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charliecstl
Now that the entire country of Iraq has been searched, and those thousands of TONS of WMD materials remain unaccounted for, the teams directly responsible for finding them are being sent home.

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The 75th Exploitation Task Force, as the group is formally known, has been described from the start as the principal component of the U.S. plan to discover and display forbidden Iraqi weapons. The group's departure, expected next month, marks a milestone in frustration for a major declared objective of the war.

...

Scores of fruitless missions broke that confidence, many task force members said in interviews.
and

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Motivated and accomplished in their fields, task force members found themselves lacking vital tools. They consistently found targets identified by Washington to be inaccurate, looted and burned, or both. Leaders and members of five of the task force's eight teams, and some senior officers guiding them, said the weapons hunters were going through the motions now to \"check the blocks\" on a prewar list.

U.S. Central Command began the war with a list of 19 top weapons sites. Only two remain to be searched. Another list enumerated 68 top \"non-WMD sites,\" without known links to special weapons but judged to have the potential to offer clues. Of those, the tally at midweek showed 45 surveyed without success.

Task Force 75's experience, and its impending dissolution after seven weeks in action, square poorly with assertions in Washington that the search has barely begun.

In his declaration of victory aboard the USS Abraham Lincoln on May 1, President Bush said, \"We've begun the search for hidden chemical and biological weapons, and already know of hundreds of sites that will be investigated.\" Stephen A. Cambone, undersecretary of defense for intelligence, told reporters at the Pentagon on Wednesday that U.S. forces had surveyed only 70 of the roughly 600 potential weapons facilities on the \"integrated master site list\" prepared by U.S. intelligence agencies before the war.

But here on the front lines of the search, the focus is on a smaller number of high-priority sites, and the results are uniformly disappointing, participants said.
I guess the imminent threat must not have been so imminent, and the stockpiles of weapons that could wipe out the world were not so real. So much easier for this to come to light now, though, when the deed is done and people have moved back to trying to find work, scouring their investment reports for some sign of life, and watching our President pretend that he once was a combat pilot in his life.

WMD Teams Coming Home Without Success
Herr Tiggee
History will prove that (a) there really weren't any WMD or (cool.gif all that Shrub really accomplished was to spur Saddam into transferring ownership of the WMD to the terrorists prior to the war.

I'd be a whole lot happier if the answer proves to be "a". Otherwise, Saddam may have the last laugh. If the reports are true, he moved tons of material into Syria just prior to the war. Said material may already be in Paris, Rome, the Gaza strip....you get the idea.

What would world reaction be if chem/bio attacks begin in multiple foreign capitals? Hint - it sure won't assuage any of the virulent anti-Americanism sweeping the planet.
fantomas
Look, we know Saddam had some biological and chemcial weapons. The US, France, Germany, Russia, etc. helped him purchase, develop and weaponize them. He used them during the Iran-Iraq War, he used them against the Kurds in Halabja, he threatened to use them in the First Gulf War. We destroyed many of them then or HE destroyed many of them then (1991), and the weapons inspections process kept his vile ass under wraps. He WANTED more, but he wasn't able to develop them. We KNEW this. Syria may be bold and brazen but they sure in the hell are not harboring all his weapons--which he never had.

Because that's the truth--he had NOWHERE near the huge weaponized amounts that W. (and Lebby and Powell) claimed, and they knew it. Just like they knew there were no Saddam-Al Qaeda links. Osama is now getting exactly what he wanted: a torn up, bombed out Iraq, for recruiting purposes; Aghanistan slowly succumbing to the Taliban at its borders again; the US out of Saudi Arabia, leaving it even more vulnerable for revolution; and an intransigent Sharon not budging on the setttlements, which will only whip the Islamic fanatics into a more extreme froth. They're now coming from Britain to blow themselves up in Israel!
RazorbackTX
Top Ten President Bush Excuses For Not Finding Weapons of Mass Destruction


10. "We've only looked through 99% of the country"

9. "We spent entire budget making those playing cards"

8. "Containers are labeled in some crazy language"

7. "They must have been stolen by some of them evil X-Men mutants"

6. "Did I say Iraq has weapons of mass destruction? I meant they have goats"

5. "How are we supposed to find weapons of mass destruction when we can't even find Cheney?"

4. "Still screwed up because of Daylight Savings Time"

3. "When you're trying to find something, it's always in the last place you look, am I right, people?"

2. "Let's face it -- I ain't exactly a genius"

1. "Geraldo took them"
fantomas
The freaking lies just get more outrageous by the day! Now Douglas Feith, one of the architects of the Iraq War, is coming up with "pessimistic" justifications for why no WMDs are being found. Yeah right. We've got that whole damned country under lockdown, troops everywhere, and we can neither find Saddam nor these weapons. How do these liars sleep at night?

US Today: Doug Feith: It's gonna take years

"True lies":

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But senior officials, including President Bush (news - web sites), now say that though they are confident prewar intelligence estimates will be proven correct, the weapons have been destroyed, moved to another country or are so well concealed by members of Saddam's regime that it will take much longer to find them than originally expected. Feith called the U.S. weapons hunt ''a huge undertaking. . . . We are in the early stages of this effort. We have found evidence of WMD programs, but we have a long way to go before we can gain a complete understanding of them.''


Tests continue on two trailers that U.S. officials suspect were being used as mobile weapons labs by the Iraqi regime. Feith and Schwartz said no conclusions have been reached about the trailers.


In his appearance before the U.N. Security Council on Feb. 5, Secretary of State Colin Powell (news - web sites) said Iraq had as many as 18 of the labs, any one of which could produce enough biological weapons in a month to kill ''thousands upon thousands.''


[ May 17, 2003, 10:19 PM: Message edited by: fantomas ]
sportinlife
Perhaps the biggest problem in locating WMD's if they exist is the dependence on information gained by coercion. It is not necessary to impose the archaic methods used for instance on Guy Fawkes to get information out of suspects, but the information gained may be equally misleading.

The questioner has a tendency to believe what is convenient or extract what is convenient either deliberately or inadvertently through coercion.
fantomas
"We've got hundreds of sites to exploit, looking for chemical and biological weapons that we know Saddam Hussein had prior to our entrance into Iraq."
--G. W. Bush, Santa Clara, CA, May 2, 2003
shawnq
A simply amazing admission from a US WMD inspector at: Official: Saddam Scientists Justified War
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The U.S.-led invasion of Iraq was justified in part because Saddam Hussein retained scientists capable of building nuclear weapons, Washington's top arms control official said Thursday.

In an interview with The Associated Press, John Bolton, undersecretary of state for arms control, said that whether Saddam's regime actually possessed weapons of mass destruction \"isn't really the issue.\"

p2insdca
Hey MIB didnt you tell us next month was when the report would be released showing they had been found?
shawnq
News is starting to come in regarding the report on our unsuccessful search for the WMDs. Iraq WMD report shelved due to lack of evidence
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London: After failing to get any evidence of weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, the US and Britain have decided to delay indefinitely the publication of a full report on the controversial issue, media reported today.
Efforts by the Iraq Survey Group, an Anglo-American team of 1,400 scientists, military and intelligence experts, to scour Iraq for the past four months to uncover evidence of chemical or biological weapons have so far ended in failure, The Sunday Times claimed in its report.
Good thing we now have that flypaper theory thing to justify the war.
(I would link to the Sunday Times of London, but it requires a subscription.)

[ September 15, 2003, 12:12 AM: Message edited by: shawnq ]
fantomas
To go back to a very basic question: where are all those weapons of mass destruction?
RazorbackTX
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fantomas:
To go back to a very basic question: where are all those weapons of mass destruction?
"We know where they are. They're in the area around Tikrit and Baghdad and east, west, south and north somewhat".

Donald Rumsfeld, Secretary of Defense
ABC Interview
3/30/2003
_________________________________________________

Clearly he knows where they are, I dont understand why they dont search there. ?????
ung
Rumsfeld and Cheney both barely mumbled incoherent statements in reply yesterday when asked about the continued absence of proof for The Bush claims to justify war. But in continued signs of idiocy, they kept stating "they will be found"

as for the theory that all the weapons were trasnferred to terrorists (see above posts), it's unlikely. mainly because of the incredibly paranoid nature of Saddam Hussein. He would never have given some other party all his weapons. Had he done so, that would have been seen as too much of a threat to his power from within his own country.
RazorbackTX
Where did all the Bush cheerleaders run off too? No comments boys?
PAdallascowboy
What Bush did was right. HOw long can we keep monitoring a country. Sadamm was a threat to the peacce of the world. He wouldn't let inspectors in for 12 years, we did the right thing. Times have changed my friend...it's better to take action instead of waiting for after the fact to happen. Your one of these people who are the first to denounce a war but the first to take action after someone comes into this country and kills another 3,000 people.
CPT_Doom
QUOTE
What Bush did was right. HOw long can we keep monitoring a country. Sadamm was a threat to the peacce of the world. He wouldn't let inspectors in for 12 years, we did the right thing. Times have changed my friend...it's better to take action instead of waiting for after the fact to happen. Your one of these people who are the first to denounce a war but the first to take action after someone comes into this country and kills another 3,000 people.
Saddam was/is a horrible monster/tyrant/dictator, whatever you want to call him. The West has known about him and his crimes against his own people since the mid-80s at least (certainly since 1990). However, inspectors were in the country until 1998 (that was five years, not 12) and it is pretty clear from the available evidence that Saddam was not a threat to the US , which was the specific reason Bush used to justify the invasion. Iraq did not support the 9/11 terrorists (unlike say, our "ally" Saudi Arabia) and had almost no links to Al Queda, being a secular and therefore questionable regime in Osama's eyes. It is the US invasion that has created the links to Al Queda that did not previously exist.

There are any number of rogue nations/dicatators that represent a threat to world/regional piece, including powers with nuclear weapons that can reach the US. That cannot be used as a justification for this war.
p2insdca
[QUOTE]Originally posted by PAdallascowboy:
[QB] Times have changed my friend...it's better to take action instead of waiting for after the fact to happen. Your one of these people who are the first to denounce a war but the first to take action after someone comes into this country and kills another 3,000 people.
1) Sadam had Nothing to do with 9/11, Osama is still on the loose- we need to go after him
2) Now we have streched our forces to the breaking point..what if we are needed else where?
3) The world thinks we are a greater threat to peace..kinda hard to see how this helps make us safe
4) The money we are pouring down the drain is being taken away from police and fire departments here..You are not safer today
fantomas
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PAdallascowboy:
What Bush did was right. HOw long can we keep monitoring a country. Sadamm was a threat to the peacce of the world. He wouldn't let inspectors in for 12 years, we did the right thing. Times have changed my friend...it's better to take action instead of waiting for after the fact to happen. Your one of these people who are the first to denounce a war but the first to take action after someone comes into this country and kills another 3,000 people.
Well, what's never discussed is that if Norad had scrambled those fighter jets as it was supposed to, 2,900 people would not have died. Why don't we ever hear anything about this gross failure by our military to protect us? Why weren't those jets in the air? We do have the best air force in the world--perhaps in history--but this basic failure to intercept even ONE of those jets--especially the second one heading to WTC II and the one that smashed into our Pentagon (OUR MILITARY DEFENSE HEADQUARTERS, people!) strikes me as one of the most serious derelictions we've witnessed. Why do we not hear more about what exactly caused this lapse? Are we still vulnerable on this account?

Second, the weapons of mass distraction have proved to be so. We keep hearing that Iraq is the size of California, etc., that Saddam could have shipped the damned things out, and so on, but there were a number of charges that the administration made that just have not come to fruit (thankfully). First,
  • *Saddam had massive amounts of weapons, delineated in speeches and comments by W, Powell, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, Perle, Feith, etc., and we supposedly had accurate intel on where they were so that once we invaded we would easily find and disarm or destroy them (but none have been found and we hear very little about the \"accuracy\" of all that now obviously dummy or fake intel);
    *Saddam had weaponized a sizable number of these weapons (but he didn't because he didn't have them);
    *Saddam was going to use them against the advancing US and British forces (he didn't because he didn't have them);
    *Saddam in a last ditch effort, like a trapped rat, was going to unleash them (he didn't because he didn't have them);
    *Saddam was going to give them to Al Qaeda (but he hasn't because his links with AQ were non-existent, Osama, AQ and the Taliban were already testing their own chemical agents in Afghanistan, and as we're now seeing, the Saddamist elements, like AQ, are using conventional weapons--handheld rocket launchers, grenades, handmade bombs, etc.--to harass and kill US troops and Iraqis.

If the intel was this awful on Iraq, how on earth can we feel any more comfortable about either our intel services' ability to predict and defuse future terrorist attacks on our soil or off it, or the administration's ability to inform and protect the American people?

[ September 16, 2003, 07:01 AM: Message edited by: fantomas ]
mdphl
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p2insdca:
Hey MIB didnt you tell us next month was when the report would be released showing they had been found?
p2 -- I have been holding my breath ever since he told us that friends in high places told HIM that something big would develop regarding WMD. Also, I have been waiting for the Dean bombshell he promised.
RazorbackTX
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PAdallascowboy:
Times have changed my friend...it's better to take action instead of waiting for after the fact to happen.
When should we start the bombing of North Korea, my friend?
p2insdca
Those on the right are waiting to be told how to respond to your questions.
mdphl
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RazorbackTX:
QUOTE
PAdallascowboy:
Times have changed my friend...it's better to take action instead of waiting for after the fact to happen.
When should we start the bombing of North Korea, my friend?
When should we start the bombing of Saudi Arabia, my friends?

BTW guys - congrats on the Cowboy's win.
RazorbackTX
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p2insdca:
Hey MIB didnt you tell us next month was when the report would be released showing they had been found?
MIB seems to have gone AWOL.
Maybe those voices he's hearing have told him to stay away..... what gives "judge" ???
p2insdca
Hmm...http://abcnews.go.com/wire/Politics/reuters20030915_578.html
fantomas
QUOTE
p2insdca:
Those on the right are waiting to be told how to respond to your questions.
It would be interesting to hear what the latest theories are. What's Faux saying? What about that dude Kay that Rumzey has looking into this over there? How could so many intelligent people have been so grossly duped?

I did read or see something about the Bekaa Valley in Lebanon, which would necessitate a war with Syria-Lebanon to actually get at those weapons. Pretty scary since Lebanon is a non-functional state and anyone could get ahold of things buried/stored/kept there, but Saddam did what was most convenient. Of course no one saw or witnessed or surveilled the movement of all those dangerous weapons (not even the Mossad, which keeps a close eye on powderkeg Lebanon), but since there don't appear to be any other outlandish explanations, maybe Bekaa is it.

NOT.

[ September 18, 2003, 08:51 PM: Message edited by: fantomas ]
p2insdca
one more reason turns into a dead end
http://msnbc.com/news/968663.asp
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