I've been watching the Little League WS the past several days. Generally, the games are very close, there is a high quality of play and the sportsmanship is excellent. One, not so minor, thing I have noticed. Fifty percent of the boys on every team are, ok please excuse this word, FAT! They are not slightly overweight or have a little tummy, they are fat. Most everyone is aware of the obesity problem. However, I thought it was confined to kids who sat around watching tv or surfing the net. I thought the "active" kids were probably "fit". Another thing I find a bit confusing, when they should the parent(s) of these fat boys, they, the parents, are not fat.
What is going on? How do these heavy boys feel when someone on the team has to pinchrun for them?
Anyone else notice this? P
Full Version: Little League WS
I have felt for a long time that the LLWS needs to be taken off television. And after the "highlights" from Tuesday's game between New York and Pennsylvania, I feel even stronger about it.
You spoke of sportsmanship. Well this was not at all evident when one of the little punks from the New York team stood at home plate and pointed his bat towards a point over the outfield fence where he planned on hitting it, a la Babe Ruth. The kid proceeded to do the "Sammy Sosa" hop out of the batters box when he made contact. When he got to second base, he began this chest thumping routine and could be seen yelling "That's what I'm talking about" repeatedly. The fact that the ball did not go out and the chubbster could have easily been thrown out at second didn't seem to deter him.
If the idea is to teach sportsmanship, the manager of the New York team should have pulled the little brat for a pinch hitter as soon as he saw him trying to show up the other team. Instead, he is rewarded with a SportsCenter highlight!
And the fact that it is televised is the main reason why there was the Danny Almonte cheating scandal a couple of seasons ago with another New York team. And the teams from other countries like Taiwan have long been thought to have older players.
You spoke of sportsmanship. Well this was not at all evident when one of the little punks from the New York team stood at home plate and pointed his bat towards a point over the outfield fence where he planned on hitting it, a la Babe Ruth. The kid proceeded to do the "Sammy Sosa" hop out of the batters box when he made contact. When he got to second base, he began this chest thumping routine and could be seen yelling "That's what I'm talking about" repeatedly. The fact that the ball did not go out and the chubbster could have easily been thrown out at second didn't seem to deter him.
If the idea is to teach sportsmanship, the manager of the New York team should have pulled the little brat for a pinch hitter as soon as he saw him trying to show up the other team. Instead, he is rewarded with a SportsCenter highlight!
And the fact that it is televised is the main reason why there was the Danny Almonte cheating scandal a couple of seasons ago with another New York team. And the teams from other countries like Taiwan have long been thought to have older players.
Gosh, I didn't see that. In the Va vs. NC, Ind vs Ky, NCal vs Arz, and Haw vs Id games, I was impressed with the sportsmanship. Should Little
Leagues implement some sort of immediate ejection for taunting? P
Leagues implement some sort of immediate ejection for taunting? P
And now on the 5:00 news here in New York there are allegations that up to three players from the Harlem team do not live in Harlem, but in ther Bronx. For those of you not familiar with NYC, Harlem is the uppermost section of Manhattan. Again, these are only allegations, but if true, yet another black eye for the LLWS.
And yes I think the umpires should have the power to eject any player who does anything to show up an opponent. Hell, even the NFL penalizes players for taunting!
And yes I think the umpires should have the power to eject any player who does anything to show up an opponent. Hell, even the NFL penalizes players for taunting!
I have mixed feelings about the LLWS being televised. On one hand, I don't think there is any other scene in sports that touches me the way the LLWS does. I can't think of a more naked display of pure, honest emotion than the faces of the winners and losers in the LLWS. When I see the tears of the losing team, my heart just breaks. On the winning side, the champions' explosion of pure joy is something once in a lifetime, and only if you're very very fortunate.
That said, is it really fair that a game for little kids be on display for an international television audience? As much as I love watching it, a part of me says that we should let kids be kids. You gotta wonder if BS like the Danny Almonte scandal, the flagrant trashy taunting mentioned earlier, and now this Harlem team's dubious residential origins would be happening if the LLWS had a much lower profile.
That said, is it really fair that a game for little kids be on display for an international television audience? As much as I love watching it, a part of me says that we should let kids be kids. You gotta wonder if BS like the Danny Almonte scandal, the flagrant trashy taunting mentioned earlier, and now this Harlem team's dubious residential origins would be happening if the LLWS had a much lower profile.
Why anyone is interested if one group of little kids can outplay another is utterly beyond me. George Vecsey asks today in his NY Times column if we need to be "godding up" children, to use a Red Smith phrase...
Vecsey also points out, however, that in a world of "nontraditional" families, it wouldn't be uncommon for kids with Harlem roots to be living in the Bronx. That said, if rules were broken, it's due to adult manipulation. To what end? The exaltation of victory above everything else; how American.
Vecsey also points out, however, that in a world of "nontraditional" families, it wouldn't be uncommon for kids with Harlem roots to be living in the Bronx. That said, if rules were broken, it's due to adult manipulation. To what end? The exaltation of victory above everything else; how American.
I saw the same clips as GVF of the kid from Harlem just trash talking and being completely unsportsmanlike. I agree that his coach should've pulled him off the field, but I also would hope his parents had something to say about it, as well. I see no reason why these games should be televised. Quite frankly, I'm not sure there should even BE a Little League World Series.
Yes, alot of those kids are overweight. Second, the whole thing is a joke, does anyone have an experience of witnessing a team they know of actually advancing in the tournament ? I played Little League and don't remember any type of playoffs. I do remember there was always an "All Star" type team created (and played an entire season, not just for an All Star game) that was light years ahead of us, even tho the same age group. One group in my area of Jackson Township is called the "Jackson Elite" gag me...
I finally saw the clip of the NY kid acting like a twat. Worst of all, he's totally unoriginal! It's bad enough when pro athletes pose for the camera--I often feel that they actively search out the cameras with the reds lights on--but to see a 12 year old do it, ewwwwwww.
There was a whole show dedicated to this on ESPN radio yesterday. (I think it was a local STL hour of programming though.)
It was really interesting overall. There was a real push by the hosts to point out that the LLWS should NOT be televised on major networks like ESPN and ABC. They pointed out that these young kids are all of 12 years old and their tournament is now treated something like March Madness.
It was also very interesting to hear them reveal some of the changes made to the game for television purposes. The outfield fences are kept very close to try and produce more runs. Apparently, the fences are at a depth that would normally produce flyouts, but in Williamsport, they are worthy of a dinger.
The pitching mound is closer to home plate than normal. Here in STL, the next division down plays at these distances. The runners cannot lead off the bases like they can normally. You cannot take first base on a dropped third strike.
Basically, the game has been completely transformed to be television friendly. And none of the teams in the World Series are teams that play together normally. They are the All-Star teams put together by the local leagues to play through the tournaments. Most of the players only play together for the qualifiers of the World Series.
It was a great show and I have to say it left me feeling like television and the LLWS staff are too willing to take advantage of young kids for their own gains.
It was really interesting overall. There was a real push by the hosts to point out that the LLWS should NOT be televised on major networks like ESPN and ABC. They pointed out that these young kids are all of 12 years old and their tournament is now treated something like March Madness.
It was also very interesting to hear them reveal some of the changes made to the game for television purposes. The outfield fences are kept very close to try and produce more runs. Apparently, the fences are at a depth that would normally produce flyouts, but in Williamsport, they are worthy of a dinger.
The pitching mound is closer to home plate than normal. Here in STL, the next division down plays at these distances. The runners cannot lead off the bases like they can normally. You cannot take first base on a dropped third strike.
Basically, the game has been completely transformed to be television friendly. And none of the teams in the World Series are teams that play together normally. They are the All-Star teams put together by the local leagues to play through the tournaments. Most of the players only play together for the qualifiers of the World Series.
It was a great show and I have to say it left me feeling like television and the LLWS staff are too willing to take advantage of young kids for their own gains.
I have been a pretty staunch supporter of ESPN over the years. But the hypocrisy on display regarding the LLWS is mind boggling.
ESPN radio, along with Michael Wilbon on PTI, seem to feel quite strongly that the LLWS should NOT be televised. But since the little punks antics the other night, SportsCenter has shown the clip of him pointing his bat and thumping his chest over and over and over again.
I won't be watching the LLWS, but I will be rooting really hard for someone, anyone, to lay one on the Harlem team.
ESPN radio, along with Michael Wilbon on PTI, seem to feel quite strongly that the LLWS should NOT be televised. But since the little punks antics the other night, SportsCenter has shown the clip of him pointing his bat and thumping his chest over and over and over again.
I won't be watching the LLWS, but I will be rooting really hard for someone, anyone, to lay one on the Harlem team.
Actually George I wouldn't say Harlem is in the uppermost section of Manhattan. Areas like Washington Heights and Inwood lie further north.
But as far as the LLWS goes, I tuned in Saturday with the hopes of seeing the Harlem team get crushed as well, but the outcome was the exact opposite as they stomped on a team from North Carolina. Trying to disqualify the Harlem team is all the motivation they need (ala trying to contract the Minnesota Twins) And I wouldn't be surprised now if they went all the way.
ESPN brought one the LLWS board members into the booth during Saturday's game. He explained how the Harlem team was cleared to play in the WS. He said, and I'm paraphrasing, that exceptions were made as far as residency requirements go for some of the players especially for one kid involved in a serious domestic issue. And he further backed up the decision saying as far as family situations go, "urban America" is different than "rural America" so exceptions should be made on a case by case basis. My response is "hey, get married or plan to get married if you're gonna have kids."
And since I live within New York City I feel that the fat kid "calling" his homerun just gives the city a bad reputation. I could imagine what kind of dad brought that big fat disgrace into this world.
The televising of the LLWS made Danny Almonte a much sought after superstar. I can just see in a few years George Steinbrenner will be doing everything he can to draft that scandalous kid.
[ August 18, 2002: Message edited by: amazin12 ]
But as far as the LLWS goes, I tuned in Saturday with the hopes of seeing the Harlem team get crushed as well, but the outcome was the exact opposite as they stomped on a team from North Carolina. Trying to disqualify the Harlem team is all the motivation they need (ala trying to contract the Minnesota Twins) And I wouldn't be surprised now if they went all the way.
ESPN brought one the LLWS board members into the booth during Saturday's game. He explained how the Harlem team was cleared to play in the WS. He said, and I'm paraphrasing, that exceptions were made as far as residency requirements go for some of the players especially for one kid involved in a serious domestic issue. And he further backed up the decision saying as far as family situations go, "urban America" is different than "rural America" so exceptions should be made on a case by case basis. My response is "hey, get married or plan to get married if you're gonna have kids."
And since I live within New York City I feel that the fat kid "calling" his homerun just gives the city a bad reputation. I could imagine what kind of dad brought that big fat disgrace into this world.
The televising of the LLWS made Danny Almonte a much sought after superstar. I can just see in a few years George Steinbrenner will be doing everything he can to draft that scandalous kid.
[ August 18, 2002: Message edited by: amazin12 ]
Actually I would hope everybody has heard of Harlem by now....Saturday's right after SNL "It's showtime...at the Apollo...sing it !!".....also U2's "Angel of Harlem" a great song
[quote]Originally posted by charliecstl:
It was also very interesting to hear them reveal some of the changes made to the game for television purposes. The outfield fences are kept very close to try and produce more runs. Apparently, the fences are at a depth that would normally produce flyouts, but in Williamsport, they are worthy of a dinger.
The pitching mound is closer to home plate than normal. Here in STL, the next division down plays at these distances. The runners cannot lead off the bases like they can normally. You cannot take first base on a dropped third strike.
What have you been smoking? No changes to the playing rules have been made because of the televising of the LLWS.
It was also very interesting to hear them reveal some of the changes made to the game for television purposes. The outfield fences are kept very close to try and produce more runs. Apparently, the fences are at a depth that would normally produce flyouts, but in Williamsport, they are worthy of a dinger.
The pitching mound is closer to home plate than normal. Here in STL, the next division down plays at these distances. The runners cannot lead off the bases like they can normally. You cannot take first base on a dropped third strike.
What have you been smoking? No changes to the playing rules have been made because of the televising of the LLWS.
- The distance from the rubber to the plate is still 46 feet.
- Runners cannot lead off at the L.L. level. Never have, probably never will.
- The dropped third strike rule does not apply to the Little League level (commonly called Majors division) at all.
I saw the last half of the last inning tonight. What's the upper age limit for LL? The Kentucky pitcher's voice has broken, and the final batter for Massachusetts is bigger than I am.
Some do appear older, but I was a pretty tall 12 year old.
I'm just glad those showboating Harlem Hotdogs had their heads handed to them the other night. The local papers were labeling them heroes! Sorry, but after 9/11, referring to little kids playing baseball as heroes is kind of moronic, especially kids who really needed a lesson in sportsmanship.
I'm just glad those showboating Harlem Hotdogs had their heads handed to them the other night. The local papers were labeling them heroes! Sorry, but after 9/11, referring to little kids playing baseball as heroes is kind of moronic, especially kids who really needed a lesson in sportsmanship.
[quote]Originally posted by twin58:
I saw the last half of the last inning tonight. What's the upper age limit for LL? The Kentucky pitcher's voice has broken, and the final batter for Massachusetts is bigger than I am.
Twin, the upper limit is 12. One cannot be 13 before a certain date--August 1 is the cutoff, if my memory serves me correctly. I could be off on that date, but not my much.
I saw the last half of the last inning tonight. What's the upper age limit for LL? The Kentucky pitcher's voice has broken, and the final batter for Massachusetts is bigger than I am.
Twin, the upper limit is 12. One cannot be 13 before a certain date--August 1 is the cutoff, if my memory serves me correctly. I could be off on that date, but not my much.
[quote]Originally posted by Ump25:
Twin, the upper limit [for age] is 12.
I thought it was something like that. The range in weight is stupendous for tonight's (Sunday's) starters for Kentucky. The smallest is 4'7" and weighs 79 lbs. The biggest weighs 180 lbs. Some of these guys look like third graders; others look as if they're ready to start shaving.
Thanks.
One more thing: I don't think I'll ever get used to the sound made by an aluminum bat.
[ August 25, 2002: Message edited by: twin58 ]
Twin, the upper limit [for age] is 12.
I thought it was something like that. The range in weight is stupendous for tonight's (Sunday's) starters for Kentucky. The smallest is 4'7" and weighs 79 lbs. The biggest weighs 180 lbs. Some of these guys look like third graders; others look as if they're ready to start shaving.
Thanks.
One more thing: I don't think I'll ever get used to the sound made by an aluminum bat.
[ August 25, 2002: Message edited by: twin58 ]
Wow, what a pitcher's dual. Congrats to Louisville Kentucky!
despite some of the bigger sized boys.. I can assure you guys that those kids are all legitimately under age... previous years' age and location controversy notwithstanding...
The oldest of the kids are just starting their first year of middle school.
yeah. Congrats to the Louisville team for their world championship.
The oldest of the kids are just starting their first year of middle school.
yeah. Congrats to the Louisville team for their world championship.
The Little League World Series kind of got knocked off the radar by the Olympics. I watched part of the game last night on ABC, which was won by Curacao--homeland of Andruw Jones--by the score of 5-2.
I wonder if any of these Little League stars ever became MLB players?
Official website.
Recent winners:
2004 - Curacao
2003 - Japan
2002 - Louisville, KY
2001 - Japan
I wonder if any of these Little League stars ever became MLB players?
Official website.
Recent winners:
2004 - Curacao
2003 - Japan
2002 - Louisville, KY
2001 - Japan
I read that at the post-game press conference, the coaches from the California team....failed to show up. Great sportsmanship, guys! 
One of the signs of the coming apocalypse is the mere notion that there is a press conference for Little League coaches to skip in the first place.
I like the fact that the LLWS is on TV. I like watching it. It reminds me of playing at that level (I mean Little League, not being that good).
But I also remember that if I acted like an a--shole during a game, I would've been on the bench in a sec. And then in HUGE trouble with my Dad.
But I also remember that if I acted like an a--shole during a game, I would've been on the bench in a sec. And then in HUGE trouble with my Dad.
One of the California players (last name, Leon) had a mustache. Another outweighs me.
I am amazed.
I am amazed.
The obvious solution to all this is that children should be grown in embryonic tanks, raised in seclusion, then released on the general public at the age of 18. I truly hate children. And I am unashamed to admit it.
West Oahu, Hawaii to play Curacao in the 2005 Little League World Series.
QUOTE
amazin12:
The televising of the LLWS made Danny Almonte a much sought after superstar. I can just see in a few years George Steinbrenner will be doing everything he can to draft that scandalous kid.
The other night on Sportscenter they did a little feature on Danny Almonte -- if I recall, he was playing for a high school in NY somwhere and then moved to Florida with his father and played on some other team...not semipro, I don't think, but not a school team, either. Anyway, he was not showing up for games if he wasn't starting, not traveling to road games, etc. Some team members said it was because of money issues. Others said it was his attitude. Anyway, he ended up moving back to NY (displeasing his father, still in Florida) and the report said experts think that if he's drafted at all in 2006, it'll be very late in the draft.The televising of the LLWS made Danny Almonte a much sought after superstar. I can just see in a few years George Steinbrenner will be doing everything he can to draft that scandalous kid.
Sounds like he was overpowering when he was 2 years older than those who batted against him, but once they found out his true date of birth he became just another kid.
[ August 27, 2005, 08:56 PM: Message edited by: Joe in Philly ]
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.