In my continuing quest for a bed to sleep in (in Chicago) how accessible are the hotel dorms to public transit and the gay hub(s)? Also, does anybody know if/where a "friendship village" area is planned?

Not having much luck in Vancouver finding 4 others to bond with and make the Dec 15 Team discount. Still time though.

Reading Copenhagen is sheduled to host the next Outgames 2009 is wondering myself whats about this site, where Berlin claims to be the host for Outgames 2009? Outgames Berlin 2009

Runs GLISA two Outgames in 2009 now? wink It seems, something should be clarified here, nor? :confused:

I posted a reply to the questions above on the "Chicago and Cologne" thread.

Kevin Boyer
Gay Games VII

Hey Berlin:
That link goes to the old bid site for Berlin before they terminated their 2009 Outgames bid. I guess they have not deactivated it yet.

It definitely is Copenhagen and only Copenhagen for 2009. Although with Copenhagen joined at the hip by the Oresund Bridge to Malmo Sweden, just 16km away (about 10 miles), it certainly will be quite easy to take in two countries during the Outgames. It is less than 20 minutes by car or train. And who knows, maybe some of the events may even be over in Malmo. That would be kind of neat.

[ December 09, 2005, 10:10 AM: Message edited by: Travelpat ]

The Danes have a saying: "Asia begins in Malmo"

It doesn't really matter anyway, because after Montreal craters, nobody will take Copenhagen seriously. Pity, two great cities, what a waste!

Here is an interesting article that may (or may not) help one to better understand the intent and process in determining where athletes will compete in Gay Games and the newly formed OutGames.

Bay Area Reporter article

In keeping with my New Years Resolution - starting 3 days early - I will try to keep my response to that article as positive as I can. To start with anybody who even has cursory knowledge of what GLISA is all about can easily determine that the article is clearly trying to present GLISA in the least flattering way possible. But then again, that has been the track record for any story on this 'GLISA vs the FGG' topic by that reporter. There is a reason his stories have been the one's most quoted by FGG supporters on this board ever since this schism started.

Without rehashing a lot of the ugly stuff that has been rehashed here for months I'll simply point out a few of the shortcomings of that report as it relates to the reality of what GLISA is all about.

It conveniently leaves out any accurate description of GLISA's governing structure, which is a very democratic structure with GLBT sport groups - not individuals - who will have the votes to determine the future direction of the organization, including how decisions will be made for hosts for future Outgames.

It left out any mention of the fact that GLISA is now made up of well over 70 GLBT organizations and growing - and that it is in the process of doing such positive things as developing a North American Gay and Lesbian Sport Federation to be run by the GLBT sport groups of North America based on the successful European model.

It conveniently leaves out the fact that it was members of Pan Idraet - the GLBT sport group of Copenhagen, that initiated contact with their government officials in Copenhagen that resulted in Copenhagen's offer to host the 2009 event. This after the most ardently pro-FGG group in Berlin had a significant role in being sure the mayor would not support an Outgames bid in that city - even though that bid apparently had the support of the majority of GLBT sport and other gay groups in that city.

Of course there are some similarities between the FGG and GLISA, but there are differences. Others can quite capably sing the virtues of the FGG, let me present some details of what I - as the Team Toronto rep on the GLISA board - see as GLISA's main goals and priorites. Hopefully this will be a more accurate or at least a more complete picture of what GLISA is all about, compared to what one would conclude based on the article. Much of this is from some of the reports that GLISA's democratically elected board have come out with, since the September inaugural conference.

GLISA goals are to:
1 - Nurture the growth of GLBT sport world wide year in and year out.

2 - Build partnership beyond the GLBT sports community to build relationships with many mainstream sport, human rights and cultural organizations that share our mission to make ALL places safe for LGBT athletes to practice sport.

3 - Delivery of Games. And not just a quadrennial event, althought the quadrennial Outgames will obviously be part of that. GLISA will partner with cities around the world to deliver smaller scale regional Continental Outgames in the years between the quadrennial event. (Based on the successful model of the Eurogames). And with each of those games GLISA's goal is to combine sport, culture and human rights in the Outgames program, partnering with tourism, government and grassroot LGBT sport organizations to deliver the games responsibly.

4 -The final major goal or pillar of GLISA's plan is the ongoing professionalizing of the LGBT sport movement. Legacy and innovation are major priorities of GLISA. Legacy comes from the transfer of knowledge between host cities and LGBT sport associations, support of professional human resources, and collectively benefiting from longer-term marketing/television/sponsorship strategies that create new revenue streams for LGBT sport.

By working together innovatively GLISA members can create more credibility, financial viability and sustainability for the LGBT sport movement.

Hopefully that gives a more complete and accurate picture of what GLISA is about.

While we're pointing out unique positive points about certain organizations, I'll chime in with just a few about the Federation of Gay Games:

- The Federation of Gay Games is the only LGBT global quadrennial event provider whose volunteers and members have nurtured the growth of LGBT sport world wide year in and year out since Tom Waddell began planning for the Gay Olympic Games in 1980.

- The Federation of Gay Games is the only LGBT global quadrennial event provider which has inspired tens of thousands of LGBT athletes for decades by delivering a life changing event of consistent quality and scope which they can aspire to participate in.

- The Federation of Gay Games is the only LGBT global quadrennial event provider which has spent decades creating a network, a common infrastructure, and a vehicle for sharing knowledge related to sports organizations and among LGBT organizations.

- The Federation of Gay Games is the only LGBT global quadrennial event provider which inspired the creation of a thriving and successful continental LGBT sports organization.
http://www.eurogames.info/1996/retrospecti...ve_english.html

- The Federation of Gay Games is the only LGBT global quadrennial event provider that has overseen a competitive site selection process, and we've done it five times.

- The Federation of Gay Games is the only LGBT global quadrennial event provider with dues paying members.

- The Federation of Gay Games is the only LGBT global quadrennial event provider which is not financed by a tourism bureau

- Gay Games VIII in Cologne 2010 is the only event of its kind in Europe which does not conflict with the EuroGames which normally would be held in 2007, 2008, and 2009.

- The Gay Games is the only LGBT global quadrennial event which has seen one of its champions go on to become a national champion and world silver medalist in the mainstream arena – Chris Morgan, powerlifter

- The Federation of Gay Games is the only LGBT global quadrennial event provider with directors from the continental region of Africa.

- The Federation of Gay Games is the only LGBT global quadrennial event provider with an interactive calendar of events for the entire community to use.

- The Federation of Gay Games is the only LGBT global quadrennial event provider which provides intranet services to its members.

- The Federation of Gay Games is the only LGBT global quadrennial event provider which provides internet content on how to organize a sports organization.

Here is our mission statement:

"The purpose of The Federation of Gay Games, Inc. shall be to foster and augment the self-respect of gay men and women throughout the world and to engender respect and understanding from the non-gay world, primarily through an organized, international athletic and cultural event held every four years commonly known as the “Gay Games.” A fundamental principle is that all Federation activities shall be inclusive in nature and that no individual shall be excluded from participating on the basis of sexual orientation, gender, race, religion, nationality, ethnic origin, political belief(s), athletic/artistic ability, age, physical challenge, or health status."

While our community is proud of its accomplishments, we continue to welcome the emergence of new groups within the LGBT sports movement. No matter how the movement evolves, we will evolve with it as we always have, adapting and changing our organizational structure, policies, and practices to better serve the interests of the community. We are confident there will always be room for an LGBT quadrennial event, the Gay Games, which celebrates the vision and legacy of Dr. Tom Waddell.

If I can do one last shout out here...don't forget to register for the Gay Games in Chicago 2006 before the latest discounts expire at the end of the year!

http://www.gaygameschicago.org/

Rich Williams
Vice President of Membership
Federation of Gay Games

[ December 29, 2005, 02:25 PM: Message edited by: rtwilliams ]

Hey Rich - nice post. Glad to see somebody from the FGG sort of take up my challenge to extol the virtues of the FGG here. Although inthe spirit of sportsmanship I will point out that a number of those 'only the FGG has' points will not be true by this time next year, once there has been an Outgames and some of GLISA's well developed plans are put into practice over the next few weeks and months.

But that aside I'm glad your response was basically a positive one extolling what you feel are the strengths of the FGG and listing some of its accomplishments from the past.

A much different and more positive approach than that poor excuse of an article that deliberately misrepresents GLISA and the Outgames.

Pat

Thanks Pat. Actually, I forgot a few.

- The Federation of Gay Games is the only LGBT global quadrennial event provider which established a policy for transgendered athletes which set the tone for the Olympics and others to follow.

- The Federation of Gay Games is the only LGBT global quadrennial event provder to offer a women's event ten years prior to the Olympic Games - Wrestling.

- The Federation is the only LGBT global event provider which has successfully promoted social change for nearly a quarter century by fostering positive images of the LGBT community through sports and culture.

One small correction Rich. Don't worry it's a good one...

Though that's technically true, Chris Morgan added the world drug free powerlifting GOLD medal to his trophy case this year. So he's won a national championship and a gold and a silver medal in world championships. The silver medal having been won last year.

[ December 29, 2005, 04:38 PM: Message edited by: UMRebel/Bucfan ]

Correct me if I'm wrong Rich but I believe that the Federation of Gay Games is the ONLY global quadrennial event provider which opens up all events without gender exclusion. The FGG allows men to compete in events that are only open to women, and women to compete in events that are only open to men, in other international sporting competitions.

Thank you for the correction on Chris Morgan.

As part of our vision for promoting inclusion and human rights, the FGG is completely committed to promoting gender parity. In fact, we were the first LGBT global quadrennial event provider to pioneer the dual gender president structure in 1986 with Rikki Streicher as the first Female Co-President and Larry Sheehan the first Male Co-President. This is just one more example of organizational innovation that is part of our legacy of contributions to LGBT sports and culture.

We promote inclusion of men and women in all events. I haven't done enough research to answer the question about whether we are the only one.

[ December 29, 2005, 05:19 PM: Message edited by: rtwilliams ]

I guess I should add that the Gay Games is the first global LGBT quadrennial event to serve as a recruiting platform for a regional police department:

http://www.suntimes.com/output/news/cst-nws-gay26.html

This illustrates yet another example of leadership in building partnerships to promote LGBT visibility within mainstream organizations and among the mainstream media, all while creating a safe and welcoming environment for athletes to compete.

We welcome all of you to the Seventh Quadrennial Gay Games in Chicago, July 15-22.

Several events are sold out or close to selling out, so don't delay.

http://www.chicagogaygames.org/

[ December 29, 2005, 08:03 PM: Message edited by: rtwilliams ]

Hey Pat,

Your points would be more valid if you were not talking about what may happen in the future.

I think that the lawsuit in Montreal and many other factors could very well lead to the demise of the Montreal Games and then likely - GLISA.

Since I am predicting the future - just like you - I am not being negative, just prophetic. You prefer to see what you want and so do I. I have seen other events fall flat with less issues than Montreal has.

What you completely missed in that article and in your reality, is that Copenhagen was named as the location of OutGames 2 prior to the GLISA meeting where the democratic processes were supposed to prevail.

It is not big news that the membership is growing when that same membership is not allowed to have impact on the selection process or other decisions.

Don't get me wrong, I have no doubt that much was discussed and maybe even some resolutions passed, but the meat and potatoes never made it into those discussions - and that was clearly not democratic.

Mark himself admitted that the concept of a bid from Buenos Aires was incomplete and yet there was no problem blowing up that balloon to see if it would float. Just a way of fooling people that GLISA actually had substance.

What I mostly miss is why it was okay with you that the Montreal folk either lied to the world ot lied to the auditors of our federal government when they stated the paid registrations. The numbers simply didn't add up and yet you remain silent on this issue when you will talk about everything else.

Methinks there is too much hot air and not enough substance.

When Rich takes the time to itemize the substance of the FGG you talk about how GLISA has substance because they might achieve the same things in the future. If they are trying to achieve the same things (with slight variations I will admit) then it becomes clear that this was all about ego in the first place.

The folks in Montreal want and need to be in control and the FGG was the established group that they needed to plow under.

Only time will tell if they have been successful.

I do have to add that I feel shame every time the old handshake is mentioned in regards to the Games in Vancouver. Nothing can be farther from the truth and yet it is still being put out there as if saying it makes it true. The Vancouver group had to make a presentation and the bid documents are on file at the Hormel Wing of the San Fran Public Library.

Under the guise or pretense of positivity, you continue to spill unfacts and conjecture as truth.

I'd love to hear what everyone else thinks of the so called bids which now appear to be even less than letters of intent? Do you feel that truth is coming from the GLISA folks when the announcement of OutGames 2 didn't even come from them and the delegates that attended were not even given the rigght to preview the information?

How is that for even a pretence of democracy?

Ken
Vancouver

Hey Ken:
My prediction is that your prediction will be VERY wrong, but we'll see what happens over the next 7-8 months. Time will tell.

As for the Copenhagen announcement. I will admit I was as surprised as anybody else. But we were told at the GLISA conference the day before any announcements were made out of Denmark. And the reason it was an announcement is because there were by that time no other bidders. Berlin pulled out for the reasons I mentioned earlier and then on August 5th Sao Paulo advised the temporary 'appointed' board who were responsible for getting GLISA to its first delegate conference that they were pulling out. It was at that time Pan Idraet, who all along had been one of the most active and supportive groups in GLISA stepped forward and based on their Eurogames sucess from a couple of years earlier quickly stepped in, achieved great support from their community and their government officials and presented an offer to host 2009. And we (and by 'we' I mean the GLBT sport organization delegates) did democratically vote for a board of directors for GLISA at the September meetings and we did mandate them to negotiate with the Copenhagen organization with the goal being to sign the final agreement early in the New Year. Just as I assume the FGG's goal is to quite quickly get all the i's dotted and t's crossed for a final agreement with Cologne soon.

And in fact media representatives from all over the world - who were in the next room at the time that all of the GLISA delegates were told of the Copenhagen offer - they were immediately told by all of us who were official delegates at the GLISA meeting of that fact. All this the day before it was reported in the Danish media.

And the ceremony at City Hall in Montreal - which took place 3 days later, which laughably everybody keeps referring to as 'proof' that GLISA must be controlled by the Montreal officials, was simply an official media event hosted by the Mayor of Montreal that included guests from Copenhagen, the European Parliament and other delegates to the Outgames Human Rights conference. At that ceremony/media event in addition to confirming the Copenhagen announcement publicly, updates on the progress of the Outgames including the impressive list of international Human Rights conference key note speakers were passed on to the over 50 media members in attendance from around the world.

And things are moving forward with GLISA, from continued membership growth to the development of the NAGLSF with plans for the first Continental Outgames moving forward in North American, Australasia and eventually Latin and South America.

And as far as your comment that things such as the suit and 'many other factors may lead to the demise of the Montreal Games', well I have no idea where you are coming from on that one. The Montreal Games are in better shape by any measurement standard, be it finances, registration numbers, community and government support etc., than any event of its kind in GLBT sport history. So if other cities and organizations still managed to pull off previous Gay Games without being in as good a positition at this time, I see no reason why one would expect Montreal won't. It just makes no sense.

I guess the proof willl be in the pudding as they say, so my suggestion is to just wait and watch as things unfold. I feel very confident you will be singing a different tune within months.

Regardless I do hope you have a Happy and Healthy New Year!

Pat

Pat,

For clarification, the folks in Copenhagen issued their release to state they would be hosting the 2nd OutGames BEFORE you guys all convened in Montreal.

Sao Paulo never had a real bid and neither did Berlin. Copenhagen didn't pull it all together in moments because things simply do not happen that fast with that many levels of government and other organizations.

GLISA accepted based on a letter of intent and not a full bid which would include a huge amount of information.

The Gay GGames have, in the past, looked just as finacially vioable as Montreal when they were a year out - and they had at least 20 less staff to pay out and no law suit to be concerned with.

Appearances can be deceiving and only time will tell if the degree to which the Montreal folk are throwing around money will bear the fruit that they hope for. I have seen way too many similar situations in the past that did not work out to not be concerned for the people that have sent in their money to Montreal. Just an opinion but it is based on experience.

If you go back and check you will see that Copenhagen released the info prior to the meetings in Montreal.

BTW I am sure you guys did vote for some things and I already acknowledged that. What you didn't decide was the most important thing that was on the agenda - the placement of the 2nd OutGames. It is clear that GLISA is not driving that process isn't it?

Ken

This year has already seen one LGBT multisport event get cancelled (Tangra Cup in Bulgaria). We want athletes to be confident they're going to have a good experience when they plan for any of the fifteen or so LGBT multisport events out there, and yes that of course includes Rendez Vous. Instability and negativity surrounding one event may well negatively impact all. It's why I responded so strongly when Montreal spokespeople questioned whether Gay Games VII would occur or asserted that the host organization had "no money."

It's a good thing for community members to keep us all accountable for what we say and do, and in that sense I applaud this dialog, but as I said back in November 2004, we all need to turn the corner here and wish all sides well in their endeavors, particularly those that involve the commitment of athletes to an event. I know it's a free discussion, but could we please cease the talk about demise of an event? People are working too hard on these projects and it's just not fair to them or the athletes that are registered.

[ December 31, 2005, 10:43 AM: Message edited by: rtwilliams ]

I'd like to hear more about this suit in Montreal - lol!!! I await the pictures of perp walks [or is that not a Canadian practice?] The greedhead junta deserves a massive comeuppance, and I am pretty sure things are starting to move toward meltdown!

ROTFL!!!

What is this law suit about? Does anyone know where it is filed?

I'm so tired of this whole Chicago vs Montreal debate. Both events are going to happen, and as with so many divisions within the gay community we should be wishing both events success. Honestly, somtimes we can be our own worst enemies.

No, the greedhead junta in Montreal set out to destroy the Gay Games after they moved to hijack the Games. It's not just a hissy fight between gangs of queens - not "typical." I can imagine those who are colluding with the GJ in Toronto and elsewhere are feeling a little heat. Hey, you deserve a little heat!!

I may have expressed myself in strong terms and ridicule, but my facts and analysis were correct, and everything that has happened in the last couple of years has reinforced my position. What GJ has done really makes my blood boil, and I reacted appropriately. As for the dupes, shills, and others sucked into GJ exploit, just say you were wrong and have dropped your support for the GJ, and you can share in the ocean of free Canadian beer in Chicago - lol!!

[ January 03, 2006, 09:35 PM: Message edited by: LACharlie ]

The news magazine L'Actulité has Tewksbury on the cover and many articles on homosexuality. What surprised me was the reason given for the schism.
I don't know if Outgames are poor at communication, making things up or the journalist didn't understand what was explained to her, but from all the posts on schism I don't recall inviting hetero a major point of disagreement. (And I'm not aware that heteros are excluded from Gay Games.)

Babelfish translation is funny, they call Gay games merry plays:

The heterosexuals are also invited to the festival, which is not the case with the merry Plays, which take place every four years since 1982. It is this will besides to throw a bridge between homosexual and heterosexuals who gave rise to Outgames. In 2003, the Federation of the merry Plays indeed withdrew in Montreal the right to present the latter in 2006. Very advanced in its preparations, the organizing committee montréalais then decided to create a festival open to all. "One cannot preach the opening for then isolating itself", says Mark Tewksbury.

You get the main points:
- heteros are invited to Outgames which is not the case for Gay games
- it's this desire to bridge between hetero and homo that gave birth to outgames
- in 2003 FGG withdrew rights for GG 2006
- advanced in the preparations they decided to make a festival open to all
- Tewskbury: you can't preach openess to then isolate yourself

This is not accurate. The Gay Games are 100% open to anyone, regardless of sexuality.

I saw that issues of L'Actualité on the newsstand and flipped through it. But since I can't read French, I just looked at the pictures of Tewksbury in his Speedos.

Clearly the info about heteros participating in the Gay Games is inaccurate. Whether this is poor reporting or part of the 'Great Outgames conspiracy/hoax,' I do not know. wink

Article in D.C.'s Metro Weekly Good Sports

San Francisco Chronicle article: Another gay games -- feud sparks rivalry

You gotta love Montreal quoting false information in French, anything to slander GG's I suppose. ::sigh::

"You gotta love Montreal quoting false information in French, anything to slander GG's I suppose. ::sigh::"


Are serious with this. You really think the organizers in Montreal don't have enough to do that they actually spend time creating these conspiracies to weaken the gay games. Wow!

Get over it!

LOL! I know for a fact they do! Although, clearly, less time for it now. wink

More on the schism. From the Washington Blade: Gay Games' future may hinge on Chicago success. Sporting rivalry divides the gay ranks.

Well I have to admire anybody who participates in the Gay Games. I think they show outstanding courage and beauty, whoever they are and however they found their way to participate. It takes a lot to organize this event. So, admiration and wonder is all I have for anyone who participates. Silly squabbles and jealousies should be laid aside in the interest of the brotherhood and sisterhood of all these fine athletes, who show twice as much courage as the average athlete simply by participating.

Oh, dear God, you'd think somebody would have put a silver stake through the heart of this "schism" thread by now..

I agree Chuck - Here's to two successful events!

False information about inclusion of non-gays in gay games is again stated, this time on Radio-Canada's website (outgames media partner):

"Le grand rassemblement sportif se fera sous le signe de l'ouverture puisque pour la première fois les compétitions ne seront plus réservées aux gays et lesbiennes. « D'abord, le mot outgames signifie visibilité de la communauté, explique la directrice générale de Montréal 2006, Louise Roy. Donc, nous avons axé notre mission sur l'inclusion. Nous avons des hétérosexuels qui participent aux jeux. Nous ne vérifions pas l'orientation sexuelle des gens qui participent aux jeux.»"

Says: for the first time competitions will not be exclusively for gays and lesbians

By first time, it means the other gay events before.

It's the second time I see this in serious media. And it seems to be widespread perception. On a message board on 12 posts about outgames, 2 people write the big difference for outgames is they are open to all, contrary to gay games.

It is amazing how a single piece of false information gets out and is repeated. People will always have these incorrect perceptions. I really don't think the Montreal organizers had any desire to spread untruths about the gay games not accepting straight people. They moved on a long time ago.

False information is abound on both sides, a straight friend who lives in Chicago said to me he was mad at the Montreal for scheduling their event a week after Chicago, he said he heard that on the news in Chicago. Well we all know who was on the calendar first! I don't blame Chicago 2006 for this, it's just a false statement that was made and seems to carry.

Finally glad to read, "the two games could become distinctive based on their menu of sports, such as summer versus winter, or indoor versus outdoor."

All week in Chicago I kept asking anyone discussing the schism why the Canadians didn't just switch their event to a winter thing. There are so many gay ski weekends around the country and I'm sure they could find more than enough gay skiers, snow boarders, ice skaters and hockey teams to compete.

Now I hear they want to have more than one Out Games and they're pretending it's more about some altruistic love of friendly gay competition. I really just want to know why gay and lesbian winter sport enthusiasts still have no major international competion of this caliber. Of all western nations, Canada should understand better than most the passion for winter sport.

I'm not entirely familiar with the whole Out Games story but I do know that I'll continue to support the Gay Games exclusively because of their history and the fact that they honor an Olympian and gay athlete who died of AIDS. I'll also support them because of my great experiences at their events.

I don't like the name "out sports" because to me, it has too many connotations of the outdoors and outdoor sports. I'm not sure if they mean it as being out of the closet or out of the gymnasium where I play basketball - either way I'm sure it's not for me. I suppose there are many lesbian competitors who feel similarly about supporting the gay games when to many, the word "gay" means gay men but back in the day the word gay did include them.

I met several competitors in Chicago who were not "out" back home - will there be a place for them at Canada's "Out" Games?

Hopefully the competition will make the Gay Games stronger - maybe it will make them consider adding more of my favourite sports like surfing, skim boarding, skate boarding and BMX just to differentiate themselves from the selfish promoters of the Out Games.

Tall Bunny, There is a long and detailed series of events that transpired to create the Outgames. The federation of gay games owns the failure as much as the montreal organziers.

We need to recognize that before we can move on. The federation will not overcome their issues until we get new leadership in there and work to unite the GLBT sports community.

Don't simply shrug off the Outgames as the Canadian games. There will be 13000 athletes there (more than the gay games) and many many more international athletes.

We have a problem and after these games we all really need to come together to solve it. I for one am not going to spend the kind of money needed to go to either Copenhagen ot Colonge knowing they could be two 1/2 games as opposed to one strong united games.

HP,

Are you in favor of "one strong united games"?

TRL (Veteran: GGs '86, '90, '94, '02_

Hey TRL:
I'll take a shot at answering your question. 'Am I in favour of ONE games.

My answer is no, and I have absolutely no problem with people disagreeing with me on that. It is obviously a discussion the GLBT sports community needs to have. We certainly have hashed it out many times at Team Toronto meetings. And in one sense we - and a handful of other city teams - are in the unique position of being a part of both GLISA and the FGG - and proudly members of both! But to my thinking I'm very much in favour of what GLISA is doing in terms of building a series of continental events - modeled after the VERY successful Eurogames, to run in years between major international events. which is what GLISA is doing in North America for the first time next April in Calgary. A similar event will be launched in the Australasia Region - hopefully in 2008 for GLBT athletes in that part of the world. And that does not mean I wish harm on the Gay Games, I think there is a very significant place for the event within that calendar.

And for me that is GREAT news! I've talked to so many people here in Toronto over the last few weeks who were all excited about either Montreal or Chicago because this was the FIRST multisport event they could go to in EIGHT years! That's right EIGHT YEARS! The reason - Sydney was either too expensive to get to, or at a time of year (November) that they could not get vacation time. Or in some cases - because Sydney did not offer their sport. And many of those people play in sports that do NOT have a series of gay tournaments like those that I can play in all the time in volleyball and softball. So who am I - or anybody else for that matter - to tell those people in those sports - sorry - once every eight years is what you have to live with. That's hooey! And hey - I work in travel and have ways to get tickets to anywhere fairly cheaply. But many others don't have the money to go long distances, and by having more that one international event plus a series of regional events, there will be events that they can afford to go to. Again - to me that is good news!

Now those people may be able to curl in Calgary then perhaps do track in Copenhagen or Colgone in 2009 or 2010. Then have something back on this continent with another Regional event in 2011.

I think this is great - and I think if GLISA and the FGG can cooperate and perhaps schedule their events to not be the same continent as happened this year and in 2009/2010, then there is no reason a number of strong events can't be built. There was a guy from Cologne in my office yesterday who dropped off a Cologne 2010 business card, asking me if I would be coming. I said most likely and that I would probably be in Copenhagen too. He said, he would certainly be in Copenhagen promoting their event for 2010. Good on them! Use one event to help build the other.

The other option in terms of co-operation between GLISA and the FGG would be to get on a schedule that is two years apart. GLISA has sound business reasons for not moving off the schedule they have picked from 2009 onward, as there is much less mainstream sport competition on that schedule, that would perhaps interfere with the availability of sponsors or media attention. There is at least some merit to that argument and all you have to do is look at the FGG's own experience for some examples. In New York in 1994 the Gay Games had to compete for attention with the World Cup which was taking place at the same time. More recently in the bidding for 2010 that just ended, the Team Toronto reps at the FGG meeting reported back to our board that among the reasons that Joburg (our favourite) lost, was because of concern some on the FGG had that South Africa might have difficulty attracting the sponsors and volunteers might have burnout, considering that hosting of the World Cup would be dominating the country's resources that year. But of course that does not mean there is not merit to the FGG's historical reasons for not moving off of their tradiitional calendar. So that may be a tougher nut to crack.

I'm all for events every year. Regional events in years where there is not a Gay Games or Outgames, so people of limited means or limited vacation times have more of an opportunity to be part of this great multi sport GLBT world.

And again I'll mention something I posted earlier somwhere. Chicago attracted close to 12,000, Montreal 13,000. Can ONE event REALLY handle 25,000 athletes without negatively impacting the quality of the execution of the sports. How many tennis players can be included and still finish the event within a week?

And as a long time board member of Team Toronto - I love the fact that after a brief (well deserved) rest - we immediately will have something to go back to work on after the Outgames, as we begin to promote Calgary 2007 to our members. No longer will we see Team Toronto fall completely off the face of the earth for two years and struggle to regain our footing as was always the case when we only had one event every four years to work on.

Those are my thoughts.

Pat

[ July 27, 2006, 12:56 PM: Message edited by: Travelpat ]

TRL, My first resposne to your question was yes, but not necessarily under the current "FGG".

However after reading what Pat had to say, I have some doubt.

Article from the Washington Blade which sort-of recaps the Gay Games experience and looks towards Outgames.

I didn't see this posted anywhere else, so forgive me if this is a rerun. Even if it is, it's still a hoot.

Gay Games vs Outgames

LXN