Ump25 is the handle of a major league umpire who happens to be gay. This forum was set up because of the popularity of his answers to questions about all manner of baseball rules and situations.

To make this Forum make more sense we are breaking down threads like a rule book, with subject catagories. Please try and post in the correct thread.

We have given Ump25 wide latitude in answering what he wants to. He has said he will not answer personal questions or speculate on the sexuality of anyone in baseball; please respect him on this.

We think this is a terrific idea and hope you all enjoy this features.

Play ball!

[ June 20, 2002: Message edited by: Jim at Outsports ]

Welcome to Jim and the rest of the gang here on Outsports. I must admit to being a bit hesitant at first on doing this, mainly because it's a first for me, to say the least. Into unchartered waters go I. Hopefully the water will be warm and pleasant.

As Jim said, I will not answer certain types of questions. It's just not professional, as I have learned myself already, and truthfully, it's also nobody's business. If I choose to touch on a personal item about myself, it will be only because I chose to do so, and for no other reason than that.

If someone should ask a question of me that I believe should not have been asked, I may either choose to ignore it, or admonish the author if I believe it is out of line. Anything serious will be referred to Jim to handle as he sees fit. I do this not to be some mad dictator; rather, to make sure everyone understands this forum's purpose.

Also, please be aware that there may be some things that I simply cannot answer, for one reason or another. Respect my polite refusals in that regard. It is not done so with any anger or malice.

Lastly, please keep all your questions, comments, suggestions, ideas, etc. within this thread. I have disabled my Email and PM's in this forum, as I do not wish to be contacted in any manner except via this forum.

Jim knows how to reach me and can do so if he needs to.

Thanks.

P.S. There is one often-asked question I will answer: What does "Ump25" mean? Is it your current uniform number? No, it is not. Bill Hohn is # 25, after Charlie Williams had it for some time. The 25 has another meaning for me, and it had to do with my career before I became a professional umpire. A little touch of nostalgia, I guess one would say.

[ June 20, 2002: Message edited by: Ump25 ]

[quote]Originally posted by Ump25:
P.S. There is one often-asked question I will answer: What does "Ump25" mean? Is it your current uniform number? No, it is not. Bill Hohn is # 25, after Charlie Williams had it for some time. The 25 has another meaning for me, and it had to do with my career before I became a professional umpire. A little touch of nostalgia, I guess one would say.

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Stripper #25 at a club?

[quote]Originally posted by Ump25:

P.S. There is one often-asked question I will answer: What does "Ump25" mean? Is it your current uniform number? No, it is not. Bill Hohn is # 25, after Charlie Williams had it for some time. The 25 has another meaning for me, and it had to do with my career before I became a professional umpire. A little touch of nostalgia, I guess one would say.
]

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Maybe it was your badge number back when you were a cop ??

Hi:
In this forum only myself and Ump25 can start a new topic. I did this to simply everything. We created the different threads to encompass almost all situations people would be involved in, including a misc. thread. By blocking the ability to start a new topic (in this Forum only!) it saves me a lot of time of moving those 1-2 replies threads that should be within a designated topic.

If you feel there should be an additional topic started let me know.

Thanks!

I didn't see this introductory part of "Ask the Ump" so I didn't realize the rules of engagment.

I do find it odd that this site of all sites chooses to go this anonymous route. I respect anyone's choice to keep closeted due to professional pressure or whatever reason, but I'm pretty sure the whole point of this site is to embrace ourselves as gay people no matter what our profession but especially in regards to sports. Why else is there so much speculation about professional athletes' sexuality here? Does a professional umpire actually have more to lose than a professional athlete? Cyd's written passionately about accepting diversity in his high school and yet a mature adult, apparently secure within his profession, writes anonymously on this site? I don't get it.

With all due respect, I don't understand why there are closeted and/or anonymous columnists on this site at all? It simply doesn't seem consistent with the overall intentions.

The fact of whether you get it or not is irrelevant. I don't tell you how you should live your life, don't tell me how to live mine.

If you had even the slightest idea of my job and the many risks entailed, you wouldn't have even posted such a selfish comment.

I could have easily ignored your post, but I chose not to. However, this is all I am going to say on this matter. If someone else wants to chime in, so be it.

If you do not wish to participate in this forum in the manner for which it was originally intended, well...there's the door. Don't let it hit your ass on the way out.

[quote]Originally posted by bryan d.:
I do find it odd that this site of all sites chooses to go this anonymous route. I respect anyone's choice to keep closeted due to professional pressure or whatever reason, but

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Why have a "but" here if you respect anyone's choice for whatever reason?

[quote]I'm pretty sure the whole point of this site is to embrace ourselves as gay people no matter what our profession but especially in regards to sports.

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It says right on the home page, under the logo: "For gay sports fans and athletes by sports fans and athletes." The site isn't for embracing ourselves, although I wouldn't discourage that.

[quote] Why else is there so much speculation about professional athletes' sexuality here?

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As compared to the speculation about it in, oh, the New York Post and other "straight" media outlets recently?

We're gay. We're into sports. It should be obvious why. We're curious.

[quote] Does a professional umpire actually have more to lose than a professional athlete?

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Does a professional umpire have more to lose than an officer in the military? Does a professional umpire have more to lose than the kid working at Burger King? What's the difference?

[quote] Cyd's written passionately about accepting diversity in his high school and yet a mature adult, apparently secure within his profession, writes anonymously on this site? I don't get it.

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What's to get? It's his choice.

[quote] With all due respect, I don't understand why there are closeted and/or anonymous columnists on this site at all? It simply doesn't seem consistent with the overall intentions.

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To talk about sports, you have to be openly gay? Since when?

[quote]Originally posted by Ump25:
well...there's the door. Don't let it hit your ass on the way out.

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Gotta love that Ump - what a funny guy ! ----------------------------------------And Joe from Philly - you answered all Bryan D.'s questions better than I could have!

What's interesting to me is that I simply asked...and all I got was this barely contained fury from Mr. Ump25.

So you're gay, you write a column for a gay sports site, but you're furious if anyone questions why you're closeted in 2002...And you suggest that I leave this site? Hypocrisy goes hand in hand with being in the closet. And clearly there's plenty of support here for your anonymonity...cool, if that's the way it is here, that's the way it is...Good luck...

Copman --- you call ump funny, i call it rude!!!!

Ump25 is a bit up tight and has his undies in a bunch about the situation -- i don't understand it so i don't really comment on it but i completely agree with you bryan d. If you brag about your job and put yourself out there like ump does then he needs to expect a little criticism and speculation and he should handle it a bit better then going off and pounding his chest and claiming that you should leave -- last time i checked if you don't like the situation here ump the door is wide enough for you to leave also!

[ June 25, 2002: Message edited by: sparty on ]

Ladies aren't we getting a little bit pot calling the kettle blackish here? I mean seriously. From the get-go this guy we know as Ump25 has been talking on here to us. From the begining he has stated what he does for a living, and has stated that HE DOESN'T FEEL COMFORTABLE WITH OUTING HIMSELF AT WORK.

Who know's how old he is, or how long he has had to adjust to being gay, or if he is even comfortable with himself being gay. I bet there are a lot of people on this board who are still working through the entire process of comming out, I know I am. The people I work with don't know, and for you or anyone else to expect me to come out to my co-workers (little lone the media and entire world) is a rediculous expectation. Ump is here to answer questions from a professional perspective. If you have your panties in a bunch because he won't out himself for your personal reasons I say get over it. Enjoy what he has to say on a professional level. If you have a question, ask it, if not, read his answers to other's questions, but until you're ready for us to ask you to post you pictures, job title, and every other personal thing about yourself including parents address and such on this web site I suggest you leave him be.

I'm also thinking that when he said, "Don't let the door hit you on the arse on the way out." He was talking about the "Ask the Ump" section of the board, not the entire board. You guys seem to take his comments very personally when he's just making a general comment. Get over yourselves.

Thanks for the great insite Ump.

not taking it personally just noticing a trend of rudeness from his posts, not only on this topic but others as well.

personally i am done with this topic and other that deal with ask the ump for my own personal reasons and don't worry ump i enjoy the door hitting me on the ass once in a while, it gets me all excited!!

[ June 25, 2002: Message edited by: sparty on ]

[quote]Originally posted by bryan d.:
but you're furious if anyone questions why you're closeted in 2002...And you suggest that I leave this site?

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Bryan--You live in SF and apparently feel very safe being out at your job in 2002. But there are a lot of places in this country, and a lot of careers, where it is not safe to be out. People still lose jobs for being gay.

Personally, I think tolerance and acceptance would happen faster if everyone came out at work and everywhere else, so I encourage everyone to do it. But none of us has the right to tell individuals when/where/why to come out.

And he didn't tell you to leave the site; he said you don't have to post in the Ump25 forum.

What a crappy addition the Ask the Ump column has been to this board. I hope you guys kill the beast now, before it ruins the Outsports site completely.

[quote] What a crappy addition the Ask the Ump column has been to this board. I hope you guys kill the beast now, before it ruins the Outsports site completely.

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Are you serious? I mean really, have you read any of the discussion of rules that he has gone through? Have you even bothered to read any of the actual Baseball related answers that he has put out here?

For some people like me, who quit playing sports when they were about 10 because we sucked at them, and were the fat little kids, but have since found a new found interest in them, this column provides a service(if you look in the right spot). I could really care less what the best steak house is in Oakland or Chicago, but the questions about size of ballparks, and strike zones, and such are actually interesting. We all know there is a STRIKE zone, but where it's located and how the umps determine it is another thing all togeather.

Now I know that learning the Rules of the games we all want to play may seem like second nature to some people out there, but personally I don't think it's any more worthless than oh lets say, the strangest places we've had sex, or MTV's tough enough, the discussion about a Judo champion who was in trouble. Now, I ask all you people out there who don't like the Ask the Ump thread to please just take your finger off the left mouse button when your pointer is located over that particular phrase. That way you don't have to worry about the financial well being of this web site, or the down fall of modern society due to one closeted guy with some smarts about a game, letting us less informed types in on certain aspects of said game.

Oh ya, and to those of you who think that he is rude. Ya he is rude in other forums. I don't have to agree with some of his opinions to appreciate the fact that he knows his game. I said it once and I'll say it again. I come here to learn what I can from a professional standpoint.

I am sorry to hear you think this way, brett. I never demanded this forum; instead, in the baseball forum below, I asked if people would be interested in such a forum. I asked the readers here and Jim and Cyd if it would be a positive thing to do.

I did not do this because I need some glorification. I did so because I thought--and still do--that informing people about baseball in many ways would lead to a better understanding of the game and perhaps the job of a major league umpire.

Based on the reactions of the readers and posters in the original thread, it seemed this was a popular and welcome thing to do. If I can help even one person, or answer at least one question, then it's all been worth it to me.

I realize in having such a forum that I may not always be able to please everyone. Like umpiring, that's my job in a sense. Also like umpiring, I can tend to be rather blunt or straightforward. That's just my personality. I tend to tell things like it is, without all the hemming and hawing so common among many folks today, especially our elected officials, for example. I would hope that being straightforward would be more preferable than being purposely vague.

Like any other section of this board, if someone doesn't like this one, they don't have to visit it. Don't ruin it for the rest of the folks, though, brett; and feel free to pop in and participate in some baseball discussion.

I did so because I thought--and still do--that informing people about baseball in many ways would lead to a better understanding of the game and perhaps the job of a major league umpire.

You've done a wonderful job! I've learned more about baseball and its intricacies in the past 30 days than I have in many years. I find myself watching more baseball (go Twins!)than ever, and thinking "oh, I should ask Ump25 about that".

As far as a persons personal life, be it "Ump25" or whomever. It's just that - personal.

Keep in mind, this is cyberspace. Not everyone is always who they say they are. Ump25 could be some guy in Brooklyn who happens to have a very thorough knowledge of baseball. Whatever, he's teaching us all quite a bit. Some one else could actually be some major athlete - we don't know, do we?

Adam, Would you happen to be related to a certain dare devil Motorcycle rider from Butte Montana?

[ June 25, 2002: Message edited by: MSUBobcat ]

No, but if he's looking for a ride . . .

[quote]Originally posted by Adam2112:
You've done a wonderful job! I've learned more about baseball and its intricacies in the past 30 days than I have in many years. I find myself watching more baseball (go Twins!)than ever, and thinking "oh, I should ask Ump25 about that".

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Feel free to ask whatever comes to mind, and if I can answer it, I shall.

[quote]Ump25 could be some guy in Brooklyn who happens to have a very thorough knowledge of baseball

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Well, not exactly Brooklyn, that's for sure. I don't live near there.

I love baseball, grew up playing, and still enjoy watching. I think the Ask the Ump forum is a terrific idea.

Not all of us have read every posting ever posted on this site so we don't necessarily know Ump's background or attitudes on every subject. I asked why he was posting anonymously on this site. That's all. I was surprised that that would be the case on this specific site. I certainly didn't tell anyone what to do with their hallowed personal lives.


[ June 25, 2002: Message edited by: bryan d. ]

[ June 25, 2002: Message edited by: bryan d. ]

[quote]Originally posted by sparty on:
Copman --- you call ump funny, i call it rude!!!!
If you brag about your job and put yourself out there like ump does then he needs to expect a little criticism

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Well actually I know Ump can be BLUNT but I don't think that letting people know what his occupation is, is necessarily bragging any more than saying that you are an insurance salesman, waiter or a cop is bragging. I was here from the beginning and most of the interest in Umps forums were NOT generated by him . They were answers to questions put to him by other Outsports readers. And I actually chuckle at Umps answers cuz I figure inside that crusty exterior lies a heart of a teddy bear.

Bryan, Would you like a medal or a chest to pin it on?

Come on up to Montana and tell everyone you play sports with, and everyone at the bar and everyone at work that you're gay, and then we'll see if you feel the same way. The whole world isn't SF, and I do appreicate the fact that people in big cities feel confident enough to shout thier orientation to the roof tops, but it just don't exactly fly in my town. Even in Montana we have towns where you can be very out, but even in that town we had a Lesbian couple's house burned to the ground. Now I'll say it again. You don't have to understand and we can't expect you to, but if we're not out, there's probaby a pretty good reason (everyone's is different).

So once again. I'm glad that you feel as if you deserve some kind recognition for comming out and trying to make the world a better place for gay people everywhere, but don't insult those of us that haven't come out by telling us that we owe you some kind huge debt. You do what feels right for you and we'll do what feels right for us. This is not a popularity contest. It's our lives. You're ready to be out, good for you. I'm no less gay, or important due to the fact that I haven't told my employer or sports team that I dig guys.

One more thing, the way you talk about Ump's job, as being his "big important job(sarcasticly)" really strikes a sour note with me. Any job is important just for the fact that it is used to pay for an individuals lifestyle, and it's something they enjoy. I wish that I had a job that I could enjoy as much as Ump appears to enjoy his.

[ June 25, 2002: Message edited by: MSUBobcat ]

[quote]Originally posted by MSUBobcat:
Come on up to Montana and tell everyone you play sports with, and everyone at the bar and everyone at work that you're gay, and then we'll see if you feel the same way. [ June 25, 2002: Message edited by: MSUBobcat ]

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The Machismo, Mob mentality is still alive and well in different parts of the country. At my old job as a fisherman on a boat in Alaska working in close, small, environment and living with coworkers for extended periods of time, it's not somewhere to come out and say "I'm Gay!" It was only after 5 years of working with some guys that I came out to a few and that was only because we were more like brothers at that point than coworkers. But be the wrong person in that type of environment and you could be thrown overboard and in Alaska it dont matter how well you know how to swim. Living somewhere like SF or Seattle it's easy to forget that there is another type of world and mentality out there and whats really easy in one place is not in another.
But I can also see how some of Ump's post can incite arguments or heated debates

MSU - Yes, we've all heard and lived the small town blues. I'm from a small suburb in the midwest. People who live in San Francisco choose to live there and though obviously stereotypes are alive and well in your vocabulary - many gay people in San Francisco are simply working professionals who aren't shouting from any rooftops. You choose to live in Montana and that's great. It's a beautiful place. You choose to be closeted; that's your choice and I respect that. As for everyone, where you live and how you to live is your choice. Overall, this site seems to be highly encouraging of famous athletes and younger athletes to be out and proud. I can also see now that there's a great deal of resistance and even some scorn from posters here towards being out. I accept that and I'll leave it alone now that my questions were answered. Thanks everyone. I'll stick to my tennis posts from now on...

[ June 25, 2002: Message edited by: bryan d. ]

bryan d. -

I tried to IM you on this topic, but had configuration probs. I've saved the text, so pls email me if you'd like to see the IM. Thanks.

Update: Looks like it went through after all, but if not, see above....

[ June 25, 2002: Message edited by: jordan ]

and i thought the freakin' topic was WELCOME!

hmmm....ump is at loggerheads with everyone again!

just joshin'! ask the ump is a great addition to this board!

Wow. I always kind of avoided the "Ask The Ump" threads because, ummm, i've always thought one of the weaknesses of baseball was the tedium of interpretting so many rules. Had I known there was more drama here than your average Anna Kournikova tangent, I'd have dropped by much sooner.

Seriously, I think it's great for Ump to take the time to field all these questions (look, my first baseball post and i'm already making baseball puns!). If your insight settles just one catfight between managers in our local gay league, you deserve a shot at international peace negotiations.

Seriously, I don't think Brian's question was out of line, pointed or ever intended to elicit so much deffense (and i'll spare us all another bad pun). It would be ideal if we could all be out at work. Step by step guys. We'll get there. On our way let's be sure to applaud the people that are making a difference. In the meantime, I hope Outsports continues to foster a tolerant atmosphere of all lifestyles while we discuss sport, life and the occasional physique.

[quote]Originally posted by bryan d.:
Overall, this site seems to be highly encouraging of famous athletes and younger athletes to be out and proud. I can also see now that there's a great deal of resistance and even some scorn from posters here towards being out.

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There is no resistance or scorn towards being out. There IS resistance and scorn towards complaining because someone can't be out for whatever reason.

[quote] Originally posted by Ump25:
I did not do this because I need some glorification. I did so because I thought--and still do--that informing people about baseball in many ways would lead to a better understanding of the game and perhaps the job of a major league umpire.

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And anything that helps increase baseball's popularity in some way is not only a good thing, but it's more than MLB and its players are doing.

Ump - I'm not that new, I just used to post under Bryan but couldn't for the life of me log back in so I reentered as Bryan D....Of course, I do understand the purpose of this specific forum now and if I have any baseball related questions, I'll certainly come here. I still feel my inquiry was valid within the context of this site (OUTSports) and the responses were informative and revealing. Good luck with this forum and with your eventual, hopefully, coming out process.

[quote]Originally posted by bryan d.:
Good luck with this forum and with your eventual, hopefully, coming out process.

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Bryan, I am not intending to beat a dead horse, but this is what baffles me: Why should I "hopefully" come out? For whose purpose? Yours? By whose standards? Yours? Why should it make a difference at all whether I do or not?

It won't affect your life; instead, it will affect my life--and I am the sole person who is best to determine such things. Period.

You know what? I am happy with my life and have no desire to make any earth-shattering changes. I umpire baseball games and am involved with my job off the field, even during the offseason. That's all I need.

Anyway, on to baseball stuff...

Yes, on to baseball stuff. This thread will be locked. If anyone has issues with this forum, feel free to send them to mailto:mail@outsports.commail@outsports.com Thanks!