message edited by: MIB ]
Wow, for once MIB is speechless.
I think the CA Supremes really wanted this case to wind its way through the lower courts first. Oh well. The next step is on Friday when the city and the conservatives have to present new arguments to the CA Supremes.
Good luck to GJ and BG.
As to Vegas becoming beachfront property due to a California earthquake, whatever. Everyone who lives here knows the risks. But what about people near the New Madrid fault?
[ February 29, 2004, 12:41 PM: Message edited by: Jim Allen ]
I think the CA Supremes really wanted this case to wind its way through the lower courts first. Oh well. The next step is on Friday when the city and the conservatives have to present new arguments to the CA Supremes.
Good luck to GJ and BG.
As to Vegas becoming beachfront property due to a California earthquake, whatever. Everyone who lives here knows the risks. But what about people near the New Madrid fault?
QUOTE
Scientists estimate that the probability of a magnitude 6 to 7 earthquake occurring in this seismic zone within the next 50 years is higher than 90%. Such an earthquake could hit the Mississippi Valley at any time
One consequence, if it's strong enough, is that it would cause the Gulf of Mexico to pour in to the Midwest.[ February 29, 2004, 12:41 PM: Message edited by: Jim Allen ]
That's going to be one hellacious earthquake. If you Google for "elevation of memphis tennessee" you get a variety of figures, such as 254, 331, 224, 215, and 265 feet. Anyway you cut it, that's a lot of vertical movement.
When the religious conservatives make their "God's wrath" type comments, they show how much hate and anger and sexual hysteria they have just below the surface. They WANT to see us burn in hell for all eternity; they WANT to see the entire corrupt society destroyed; THEY are the ones who use this kind of language, not us. Then they create a god in their own image to do the dirty work for them, to act out their Carrie-at-the-prom fantasies, while they sit back and watch, all innocence and virtue, mouthing dishonest pieties like "hate the sin, not the sinner".
You ever wonder why they only get this worked up over sexual issues? Never murder or war or injustice of any kind, only sex?
You ever wonder why they only get this worked up over sexual issues? Never murder or war or injustice of any kind, only sex?
I just saw on the tube that the mayor of New Paltz, NY is being charged on 19 counts, for marrying people without a license. I don't have a link, and not sure if I heard it correctly. But I'm guessing some people, who need to get a life, got into a tizzy over gay marriages, and had these charges pursued.
Edited to add link.
Here's the story
[ March 02, 2004, 02:34 PM: Message edited by: pat125 ]
Edited to add link.
Here's the story
[ March 02, 2004, 02:34 PM: Message edited by: pat125 ]
Hey, thanks for all the good wishes, guys!
A Bay Area Outsports party, huh? How about on my/our last night of "freedom," Sunday night, March 28 at Harvey's/Martuni's/Uncle Bert's/all of the above?
A Bay Area Outsports party, huh? How about on my/our last night of "freedom," Sunday night, March 28 at Harvey's/Martuni's/Uncle Bert's/all of the above?
Multnomah County, where Portland, Oregon is, joins the party:
Multnomah County grants gay marriage licenses
Multnomah County grants gay marriage licenses
QUOTE
GatorJamie:
A Bay Area Outsports party, huh? How about on my/our last night of \"freedom,\" Sunday night, March 28 at Harvey's/Martuni's/Uncle Bert's/all of the above?
Good thing they moved the Oscars up to February, huh? I recommend Martuni's since we can commandeer their back room. My groups does this evry couple of months. Not completely private, but we can sorta have our own space. Early drinks, then dinner in the neighborhood? Have a favorite place to eat? Let me know and I'll post the details in the "local" thread as well.
A Bay Area Outsports party, huh? How about on my/our last night of \"freedom,\" Sunday night, March 28 at Harvey's/Martuni's/Uncle Bert's/all of the above?
My brother and his partner of 10 years live in Portland. I wonder when the wedding invitation is going to come? 
QUOTE
RGMike:
I recommend Martuni's since we can commandeer their back room... Have a favorite place to eat? Let me know and I'll post the details in the \"local\" thread as well.
Works for me! I have no idea about places to eat, having not been there in awhile (is Carta still acrioss the street?), but food is a good idea - can't be looking too hung over on the wedding day. wink
I recommend Martuni's since we can commandeer their back room... Have a favorite place to eat? Let me know and I'll post the details in the \"local\" thread as well.
Woo Hoo!!! Portland, Oregon joins the growing tide. Great news.
QUOTE
Purdue Fan:
Multnomah County, where Portland, Oregon is, joins the party
Gay Couples Get Marriage Licenses in PortlandMultnomah County, where Portland, Oregon is, joins the party
QUOTE
....
Portland has long been viewed as a bastion of liberalism, but opposition from Oregon's Republican leadership was swift.
\"I'm very upset that this travesty is taking place in Oregon. It definitely is an insult to the voters and to the people,\" said Kevin Mannix, chairman of the Oregon Republican Party, who called for the attorney general to put a halt to the marriages immediately.
....
Kevin Mannix was president of the University of Virginia Student Council back in the early 70s. Then he went to UVa Law School. There are references to him here at Outsports. I will now dig them up.Portland has long been viewed as a bastion of liberalism, but opposition from Oregon's Republican leadership was swift.
\"I'm very upset that this travesty is taking place in Oregon. It definitely is an insult to the voters and to the people,\" said Kevin Mannix, chairman of the Oregon Republican Party, who called for the attorney general to put a halt to the marriages immediately.
....
Oregonians Protest W Visit
Mannix is no friend of the gay community, as this article from 2000 shows:
Battle builds over backing gay rights in schools
QUOTE
The Oregonian, July 12, 2000
1320 SW Broadway, Portland, OR, 97201
(Fax 503-294-4193 ) (E-MAIL:Letters@news.oregonian.com )
( http://www.oregonlive.com/ )
Battle builds over backing gay rights in schools
An initiative that's not yet approved but would be a first in the nation would not allow any sanctioning of homosexuality
By Tomoko Hosaka and Steven Carter of The Oregonian staff
An initiative that would restrict schools from sanctioning homosexuality is gaining widespread attention because it would make Oregon the first state to take the battle over gay rights into the classroom.
....
Supporters of the measure, including Lon Mabon of the Oregon Citizens Alliance, turned in 83,281 signatures to the Secretary of State's office Friday. They need 66,786 valid names for the initiative to qualify and will receive results within 30 days.
But neither camp is waiting that long. Mabon and other supporters such as Lou Beres of the Oregon Christian Coalition are holding a strategy meeting Monday. The gay-rights movement has gone too far in persuading schools to present a one-sided view of homosexuality to students, Beres said.
Liz Kaufman, campaign consultant for the opponents, says their plan of attack is ready to go. Using radio spots, television commercials, door-to-door campaigners and direct mail, they will paint the initiative as anti-gay and anti-education.
The group Basic Rights Oregon will lead the effort, with support from educators, parents, business groups and labor unions.
The initiative would take away all or part of a school's state funding if it is found to violate the law.
Most educators interviewed this week see the initiative as unneeded and unwanted. The idea that there is a homosexual agenda in public education leaves them scratching their heads.
\"We never have encouraged, promoted or sanctioned any kind of sexual behavior,\" said Betsy Cole, who oversees counseling program in Portland's public schools.
....
The Oregon Republican Party endorsed the initiative last June, and national conservative groups say the issue will attract conservative and moderate support.
Rep. Kevin Mannix, R-Portland, says he will vote for the initiative.
\"I have read it very carefully,\" said Mannix, who is vice-chairman of the state Republican Party and a candidate for attorney general. \"And its actual words say that we shouldn't be validating homosexual conduct in schools. I agree with that simple message.\"
....
Lindsey Buchanan, founder of the Gay/Straight Alliance at Tigard High School, is appalled by the proposal.
....
Mannix ran for governor back in 2002.1320 SW Broadway, Portland, OR, 97201
(Fax 503-294-4193 ) (E-MAIL:Letters@news.oregonian.com )
( http://www.oregonlive.com/ )
Battle builds over backing gay rights in schools
An initiative that's not yet approved but would be a first in the nation would not allow any sanctioning of homosexuality
By Tomoko Hosaka and Steven Carter of The Oregonian staff
An initiative that would restrict schools from sanctioning homosexuality is gaining widespread attention because it would make Oregon the first state to take the battle over gay rights into the classroom.
....
Supporters of the measure, including Lon Mabon of the Oregon Citizens Alliance, turned in 83,281 signatures to the Secretary of State's office Friday. They need 66,786 valid names for the initiative to qualify and will receive results within 30 days.
But neither camp is waiting that long. Mabon and other supporters such as Lou Beres of the Oregon Christian Coalition are holding a strategy meeting Monday. The gay-rights movement has gone too far in persuading schools to present a one-sided view of homosexuality to students, Beres said.
Liz Kaufman, campaign consultant for the opponents, says their plan of attack is ready to go. Using radio spots, television commercials, door-to-door campaigners and direct mail, they will paint the initiative as anti-gay and anti-education.
The group Basic Rights Oregon will lead the effort, with support from educators, parents, business groups and labor unions.
The initiative would take away all or part of a school's state funding if it is found to violate the law.
Most educators interviewed this week see the initiative as unneeded and unwanted. The idea that there is a homosexual agenda in public education leaves them scratching their heads.
\"We never have encouraged, promoted or sanctioned any kind of sexual behavior,\" said Betsy Cole, who oversees counseling program in Portland's public schools.
....
The Oregon Republican Party endorsed the initiative last June, and national conservative groups say the issue will attract conservative and moderate support.
Rep. Kevin Mannix, R-Portland, says he will vote for the initiative.
\"I have read it very carefully,\" said Mannix, who is vice-chairman of the state Republican Party and a candidate for attorney general. \"And its actual words say that we shouldn't be validating homosexual conduct in schools. I agree with that simple message.\"
....
Lindsey Buchanan, founder of the Gay/Straight Alliance at Tigard High School, is appalled by the proposal.
....
QUOTE
Kulongoski projected to win governor's race
Wednesday, November 6, 2002
From The Oregonian
The Oregonian Wednesday afternoon projected that Ted Kulongoski will be Oregon's next governor.
While holding a statewide lead of about 2,600 votes as of 1:30 p.m., the newspaper believes Kulongoski's lead will increase as counting continues on some 70,000 remaining ballots in Multnomah County, a traditional Democratic county.
Kulongoski's lead over the Republican candidate, Kevin Mannix, is nearly 2 to 1 in the urban county.
....
Wednesday, November 6, 2002
From The Oregonian
The Oregonian Wednesday afternoon projected that Ted Kulongoski will be Oregon's next governor.
While holding a statewide lead of about 2,600 votes as of 1:30 p.m., the newspaper believes Kulongoski's lead will increase as counting continues on some 70,000 remaining ballots in Multnomah County, a traditional Democratic county.
Kulongoski's lead over the Republican candidate, Kevin Mannix, is nearly 2 to 1 in the urban county.
....
[ March 03, 2004, 02:48 PM: Message edited by: twin58 ]
Oh my god, this is so damn hilarious, Mike Webb the gay talk show host on KIRO Radio is interviewing this Lon Mabon guy from the Oregon Citizen's Alliance, some sort of Christian Anti-Gay organization that starts all these anti-gay initiatives and this guy doesnt realize that he's making fun of him. They are going into all these topics about beastiality and necrophilia.
Listen Here, pretty funny.
[ March 03, 2004, 11:40 PM: Message edited by: CnSEA ]
Listen Here, pretty funny.
[ March 03, 2004, 11:40 PM: Message edited by: CnSEA ]
I got a call from brother Clayton today and indeed, he and his partner of 10 years, Michael, got hitched up in Portland. He's the favorite of my four siblings and his partner Michael is a great guy. I'm really, really happy for them.
After the disappointing news that came from Wisconsin and Kansas yesterday (where both legislatures moved forward to amend their state constitutions) we did get some good news from the Maryland House of Delegates on Friday, where a committee voted down TWO anti-gay proposals that still leaves MD as one of 12 states (at least at the moment anyway) that have NOT passed any DOMA-related law....as detailed in this morning's Washington Post, the committee not only defeated one bill (by a 13-7 vote) that "would have amended the constitution to define marriage as being between a man and a woman" but also voted 11 to 9 to "reject a bill that would have prohibited recognition of a same-sex marriage performed elsewhere".
Despite the expected outcry from the Family Protection Lobby, the Maryland Catholic Conference and some Republicans who fear that a judge could require the state to recognize same-sex marriages that were performed in another state (oh the horror that would result from THAT! ), even homophobic Republican Governor Robert Ehrlich (who I did NOT vote for in 2002 and hopefully will be out of office in 2006) softened his stance considerably....while still referring to marriage as "an institution that needs to be protected" the Governor refused to endorse the FMA and even went so far as to say that "what people do in their private bedrooms is their own business".
While we all know that this fight for equality involves FAR MORE than the "sexual issues" that all these right-wing religious fundamentalists keep bringing up, it is nevertheless a good sign to see a noted bigot like Bob Ehrlich indirectly acknowledge a "chink in his armor" and at least confirm that endorsing the FMA is going WAY too far.
[ March 06, 2004, 11:46 AM: Message edited by: gamecock ]
Despite the expected outcry from the Family Protection Lobby, the Maryland Catholic Conference and some Republicans who fear that a judge could require the state to recognize same-sex marriages that were performed in another state (oh the horror that would result from THAT!
), even homophobic Republican Governor Robert Ehrlich (who I did NOT vote for in 2002 and hopefully will be out of office in 2006) softened his stance considerably....while still referring to marriage as "an institution that needs to be protected" the Governor refused to endorse the FMA and even went so far as to say that "what people do in their private bedrooms is their own business".While we all know that this fight for equality involves FAR MORE than the "sexual issues" that all these right-wing religious fundamentalists keep bringing up, it is nevertheless a good sign to see a noted bigot like Bob Ehrlich indirectly acknowledge a "chink in his armor" and at least confirm that endorsing the FMA is going WAY too far.
[ March 06, 2004, 11:46 AM: Message edited by: gamecock ]
Gamecock, that's good news about MD. And not just for MD. According to the head of HCR (by way of the Washington Post),
QUOTE
[T]he decision by Maryland lawmakers might help to slow efforts in other states to oppose same-sex marriage.
'It becomes part of the firewall of states that is teaching others in the country that it is better for states to embrace all families, and this is the right message to sendd to their business community, tourists and families,' [said Cheryl Jaccques,' president of HRC].
Jim, congrats to your brother and his husband. We're to say husband, right?
'It becomes part of the firewall of states that is teaching others in the country that it is better for states to embrace all families, and this is the right message to sendd to their business community, tourists and families,' [said Cheryl Jaccques,' president of HRC].
This is kind of complicated but the mayor of Seattle signed an executive order, saying that Seattle has to recognize gay marriages. People cant get married here, because I guess that has to be decided on a state or county level, but the city has to recognize marriages from San Francisco and Portland. And companies doing business in the city would have to recognize them also or extend equal benefits.
[ March 08, 2004, 10:33 PM: Message edited by: CnSEA ]
[ March 08, 2004, 10:33 PM: Message edited by: CnSEA ]
TF, sorry it took so long to reply, thanks for that. Dunno, my brother is very, very butch--he's a defenseman on his gay hockey team etc.--and every single one of his boyfriends have been mincing nancy boys, so maybe! It's always a problem:
Boyfriend? (no sense of permanance) Partner? (in what? a law firm? an accounting firm?) Domestic partner? (Oh, puh-leeze, Mary) Lover? (Too 70's) etc. etc.
In light of the CA Supremes halting the issuance of marriage licenses, how does this affect you and Boston Girl, Gator Jamie? Since it appears the ruling today means that a more definitive answer won't happen until May or June, are the guys in Northern California going to have to cancel any meet-up y'all had planned?
Boyfriend? (no sense of permanance) Partner? (in what? a law firm? an accounting firm?) Domestic partner? (Oh, puh-leeze, Mary) Lover? (Too 70's) etc. etc.
In light of the CA Supremes halting the issuance of marriage licenses, how does this affect you and Boston Girl, Gator Jamie? Since it appears the ruling today means that a more definitive answer won't happen until May or June, are the guys in Northern California going to have to cancel any meet-up y'all had planned?
QUOTE
Purdue Fan:
Multnomah County, where Portland, Oregon is, joins the party
A couple of news photos caught my eye, this great couple from Portland (Tonka, is that you? Multnomah County, where Portland, Oregon is, joins the party
), and in the one from Boston, note, in the bottom right corner, the well-scrubbed young man who's stepped right out of Angels in America...[ March 13, 2004, 06:45 PM: Message edited by: redsoxbreath ]
Well, I suppose I should not be shocked, but I am - the government is now going after religious organizations that marry gay people:
If the FMA ever does pass, God forbid, how quickly until the "Christians" who fight gay rights will attempt to stop gay-friendly churches from marrying couples - and what about reception halls, etc.? Will there be laws barring us from even having commitment ceremonies, because they might "look" like marriages? How about that for a slippery slope? Give me a f**king break!
MSNBC Coverage
QUOTE
Two Unitarian Universalist ministers were charged Monday for marrying 13 same-sex couples, thrusting the clergy into the legal battle over gay marriage in New York.
Ministers Kay Greenleaf and Dawn Sangrey were charged with multiple counts of solemnizing a marriage without a license, the same charges leveled against New Paltz Mayor Jason West, who last month drew the state into the widening national debate over same-sex unions.
Ulster County District Attorney Donald Williams said before Monday’s charges were handed down it would be more difficult considering charges against clergy as opposed to an elected official because the clergy had not sworn to uphold the law.
EXACTLY Mr. Williams - what clergy do in the privacy of their church is their business.Ministers Kay Greenleaf and Dawn Sangrey were charged with multiple counts of solemnizing a marriage without a license, the same charges leveled against New Paltz Mayor Jason West, who last month drew the state into the widening national debate over same-sex unions.
Ulster County District Attorney Donald Williams said before Monday’s charges were handed down it would be more difficult considering charges against clergy as opposed to an elected official because the clergy had not sworn to uphold the law.
If the FMA ever does pass, God forbid, how quickly until the "Christians" who fight gay rights will attempt to stop gay-friendly churches from marrying couples - and what about reception halls, etc.? Will there be laws barring us from even having commitment ceremonies, because they might "look" like marriages? How about that for a slippery slope? Give me a f**king break!
MSNBC Coverage
Well, Multnomah County, Oregon, will keep issuing marriage licenses until they're told to stop. (Will GJ and BG have to change their itinerary yet again?)
Some sweet photos from Portland (click Next).
[ March 15, 2004, 04:20 PM: Message edited by: redsoxbreath ]
Some sweet photos from Portland (click Next).
[ March 15, 2004, 04:20 PM: Message edited by: redsoxbreath ]
QUOTE
CPT_Doom
EXACTLY Mr. Williams - what clergy do in the privacy of their church is their business.
Uhhh, even when it involves the altar boys?
EXACTLY Mr. Williams - what clergy do in the privacy of their church is their business.
A fascinating move by those who are trying to position the fight against gay marriage as a "religious freedom" issue.
QUOTE
redsoxbreath:
Will GJ and BG have to change their itinerary yet again
lol - we're gonna have to get one of those outline maps that some people put on RV's. Instead of coloring in the states that we've visited, we'll color in the states (and provinces) that recognize our relationship. Will GJ and BG have to change their itinerary yet again
JimAllen, we're bummed about SF, but it doesn't really change anything for us. We're still getting married in Vermont (in an Episcopal church, no less) in July. The SF event was just going to be a prologue. We're still going to SF the weekend after next, though, for a ceremony honoring the (still-valid) wedding of two good friends - guys that have been together for 11 years.
Oregon records gay marriages
QUOTE
An appellate ruling means more than 3,000 licenses for same-sex couples will be registered, but their validity is still in question
Saturday, July 10, 2004
NOELLE CROMBIE
Oregon began recording thousands of marriage licenses for same-sex couples Friday after the Court of Appeals lifted a temporary ban, but state officials said those marriages will not be considered valid.
Within hours of the appellate court's decision, state officials started processing the more than 3,000 licenses of same-sex couples who got married in March and April, said Jennifer Woodward, the state registrar for vital records.
But registering the licenses does not mean the state will recognize them, said Kevin Neely, a spokesman for the Oregon Department of Justice. He said the validity of the licenses will be decided by the court or the Legislature.
\"The state will not be treating these as valid marriages,\" Neely said. \"They will simply be registered marriages.\"
....
Saturday, July 10, 2004
NOELLE CROMBIE
Oregon began recording thousands of marriage licenses for same-sex couples Friday after the Court of Appeals lifted a temporary ban, but state officials said those marriages will not be considered valid.
Within hours of the appellate court's decision, state officials started processing the more than 3,000 licenses of same-sex couples who got married in March and April, said Jennifer Woodward, the state registrar for vital records.
But registering the licenses does not mean the state will recognize them, said Kevin Neely, a spokesman for the Oregon Department of Justice. He said the validity of the licenses will be decided by the court or the Legislature.
\"The state will not be treating these as valid marriages,\" Neely said. \"They will simply be registered marriages.\"
....
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.