Unbelievable. So now Pat Robertson says that we should asassinate the President of Venezuela because he is "destabilizing South America"?? But, Pat, why not Kim Jong Il Or Fidel Castro? I have to wonder how many of his supporters would actually support this?

Those pesky Commandments--always getting in the way.

Love thy neighbor, forgive thy enemy, turn the other cheek...now replaced by murder someone you disagree with -- another loving Christian Man of Gawd. eek!

What a Christian thing for St. Pat to say.

Aren't Fat Pat, Falwell, and now Bush the false prophets predicted in Revelations?

Well, the U.S. has tried, repeatedly, to assassinate Fidel. Got nowhere. Obviously Cuba has a pretty good intelligence system, and equally obviously their president doesn't go on vacation when he gets a memo that someone is determined to attack inside Cuba.
Maybe Robertson, not known for wanting to live hard, thinks Chavez is an easier target.

And Venezuela has oil too!

Maybe Robertson believes the theory that Natalee Holloway was kidnapped into white slavery and taken to Venezuela. Or perhaps donations to his church are down from the Venezuelan people.

Anybody ever see the South Park episode where teh gang are trying to saave their friend Starvin' Marvin and are trying to evade Robertson in a spaceship? Robertson is on TV begging his flock to send more money to combat the ship. Very funny stuff!

BTW, I wouldn't hate it if some Venezuelan (or American, Ugandan or anyone else) decided that Robertson needed to be taken out.

Well, the Gospel According to Pat also tells us

Yeah, and Christianity has nothing like that in its 2,000 year history. Nothing. Nope. Not even a crackhead old f**king bastard going on his jackleg tv show advocating the assassination of a foreign head of state.

It's shocking that this man still has an following. Is it any wonder why people who struggle with faith find no comfort from some of our "religious" leaders. The double-standard & hypocricy, however standarad and normal from these religious zealots is still a suprise each and every time they run their mouths.

Funny how he thinks everyone else is going to have to answer for their sins, but him.

It's shocking that this man still has an following. Is it any wonder why people who struggle with faith find no comfort from some of our "religious" leaders. The double-standard & hypocricy, however standarad and normal from these religious zealots is still a suprise each and every time they run their mouths.

Funny how he thinks everyone else is going to have to answer for their sins, but him.

Originally posted by shep71:

It's shocking that this man still has an following. Is it any wonder why people who struggle with faith find no comfort from some of our "religious" leaders. The double-standard & hypocricy, however standarad and normal from these religious zealots is still a suprise each and every time they run their mouths.

Amen shep71! Jesus had a term for these religious zealots, "Hypocrites!"

John the Baptist had an even greater term for these religious bigots, "Brood of Vipers!"

It's amazing how people like Pat R. & his followers don't read between the line of Jesus' example of who He hung out w/ & reached out to--the marginalized of society. Christ (John the Baptisit, too) warned us about having a self righteous attitude/belief and participating in oppressing any human(s). But when it came to the religious leaders of His time (and I believe our time also), Jesus had/s DIRE WARNINGS about self righteousness & more importantly participating in the oppression of those marginalized by the popular society/government/religious institution(s). They (the religious leaders) are supposed to be examples of HIS message of unconditional love. They should be shepherds of HIS sheep. And if they lead HIS sheep astray, "Woe to them!" They WILL have to anwser for their hate, bigotry, & oppressive actions and sermons. I am certain of this.

I call upon the Southern Baptist Convention to renounce the jihadist and assassinist beliefs of Pat Robertson and cast him out of their faith!

So, I guess he's only pro-life until the fetus is born...then, it's fair game.

Aggie, the "Right to Life" ONLY applies to fetuses, stem cells and occasionally a white woman in a persistent vegetative state.

Dammit, how do I keep all these technicalities separated in my mind?

The Venezuelan veep suggests prosecuting Robertson for making terrorist threats.

Except Raving Pat merely suggested the US government illegally kill a head of state, and we know that doesn't meet Uncle Sam's standards of 'terror.'

Must be another proud day for you republicans.
"Take him, he's yours."

I think Killer Pat's comments also reveal what's underneath so many of our right wingers' claim to holiness and great faith: the desire to remove/isolate and even kill those who don't follow their way. Sound like any other extremists out there?

Not very pro-life, Mr. Robertson, is it? What a hypocrite--not to mention an idiot.

Just where the hell is Pat going to find a Muslim in Venezuela. Last time I was there it was a heavily Roman Catholic nation. Also when I looked it up President Chavez was a legally democratically elected head of state, and democracy is supposed to be an American value. Of course Pat is the same man who links feminism to witch craft and lesbianism. Gotta wonder if his TV followers are as insane and out of touch as he comes across.

In his mind, anyone who is not pro-Bush is a muslim terrorist.

Do you think the Reverand Pat Robertson wears a "WWJA" bracelet--Who Would Jesus Assassinate?

Robertson's level of hypocrisy has no bottom: he denounces gambling but owns a race horse, denounces abortion as a sin but does business with the Chinese government even though one of their policies is forced abortions...

Has anyone from this Administration said anything stronger than Rumsfeld's rather tepid "we can't do that; it's illegal" take on Robertson's comments? A strong, unequivicocal condemnation of Robertson is in order.

~Adam

Hitler was democratically elected, too, you know.

Chavez is a lunatic dictator, but that doesn't mean Robertson should be advocating the U.S. assassinate Chavez.

Methinks Pat's been consuming a wee bit much of his "Pat Diet Shake."

My friend suggested that the "inappropriate" response was accurate - they may have been planning such a maneuver, and now Pat's gone and warned the guy. Nice move, Pat.

LXN

dude wants to keep a veggie lady in state at all costs and err on the side of life, but wants to knock off a head of state???

I swear, being the PR spin guy for Robertson has to be one of the toughest jobs in America...how's he get out of this one.

Kim Jung Il seems way kookier than Chavez. Why doesn't Pat say something about him as well? Is it all about the oil?

What's dangerous about this is that what's good for the goose is good for the gander. What if some foreign religious leader were to say, "Bush should be assasinated." How would Bush and his Christian supporters react to that? They'd be calling for a holy war. And what if some kook follows through with Robertson's orders? Lord knows followers have assasinated abortion doctors because their Christian leader made them believe it was a good thing. Assasinating a world leader on any side of the fence can only lead to trouble...

[ August 23, 2005, 08:54 PM: Message edited by: canmark ]

We now have the Howard Dean of the Christian Right here. Two nutjobs. (Of course, Dean hasn't advocated assassinating anyone, as far as we know.)

The condemnation of Robertson by all those in the Christian leadership should be universal and unanimous. Sadly it isn't. Fortunately, some have condemned him, but too many have yet to do so.

Don't these people realize they're contradicting what Christ stood for? Christianity is not selective here. We do not get to say we're Christians yet claim some exception for murdering a foreign country's dictator who currently poses no threat to us. If Chavez was threatening war with us, or if he declared war on us, he could be treated differently; but he hasn't.

I don't purport to know what's in the mind of my Lord Jesus Christ, but I'm willing to bet such ridiculous comments by someone who claims to be a disciple of His makes him truly sad.

Didn't Christ Himself rail against hypocrites so vehemently in the Bible? Mr. Robertson ought to reread those passages.

[ August 23, 2005, 10:15 PM: Message edited by: MIB ]

Goldwater predicted long ago that the marriage of the Republian party to the religious right would in the long run be the downfall of the party. Give it time. Guys like Fat Pat, as he's known in Va Beach, will send more and more people away from the party. Give it time.

I knew you'd find a way to twist history.

Hitler engineered his control of Germany through trickery. The Nazis, who violently attacked Communists, staged brutal attacks on the Socialists, and even assassinated right wing politicians (like Chancellor Franz von Papen) did not win an outright majority of seats in the Reichstag in 1933 when Hitler, after several attempts at manipulating President von Hindenburg, finally gained the Chancellorship. After President von Hindenburg died, the fascist leader called a referendum in which the Socialist and Communist parties and their supporters were threatened and intimidated, jailed or killed, and seized power that way. That does not constitute "democratically" elected, except I guess in your books.

Chavez is not a dictator. He won 56% of the vote in 1998, was reelected by a larger margin in 2000, won a recall referendum in 2002, and probably will be reelected by over 60% next year. As far as I recall, George W. Bush has never won more than 52% of the vote; he didn't even win a majority of either popular or electoral votes in 2000. Venezuela's elections have fewer problems than the ones in the US.

Before you make your usual inane pronouncements, try to get some facts under your "robes." God help those who encounter you "in court."

Kim Jung Il has nukes and no oil. Nukes that W is steadily allowing him to accumulate. Then there is Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, the virulently anti-American president of Iran, whose country is acquiring nukes, hates the US and Israel, and is actively destabilizing Iraq. Then there is the murderous president of Zimbabwe, who thumbs his nose at the US and Britain, seizes land and oppresses his own people...then there's the nutcase "presidents" of Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, Tajikistan, etc., who think nothing of gross corruption, issuing fanatical edicts, killing their citizenry, etc. But hey, Chavez was only elected by popular majorities twice, heads the world's fifth largest oil producer, and is close to Castro. So he's got a bead on him. Ask Condi and Rummy--they were trash-talking the man repeatedly over the last few years.

[ August 23, 2005, 11:22 PM: Message edited by: fantomas ]

Ding ding ding to Dinger...correct in both posts. Welcome to the downfall of the Republican party. See, I told you we would make it though all this insanity better than O.K.!

True, but will the Dems be an alternative.? They recently made another failed attempt to put forth a coherent policy on Iraq, and have zealously taken on a veneer of religiosity. Is lying low while the Repubs take the storm enough?

Here's a list of some of Pat's choice quotes. He really is such a lovely man, isn't he? Can you imagine if his bid for the presidency was a success? Shudder!

Thanks for pointing out Robertson's comment about using a small nuke near the State Department. Isn't that a terroristic threat against the USA? And he's concerned about "communist infiltration"? Geezz...I though the Cold War had eneded.

The Bible warns against "false prophets", that anyone who claims that what they say was commanded by God, but actually wasn't is a false prophet. It also says that their main motivation is money and they will be successful. Robertson's CBN media empire and other business ventures have given him a net worth estimated between $200 million and $1 billion.
http://www.brainyencyclopedia.com/encyclop..._robertson.html

Robertson is a certified wacko. He should be condemned by all right-thinking (not a political label) people. He's a walking rationale for the FCC regulatory framework to be extended to cable.

But, then, if assassination of leader is ALL that bad, I guess we need to go after some others who have PUBLICLY endorsed and specifically called for the assassination of then President of Iraq Saddam Hussein. Right? 'Cause, afterall, to many of you here, it IS an unjust war.

Like former Clinton headman George Stephanopolous, ABC newsreader Sam Donaldson, the Left's law darling Cokie Roberts, Newsweek's editor Jonathan Alter and the NYT's Thomas Friedman.

Despite your clucking, Robertson was caught in a delicious moment of para-lockerroom bravado --and he needs to apologize quickly, appear repentant, and give some money to Jessie Jackson's extortion machine as a penance.

Well, at least he had the perspective to recommend only a "small" nuke. He got the location right, but he's about 55 years too late! wink

Seriously, this snake oiler IS nuts and is proving the prophecy of those who knew it would only be a matter of time before the X-tian right started to unravel this way. Where's that rapture when we need it???

As a matter of fact, I do oppose political assassination on principle, no matter who it is or who calls for it.
Not because I'm a pacifist.
Not becuse some don't perhaps deserve it.
But because as a political person I know that as a political strategy it is useless. Change comes about when large numbers of people both want change and feel they can effect it. Even when an assassination was wildly popular with the head of state's own countrypersons (and this has happened) the people are reduced to cheering on the sidelines. And nothing really changes.

Regurgitating GOP talking points again, I see. Equating a man who served honorably and well as the Governor of Vermont with a pseudo-Christian scumbag who has embarrassed the entire country again and again makes absolutely no sense. Robertson is in a class by himself - or more accurately, in the same class as Jerry Fallwell, Lou Sheldon, James Dobson and the rest of the "religious" leaders who continue to pervert the Word of God with their immoral and unAmerican political movement.

I am simply glad that, after literally dozens of comments that proved his lack of moral character and decency, Robertson is being given the kind of press he deserves. It is about time the MSM exposes these charlatans of the Right, who have made a devil's bargain with too much of the GOP to gain political power.

What a hypocrite! I saw the whole story last night and I still can't believe it. The scary part is he actually believes it is the only practical solution. God help this country for the next three years.

Get this, Robertson is now falling back on the old saw of my statement was "out of context."

From a CNN story:

Exactly where was the context that I clearly am missing? At best his explanation still means Robertson was suggesting we illegaly depose of a popularly elected leader.

What a putz!

edited to add link: CNN Coverage

[ August 24, 2005, 10:48 AM: Message edited by: CPT_Doom ]

My God! I cannot believe you actually said such bullshit. Chavez not a dictator??? What exactly have you been smoking?

Chavez manipulated polls and voting not too unlike what Democrats in the U.S. have done over the years. He was hardly democratically elected, and for what it's worth, the guy's a raving loon.

Hitler was elected in the same manner, so I guess they were both democratically
elected.

It's truly amazing how you and your ilk try to justify such people holding office, provided they're ultraleftists. Once they fall into that category, well...that's OK.

Chavez is a nutjob, but that still doesn't mean Robertson was right in saying what he did. Keep the thread on track; I grow tired of having to correct your rose-colored facts all the time.

Of course it makes sense, because both of them have said things that have caused many in their own camps to wish they had just shut up. There are many Dems who so wish Dean wasn't the party chairman. There are many conservatives who wish Robertson wasn't...well, just wasn't.

The very fact you make a comparison between the two is beyond incredible. Dean may be an in-your-face kind of politician, but he has NEVER made claims that could even approach the idiocy of Pat Robertson. Did you take a look at the history of Robertson's comments posted above? I mean, stating the feminism causes women to kill their children? That Planned Parenthood is teaching beastiality? That Episcopalians and Methodists are a product of the AntiChrist?

Not to mention Robertson's little dalliance with one of the worst tyrants on the planet - Mssr. Taylor of Liberia - all to make a buck.

Oh, stop getting your panties all into a tizzy, will ya?

The comparison is valid insofar as they both say stupid things, the degree of what is said being irrelevant. They're both loons, and there are members of both camps that believe this.

Can you EVER come up with proof for your risible assertions? EVER? What proof do you have that Chavez \"manipulated polls and voting?\" You are the one who's been \"smoking\" way too much Faux News crapola mixed with hallucinogens. Provide some objective proof that Chavez manipulated the polls in 1998, in 2000 or during his 2002 recall, and I don't just mean the slanted bs from his opponents, and I'll begin to consider that you're not just pulling rabbits out of your \"robed\" bottom. People are not \"dictators\" because you call them so.

You \"guess\"? Do you ever open a history book? If so, you may want to read up on the series of elections and machinations that led to Hitler becoming Chancellor and then President. He WAS NOT DEMOCRATICALLY elected. It did not work that way in Weimar Germany, which was a parliamentary democracy that he and his murderous party, in conjunction with the Conservatives and the Catholic Center Party, destroyed. Do any of these names mean a thing to you? I \"guess\" not.

No, don't generalize. You and the rest of the right wingers don't like Chavez so you label him a dictator. Unfortunately for you, the majority of people--now over 60%--want to keep him in office. The oligarchs hate him, but not the majority of people. That's called democracy, bub. But there ARE dictators across the globe, more than few in fact, who are not democratically elected. And they're not \"ultraleftists.\" The problem for you and right-wingers like you is that leftists have been democratically elected in Venezuela, Argentina, Brazil, Chile, and Uruguay, as well as in Spain, Portugal, Germany, etc., and very well may take office in Mexico. By democratic means. You right-wingers don't like democracy unless it puts the right wing in office.

Then don't, because your corrections are usually completely wrong. Spend the time correcting your own misimpressions, wrong facts, and so forth, so that others on here won't have to keep doing it for you.

I "guess" Chavez's funding of FARC with oil revenue is perfectly acceptable for this man fantomas refuses to call dictator.

I "guess" Chavez's cozying up to Columbian drug lords is indicative of a democratically elected president.

I "guess" his funding and propping up with oil revenue of fellow dictator Fidel Castro is another characteristic of a democratically elected president.

I have never seen anyone so blind to reality as fantomas, especially if said reality should ever tarnish the image of someone of the Left like Chavez.

BTW, please spare me your asinine references to FOX. I watch multiple news outlets. Always have. Unlike you and your ilk, I don't automatically, instantly, and always discount everything one channel (FOX) says simply because it is a channel I mistakenly believe is on the opposite end of the ideological spectrum (conservative).

Poor fools. Blind in so many ways are you. Closed minds you have.

[ August 24, 2005, 09:33 PM: Message edited by: MIB ]

Wow. You are more naive than I thought was humanly possible. What did you do? Interview 10 Venezuelans, 6 of whom were his relatives who said they like him? Hmm...maybe you cited some CNN poll or something.

[ August 24, 2005, 09:36 PM: Message edited by: MIB ]

As usual you are confusing two different things. The fact of being democratically elected does not equate with the specific policies or actions of a given president. The two are incommensurate categories. You do grasp that, right?

Whatever Chavez is currently doing in terms of his foreign policy, and yes, he is very close to a true dictator, Fidel Castro, as well as to democratically elected leftists in Brazil, Chile, Argentina, Uruguay, etc., he WAS democratically elected. He also is close to non-leftist leaders like Leonel Fernandez Reyna of the Dominican Republic, PJ Patterson of Jamaica, etc. He is even close to the extreme right-wing fanatics in Iran. In any case, Chavez's support of Castro (and other leftists) does not negate his having been elected by a MAJORITY of the voters in Venezuela. I know that basic fact is very hard for you to wrap your mind around--and you can cite any litany of right-wing canards about the man, but the basic fact is that he has won THREE elections. Three. In fact, he won the first one by the largest margin in many years in Venezuelan history. But don't take my word for it. Just go consult any objective guide to recent Venezuelan history, and don't rely on the blather of Pat Robertson, Faux, or your beloved Chicago Tribune.

Oh, and by the way, before you spout any further nonsense about Venezuela, do you even have a clue about the history and political structure of the country and how it came to be the way it is? Do you realize that the decades of oligarchic rule by two colluding parties, and the gross theft by Chavez's predecessor, Perez, so disillusioned the poor and working-classes that they actually elected Chavez, who had attempted a coup against Perez in 1992? Do you also realize that Chavez's allies, utilizing the very democratic franchise the elites had controlled since the country's founding now control the National Assembly, most municipal and local offices, and the Supreme Court? Sort of like the Republican Party in the US. Though without Diebold machines at their service....

[ August 24, 2005, 09:59 PM: Message edited by: fantomas ]