are not at MIT.
If I were president, anybody the Coast Guard encountered traveling from Cuba to the US in an automobile that had been converted to a seagoing vessel would be welcomed aboard the ship. The car would be put on public display, and its passengers would receive a four-year, all expenses paid scholarship to any engineering school at which they had gained acceptance.
Two of the car's passengers had tried this before, in the seagoing 1951 Chevrolet pickup truck. In addtion to those two, there were nine (!) other passengers. Those old cars were really big. My guess, which has been confirmed, is that this one was a 1959 Buick.
[ February 05, 2004, 04:46 PM: Message edited by: twin58 ]
Full Version: The World's Best Mechanical Engineers
If I were president, we would have already invaded Cuba and liberated Castro's subjects so they wouldn't have to risk their lives sneaking over here for a taste of freedom.
[ February 05, 2004, 01:45 PM: Message edited by: William1865 ]
[ February 05, 2004, 01:45 PM: Message edited by: William1865 ]
QUOTE
William1865:
If I were president, we would have already invaded Cuba and liberated Castro's subjects so they wouldn't have to risk their lives sneaking over here for a taste of freedom.
WOW! I am amazed...you have a good idea! I knew if I hung around long enough one would come along...well, that was good while it lasted the one and only time. If I were president, we would have already invaded Cuba and liberated Castro's subjects so they wouldn't have to risk their lives sneaking over here for a taste of freedom.
QUOTE
bobby78751:
WOW! I am amazed...you have a good idea! I knew if I hung around long enough one would come along...well, that was good while it lasted the one and only time.
I slept with your wife.
WOW! I am amazed...you have a good idea! I knew if I hung around long enough one would come along...well, that was good while it lasted the one and only time.
She thought I was better. 
QUOTE
William1865:
You're back to being delusional...I knew the good ideas couldn't last for long. QUOTE
bobby78751:
WOW! I am amazed...you have a good idea! I knew if I hung around long enough one would come along...well, that was good while it lasted the one and only time.
I slept with your wife. WOW! I am amazed...you have a good idea! I knew if I hung around long enough one would come along...well, that was good while it lasted the one and only time.
QUOTE
William1865
If I were president, we would have already invaded Cuba....
You know, that's already been tried. Back in 1961 the CIA was hoping that it could help its longtime business partner the Mafia regain the foothold it once had in Cuba. Google for Bay of Pigs.If I were president, we would have already invaded Cuba....
The Bay of Pigs invasion is well-known. What is not so well-known is the National Security Agency's concurrent plan, \"Operation Northwoods.\"
Operation Northwoods
QUOTE
New book on NSA sheds light on secrets
U.S. terror plan called Cuba invasion pretext
By Scott Shane and Tom Bowman
Sun Staff
Originally published April 24, 2001
WASHINGTON - U.S. military leaders proposed in 1962 a secret plan to commit terrorist acts against Americans and blame Cuba to create a pretext for invasion and the ouster of Communist leader Fidel Castro, according to a new book about the National Security Agency.
\"We could develop a Communist Cuban terror campaign in the Miami area, in other Florida cities and even in Washington,\" said one document reportedly prepared by the Joint Chiefs of Staff. \"We could blow up a U.S. ship in Guantanamo Bay and blame Cuba,\" the document says. \"Casualty lists in U.S. newspapers would cause a helpful wave of indignation.\"
The plan is laid out in documents signed by the five Joint Chiefs but never carried out, according to writer James Bamford in \"Body of Secrets.\" The new history of the Fort Meade-based eavesdropping agency is being released today by Doubleday.
NSA regularly picks up the conversations of suspected terrorist financier Osama bin Laden, says Bamford, and has monitored Chinese and French companies trying to sell missiles to Iran. He provides new details about an Israeli attack on a Navy eavesdropping ship in 1967, suggesting that the sinking was deliberate. And he reveals the loss of an \"entire warehouse\" full of secret cryptographic gear to the North Vietnamese in 1975, at the end of the Vietnam War.
Bamford, a former investigative reporter for ABC News who wrote \"The Puzzle Palace\" about the NSA in 1982, said his new book is based mostly on documents obtained through the Freedom of Information Act or found in government archives. \"NSA never handed me any documents,\" he said. \"It was a question of digging.\"
He said he was most surprised by the anti-Cuba terror plan, code-named Operation Northwoods. It \"may be the most corrupt plan ever created by the U.S. government,\" he writes.
The Northwoods plan also proposed that if the 1962 launch of John Glenn into orbit were to fail, resulting in the astronaut's death, the U.S. government would publicize fabricated evidence that Cuba had used electronic interference to sabotage the flight, the book says.
A previously secret document obtained by Bamford offers further suggestions for mayhem to be blamed on Cuba.
\"We could sink a boatload of Cubans en route to Florida (real or simulated). ... We could foster attempts on lives of Cubans in the United States, even to the extent of wounding in instances to be widely publicized,\" the document says. Another idea was to shoot down a CIA plane designed to replicate a passenger flight and announce that Cuban forces shot it down.
Citing a White House document, Bamford writes that the idea of creating a pretext for the invasion of Cuba might have started with President Dwight D. Eisenhower in the last weeks of his administration, when the plan for an invasion by Cuban exiles trained in the United States was hatched. Carried out in April 1961, soon after Kennedy became president, the Bay of Pigs invasion proved a fiasco. Castro's forces quickly killed or rounded up the invaders.
Army Gen. Lyman L. Lemnitzer, chairman of the Joint Chiefs, presented the Operation Northwoods plan to Kennedy early in 1962, but the president rejected it that March because he wanted no overt U.S. military action against Cuba. Lemnitzer then sought unsuccessfully to destroy all evidence of the plan, according to Bamford.
....
Download the Operation Northwoods .pdf fileU.S. terror plan called Cuba invasion pretext
By Scott Shane and Tom Bowman
Sun Staff
Originally published April 24, 2001
WASHINGTON - U.S. military leaders proposed in 1962 a secret plan to commit terrorist acts against Americans and blame Cuba to create a pretext for invasion and the ouster of Communist leader Fidel Castro, according to a new book about the National Security Agency.
\"We could develop a Communist Cuban terror campaign in the Miami area, in other Florida cities and even in Washington,\" said one document reportedly prepared by the Joint Chiefs of Staff. \"We could blow up a U.S. ship in Guantanamo Bay and blame Cuba,\" the document says. \"Casualty lists in U.S. newspapers would cause a helpful wave of indignation.\"
The plan is laid out in documents signed by the five Joint Chiefs but never carried out, according to writer James Bamford in \"Body of Secrets.\" The new history of the Fort Meade-based eavesdropping agency is being released today by Doubleday.
NSA regularly picks up the conversations of suspected terrorist financier Osama bin Laden, says Bamford, and has monitored Chinese and French companies trying to sell missiles to Iran. He provides new details about an Israeli attack on a Navy eavesdropping ship in 1967, suggesting that the sinking was deliberate. And he reveals the loss of an \"entire warehouse\" full of secret cryptographic gear to the North Vietnamese in 1975, at the end of the Vietnam War.
Bamford, a former investigative reporter for ABC News who wrote \"The Puzzle Palace\" about the NSA in 1982, said his new book is based mostly on documents obtained through the Freedom of Information Act or found in government archives. \"NSA never handed me any documents,\" he said. \"It was a question of digging.\"
He said he was most surprised by the anti-Cuba terror plan, code-named Operation Northwoods. It \"may be the most corrupt plan ever created by the U.S. government,\" he writes.
The Northwoods plan also proposed that if the 1962 launch of John Glenn into orbit were to fail, resulting in the astronaut's death, the U.S. government would publicize fabricated evidence that Cuba had used electronic interference to sabotage the flight, the book says.
A previously secret document obtained by Bamford offers further suggestions for mayhem to be blamed on Cuba.
\"We could sink a boatload of Cubans en route to Florida (real or simulated). ... We could foster attempts on lives of Cubans in the United States, even to the extent of wounding in instances to be widely publicized,\" the document says. Another idea was to shoot down a CIA plane designed to replicate a passenger flight and announce that Cuban forces shot it down.
Citing a White House document, Bamford writes that the idea of creating a pretext for the invasion of Cuba might have started with President Dwight D. Eisenhower in the last weeks of his administration, when the plan for an invasion by Cuban exiles trained in the United States was hatched. Carried out in April 1961, soon after Kennedy became president, the Bay of Pigs invasion proved a fiasco. Castro's forces quickly killed or rounded up the invaders.
Army Gen. Lyman L. Lemnitzer, chairman of the Joint Chiefs, presented the Operation Northwoods plan to Kennedy early in 1962, but the president rejected it that March because he wanted no overt U.S. military action against Cuba. Lemnitzer then sought unsuccessfully to destroy all evidence of the plan, according to Bamford.
....
Another link to Operation Northwoods, from May 1, 2001
QUOTE
Friendly Fire
Book: U.S. Military Drafted Plans to Terrorize U.S. Cities to Provoke War With Cuba
By David Ruppe
N E W Y O R K, May 1 — In the early 1960s, America's top military leaders reportedly drafted plans to kill innocent people and commit acts of terrorism in U.S. cities to create public support for a war against Cuba.
Code named Operation Northwoods, the plans reportedly included the possible assassination of Cuban émigrés, sinking boats of Cuban refugees on the high seas, hijacking planes, blowing up a U.S. ship, and even orchestrating violent terrorism in U.S. cities.
The plans were developed as ways to trick the American public and the international community into supporting a war to oust Cuba's then new leader, communist Fidel Castro.
....
The secret plans came at a time when there was distrust in the military leadership about their civilian leadership, with leaders in the Kennedy administration viewed as too liberal, insufficiently experienced and soft on communism. At the same time, however, there real were concerns in American society about their military overstepping its bounds.
There were reports U.S. military leaders had encouraged their subordinates to vote conservative during the election.
And at least two popular books were published focusing on a right-wing military leadership pushing the limits against government policy of the day. The Senate Foreign Relations Committee published its own report on right-wing extremism in the military, warning a \"considerable danger\" in the \"education and propaganda activities of military personnel\" had been uncovered. The committee even called for an examination of any ties between Lemnitzer and right-wing groups. But Congress didn't get wind of Northwoods, says Bamford.
\"Although no one in Congress could have known at the time,\" he writes, \"Lemnitzer and the Joint Chiefs had quietly slipped over the edge.\"
Even after Lemnitzer was gone, he writes, the Joint Chiefs continued to plan \"pretext\" operations at least through 1963.
One idea was to create a war between Cuba and another Latin American country so that the United States could intervene. Another was to pay someone in the Castro government to attack U.S. forces at the Guantanamo naval base — an act, which Bamford notes, would have amounted to treason. And another was to fly low level U-2 flights over Cuba, with the intention of having one shot down as a pretext for a war.
....
As Harry Browne, for whom I voted in 1996, said, "the difference between the Mafia and the federal government is that the federal government is the organized crime syndicate with flags in front of its offices."
Book: U.S. Military Drafted Plans to Terrorize U.S. Cities to Provoke War With Cuba
By David Ruppe
N E W Y O R K, May 1 — In the early 1960s, America's top military leaders reportedly drafted plans to kill innocent people and commit acts of terrorism in U.S. cities to create public support for a war against Cuba.
Code named Operation Northwoods, the plans reportedly included the possible assassination of Cuban émigrés, sinking boats of Cuban refugees on the high seas, hijacking planes, blowing up a U.S. ship, and even orchestrating violent terrorism in U.S. cities.
The plans were developed as ways to trick the American public and the international community into supporting a war to oust Cuba's then new leader, communist Fidel Castro.
....
The secret plans came at a time when there was distrust in the military leadership about their civilian leadership, with leaders in the Kennedy administration viewed as too liberal, insufficiently experienced and soft on communism. At the same time, however, there real were concerns in American society about their military overstepping its bounds.
There were reports U.S. military leaders had encouraged their subordinates to vote conservative during the election.
And at least two popular books were published focusing on a right-wing military leadership pushing the limits against government policy of the day. The Senate Foreign Relations Committee published its own report on right-wing extremism in the military, warning a \"considerable danger\" in the \"education and propaganda activities of military personnel\" had been uncovered. The committee even called for an examination of any ties between Lemnitzer and right-wing groups. But Congress didn't get wind of Northwoods, says Bamford.
\"Although no one in Congress could have known at the time,\" he writes, \"Lemnitzer and the Joint Chiefs had quietly slipped over the edge.\"
Even after Lemnitzer was gone, he writes, the Joint Chiefs continued to plan \"pretext\" operations at least through 1963.
One idea was to create a war between Cuba and another Latin American country so that the United States could intervene. Another was to pay someone in the Castro government to attack U.S. forces at the Guantanamo naval base — an act, which Bamford notes, would have amounted to treason. And another was to fly low level U-2 flights over Cuba, with the intention of having one shot down as a pretext for a war.
....
QUOTE
William1865:
If I were president, we would have already invaded Cuba and liberated Castro's subjects so they wouldn't have to risk their lives sneaking over here for a taste of freedom.
Looking from totalitarian dictatorship to totalitarian dictatorship around the world, Cuba is pretty far down on the list of threats to America, and even pretty far down on the list of oppressive regimes. But then Iraq was further down the list of threats, while being middle of the pack when it comes to oppresiveness of the regime.If I were president, we would have already invaded Cuba and liberated Castro's subjects so they wouldn't have to risk their lives sneaking over here for a taste of freedom.
So I guess it brings up the question, if William were president would we be at war with Iran, Syria, North Korea, China, Pakistan, etc. All of which represent more danger to the US than Cuba, and all of which far outstrip Cuba as repressive nations.
QUOTE
jqueer:
So I guess it brings up the question, if William were president would we be at war with Iran, Syria, North Korea, China, Pakistan, etc. All of which represent more danger to the US than Cuba, and all of which far outstrip Cuba as repressive nations.
Yes, Yes, Yes, No, Maybe. So I guess it brings up the question, if William were president would we be at war with Iran, Syria, North Korea, China, Pakistan, etc. All of which represent more danger to the US than Cuba, and all of which far outstrip Cuba as repressive nations.
But I probably won't be president. I'm sure Castro will sleep a bit easier tonight knowing that, as will many of you.
QUOTE
bobby78751:
Do any of you guys watch Seinfeld? The ocean called? The jerk store called? Just curious.QUOTE
William1865:
You're back to being delusional...I knew the good ideas couldn't last for long. QUOTE
bobby78751:
WOW! I am amazed...you have a good idea! I knew if I hung around long enough one would come along...well, that was good while it lasted the one and only time.
I slept with your wife. WOW! I am amazed...you have a good idea! I knew if I hung around long enough one would come along...well, that was good while it lasted the one and only time.
My wife is a slut. Now that's a complaint.
[ February 06, 2004, 06:41 AM: Message edited by: William1865 ]
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