i am so sick of this arrogant bitch.


Not one to doubt herself, or pay any heed to those who do, Serena Williams likes her chances as she returns to the All England Club.

"Like I always say, when I'm playing well, it's hard for anyone to beat me. It's just a fact. I think a lot of people understand that," said Williams, who won Wimbledon in 2002 and 2003 but missed last year's tournament with a left knee injury.

"I don't think anyone that has to play me goes home and shouts with joy."

At last year's Wimbledon, all nine U.S. men were gone before the fourth round, only the second time since 1922 that's happened. And only one American woman, Shenay Perry, reached the fourth round.

Asked about that, Williams pointed out, "I wasn't here. ... That's the answer. That's why. So now that I'm here, it should be different."

i SO hope she goes out early.

To me, it isn't that she says these things. If it were, then we would have to detest Roger Federer because he has made claims similar to this- even to the point of claiming he may be the best player ever.

However, it is how she says these things. There is a fine line between confidence and arrogance.

To me, Roger is confident, whereas, Serena is arrogant.

Instead of indicating that someone is going to have to play great to beat her or just saying that she is a strong contender- she makes these statements.

I was hoping with time she would mature- but she hasn't.

These statements to me aren't as bad as previous statements, but yeah, she can come across as a majorly arrogant bitch.

Yeah...I love Serena but I didn't like her statements here. It does come off sounding very arrogant, which is unnecessary because she doesn't need to be. She's won the title twice and been in another final losing to Sharapova. She needs to just let her racquet do the talking. If I were a player that would just be extra incentive to beat her. And then of course in her statement, she has already given herself an "out" clause. She said IF she's in top form no one will be able to beat her. That actually is true in my opinion. If Serena hits top form at Wimbledon, no one will beat her, and I think people know that which means its unnecessary for her to say. However, if she loses, she'll fall back on "well I wasn't in top form" or "I made too many errors and played horribly" instead of giving any credit to her opponent. The criticism she gets from these kinds of statements is truly deserved.

That said...I still love her and I SO HOPE she, or Venus takes the championship. Good grief...when men make similar comments they aren't given nearly the flack that women are. ROCK ON SERENA!!! Be the baddest bitch and back up your comments!!!

I also SOO hope she or her sister wins wimbledon. Like her or not, she's one hell of a tennis player.

I like you NCAA Kid...you need to post more often.

I've never been fond of Serena. I like Venus a lot. Seems like a more sincere and humble person. I hate to sound racist, but I really like how they brought the African American woman face to the forefront. We had Althea, Zina, some others, but they really changed the color of tennis. I hated it when it was milquetoast white. But, I like it before Serena came in with her attitude, and her freak show outfits. I was watching the French Open 2001 yesterday. SW played Capriati in the semis. I loved watching Serena go down. She certainly was MUCH slimmer back then, while still being appropriately muscular. So I don't buy the argument that Serena is in shape now, or that she is just big boned. She's a donut addicted overweight athlete.
I'd love to see Venus do well again. What, she still has a wrist thing?

Oh boy here we go again with Serena's weight and what is deemed by others as "in shape". If you are following european characteristics of what it is to be "in shape" than I guess you would think that. But, Serena is in good shape. She's a thick girl. No she doesn't have the muscle mass she once did but she's still in shape and every black girl I know would kill for her body. She also still moves better than a lot of them other skinny girls on tour. She's curvy. She's always gonna be that way, and she has a very common build for a black woman. Wimbledon 2005...definitely out of shape. Wimbledon 2007...even in better shape than Australia '07.

As for your other comments...no they are not racist at all. I very much appreciate what Venus and Serena did in making tennis more diverse and acceptable to play amongst blacks. Before Venus and Serena came along, I caught hell growing up from many black people about why I played tennis instead of basketball or football. Venus and Serena proved that you don't have to belong to a country club or be affluent to be professional tennis champions, and now I see more and more people of color on the tennis courts in areas in which the basketball courts were always packed but no one used the tennis courts. What they have accomplished is amazing. It is still, however, seen as an elitist sport. You aren't going to have many Richard Williams' of the world who take the methods he did to raise two tennis champions.

There is an article out now talking about how this is the 50th anniversary of Althea Gibson's Wimbledon win. She was a true pioneer cuz you know sista girl had to deal with some major bullshit back in the day from true racists. The article talks about the war still not being one since fast forward to Miami 2007 and you have that "heckler" saying to Serena "hit the ball in the net like any good n*gger would" So...I hope Serena and Venus use this anniversary as some added incentive to honor her. But yeah...they have definitely made the sport more open to more diverse groups who wouldn't have taken an interest had it not been for their success. That, to me, is their greatest accomplishment. Many tennis "traditionalists" would prefer it to remain a "milquetoast white" sport as you said, and in many aspects it is when you look at the numbers of black people who are professional tennis players. Some of those same "traditionalists" would love for Serena and Venus to be more like James Blake who is a good little boy and who doesn't stir the pot. Then again, there has always been a level of exaggerated cattyness to me that the media seems to portray about the WTA. Guys like Marat Safin and Andy Roddick can curse all over the court. Marat can pull his pants down and hardly get any criticism. If Serena lifted up her dress in the same way...oh my god...are you kidding...she'd never live it down and people would harp on it from now until her induction to the hall of fame, and even beyond. But, it means a lot to me as a man of color and someone who has loved the sport since I was a child in terms of their influence off the court. I get so frustrated when I hear black youth think they can only play football, basketball, or track. But, I've been glad to witness more of those same youth show an interest in playing it. Can't complain about that. Although I'm sure someone will try.

Venus, as far as I know is healthy. I'm concerned that she has become so svelte though. She shouldn't have to worry about running out of energy the way she did at the French though. The points at Wimby will be much shorter. Don't let the tape on her wrists fool you. She always has them wrapped up that way as a precaution. She has a tendency for tendinitis in her wrists. I actually think that if Venus can get past Sharapova, she could make a deep run. Regardless of her dismal results, she has the best record of any active player at Wimbledon, and her record can't be ignored.

I am going to be off topic with this post, echoing Terp a bit. This may merit a separate thread.

I would like to see more black youth in different sports. I think that they are so limited in exposure to only the primary sports, which probably is a lack of facilities, etc. Pickup basketball, football, track (running) can be easily started in the backyard. Tennis, biking, etc.... cannot be picked up in that manner without access to equipment and facilities.

I would love to see more African American soccer players for sure! There is no excuse for them not to play-that is also a sport that could be played in the backyard- unfortunately- no access to organized teams within the city... is it a future money issue?

I mean- also look at all the athletes that are presently cross-training in speed skating and bicycling. Those high level track runners could possibly be excellent in cycling. Even if they play football or basketball, why not cross-train.

I dunno what others feel- but is the lack of variety in black athletes due to financial opportunities in smaller sports, lack of access to facilities, lack of awareness?

Its definitely a bit of all of those, kick. Mostly though, its lack of access and limited financial capability. So of course the opportunities are going to be mostly in track, football, and basketball. I was blessed in that my family has money and I was able to grow up and play lacrosse, soccer, and tennis. Hell, I've even played polo and tried rowing. I'm so not your average brotha. Tennis was the one that stuck with me. Access though the biggest barrier. Most black youth in urban areas also are influenced by what they see and most of their black sports hero's are the Michael Jordan's and Kobe Bryant's, and Emmitt Smith's and Donovan McNabb's of the world. Football and basketball therefore is popular in the household and other sports aren't really introduced to them as possibilities of playing, and aren't watched on tv. I would say that its easier somewhat in tennis than say golf. As much as Tiger Woods has influenced more interest amongst blacks in golf, golf clubs are not cheap and there are fees in playing on most golf courses. If you are a beginner in tennis, you don't need a pro level racquet. You begin with a nice $30-40 racquet and get some balls and find a tennis court somewhere in the burbs. In addition, sports like cycling...i see your point but a) those bikes aren't affordable by many and b.) where are they going to practice in the inner city? Soccer and lacrosse fields and field hockey fields...not in the inner city. Sports like diving and swimming...training facilities like that are not financially accessible to them and not in those areas. And I won't even go there on polo and rowing. Thats just the preppy in me.

I think with more of a black influx into surburban areas, you will begin to see an increase of them in at least soccer, lacrosse, field hockey, and tennis. Some sports though will remain overwhelmingly white though simply because of what it takes to play them.

So yeah...mostly its access but its also lack of exposure and reinforcement in the community that hey...basketball and football aren't the only sports you can be involved in. What it takes is either a mentor or a parent(s) like Richard and Oracene Williams who make the sacrifice to get their kids in one of those type sports, or the kids perhaps being choiced to a suburban school or getting in a private school somewhere where they could at least have access to the facilities.

Its ashame...it really is because what trips me out is that a lot of the troubled inner city youth I mentor, they are so clueless about what it even takes to get into the NFL or the NBA. Yet, that is what the common response is when I ask them what they want to be. They say "I want to play ball" or "I want to play football". Yet, the majority of them a) don't attend school on a regular basis, and b ) don't have the grades to make it on a high school team. So its a process of telling them that the NFL and NBA aren't picking kids up off the local courts and that it starts in either middle school and high school by getting on a team and maintaining whatever the GPA requirements are to stay on the team. Then, you hope to possibly get a scholarship to a college playing one of those sports. How in the hell are you gonna be in the NBA or the NFL AND YOU DON'T GO TO SCHOOL AND HAVE F's?!!!!!!!!

I totally agree about access to cycling.... to me my point was more about how awesome African Americans would do in cycling given the opportunity. Those same strong legs that develop on the track would be completely hard-wired for cycling.

All sporting opportunites would excel given the opportunity, but for some reason cycling just popped into my head.

Well yeah...you're absolutely correct in terms of the same ones who excel in track would more than likely do very well in cycling. Speaking of cycling, I used to love riding my bike. I haven't gone bike riding in such a long time. I think you have just sparked something in me kick. When the boyfriend and I do our annual New England fall vaca I think I'm going to insist on doing some kind of scenic bike ride. It really is fun and great for the legs and cardio.

Meanwhile, to try and keep it somewhat on topic.... YEAH SERENA...GET OVER YOURSELF. YOU ARE NOT ALL THAT AND A BAG OF CHIPS ALTHOUGH I'M SURE THERE ARE SOME POTATO CHIPS CLOSE BY YOU OVERWEIGHT HUSSY.

LMAO!!!

When you and your man are riding past Serena on those bikes tell her to get her ass on one!!

Serena is in mighty fine shape.

Snicks, puh-lease. Your beloved talks without irony about feeling "invincible, " so what's so wrong with anything Serena's saying here? She's just clumsily taking a page from Ali, and sounding like every other top American athlete to come down the pike. I don't see her ripping down others (at least here -- it isn't after a match!) for one thing. Anyway, her and Roger are entitled to boast especially -- a lot of the time it's the plain truth. I don't find it that attractive, but I don't care about or root for either because of their verbal skills.

And I'm glad Serena feels she'll bring more than Shenay Perry will to Wimbledon. Shenay has a pretty grass game, but anyone who has seen her interviewed knows she sure as hell doesn't have a champion's attitude.

Serena sounds like a typical American athlete, all swagger and cock & balls, but of course she has the titles to back it up even though it sounds as bullshitty and obnoxious as ever. Class and tact aren't in her vocabulary...so what, she is what she is...will she back it up? Not if she plays like she did on clay, and not if she plays that awkward clumsy stuff she does when she's not zoning...I look more towards Venus' play simply because she's the grass queen in my book. Neither sister will have an easy time beating Amelie or Justine...in fact, I definitely pick those two for the finals. Although, I'm hoping Hingis causes some damage in her quarter...

Agree with Two Hander. Serena's comments are what you'll find in most Champion Athletes. They have (and need to have) that self belief that runs deep. If she didn't have that kind of mental make up she could never have cut through the draw & won the Austarlian Open this year, especially give that she only played 4 tournaments going into Melbourne. Graf had it, as did Hingis, Seles, even Sanchez Vicario. And so did Connors, McEnroe, Lendl, Sampras, Agassi and Federer. They all believed their matches were on their rackets every time they played. They couldn't be what they were (are) without it. They all may not have been as public as Serena, but their were times all of them expressed it.

Granted, this kind of talk is very un-PC (which is OK with me!). But it's necessary to be where these people get. And there's nothing wrong with expressing it if you can back it up like all of these folks have.

It's hard to argue with anything that's been said because she does sound ridiculous. However, I wonder if because of how arrogant she's sounded in the past, writers lob her questions in a manner to get these sound bytes to sound that bad. I remember doing mock trial in high school and one key to winning was to ask the other team leading questions. With a perfectly worded series of questions, you could pretty much get them to say exactly what you had scripted in your mind. Just a thought.

some of you guys are just insane. one minute your loving Serena and the next your hating her because she talks shit! obviously she is a champ and she doing what she is suppossed to do, which is talk shit before a match...she has backed it up before and if she is healthy she should do it again. for all the talk that tennis is boring because this one is out, or this one retired, or this one is slumping, when something finally exciting or intriguing comes along (Serena, again!) it gets bagged on. the draw is set, the players have arrived and the tourny is underway. there are potenially some really good match-ups down the road so let's see where it goes and who has the game to be standing at the end. If Serena wasn't an "arrogant bitch" then what would you guys have to talk about...

btw, I'm picking Venus. AND I loved Serena's old denim outfit and the boots from the Open a few years back, you can't say the Sista hasn't got balls!

::worship::

If we weren't spending time bitching about Serena being an "arrogant bitch" we could instead be commenting on the confident, classy champion she is becoming, ala Roger Federer.

Serena winning the Australian was both the worst and best thing that could have happened to women's tennis.

Best: It brought a champion back to the game.

Worst: Serena continues to play little and is still not quite at her pique fitness. Lord knows she is among the best female athletes in the world at her pique. Instead of the "best Serena" on court, we get the "good Serena" on court. She is cheating herself and her fans out of her best.

Serena should have become the dominant force in women's tennis- possibly the best ever. Instead we are left with a good player who will simply be among the best.

I dunno if I am making my point here or not LOL- I just wish we could have always gotten the best from her. I don't think she has done that- and I think it is generational- I guess this could be said of a lot of modern players as well.

Well ESPN is now on my sh*t list. So much talk about Serena. She isn't the defending champion, and she isn't the #1 player in the world. But all they go is talk about her on this opening day. I am pissed.

Well like her or not she is the most intriguing story on the women's side to the majority of people. She is a very polarizing figure therefore a huge draw.

HEY! i resent that! i have NEVER spoken kindly about serena...so i have been quite consistent, thank you!

If you saw the fire and determination "Serenar" displayed in her win over Maria Sharapova at the Austrailian Open earlier this year, and most YOU did, you would have to concur that when she is in that "mode", nobody can beat her. That said, if she isn't in THAT mode, anyone in the top 10 or 15 can, do, and have beaten her.

I say, "Mouth off, Serena". Intimidate that rest of the field with your bravado, if you can, including Big Sis. But prove out too.

Prediction: Watch out for Hingis.

TRL

Well Cliff Drysdale defended Serena's comments today. I guess its all in the way you look at it. He took the perspective of that it is pretty much true that when she is in top form, no one is beating her and sees it as words of a champion, just like other champions who have said similar things, and earned the right to say it. Whether one sees it as arrogance or confidence is up to them. But because she is often criticized AD NAUSEUM for such comments, I would prefer she let her tennis racquet do the talking. But, who the hell am I? Then again, I don't know...Cliff confuses Serena and Venus all the time. He may have a thing for "sistas" But seriously, people are always going to find something about Serena to complain about. Whether its her choice of tennis apparel, her outside interests, her power game, her statements...etc...etc. She is polarizing but many people have nothing better to do than bitch and moan about something...anything. Not that there's anything wrong with that of course.

George, you said it -- Serena is polarizing.

I don't get what the whole brouhaha is over these remarks. They're nothing new and could have been way worse. that is if they're even bad. I don't even think they're classless -- a red flag word to me anyway, especially in relationship to the sisters.

More interesting to me was Richard Williams telling Shriver that he thinks Venus, not Serena, has a better chance to win the tournament. It's worth noting that he talked about Serena having a hamstring problem and Venus being more confident than ever. Reverse psychology? Truth? Who knows.

Maybe someone should write Serena a letter?

How about Dr. Phil? LMAO

Serena is the Hilary Clinton of women's tennis - for every fan that loves her another fan loathes her. But that sells tickets and buys TV ratings. so ultimately no matter how classless she sounds it's going to benefit the game.

I have to admit I've been one of those people who have questioned her fitness the past few years, but Australia made me realize she may be similar to Monica Seles and Jennifer Capriati, whose bodies simply changed drastically as they reached physical maturity in her early 20's, and then always heard caustic commentary about their fitness from people who wanted them to still have the same bodies at 26 as they had at 16.

As far as the comparison to Federer and his comments, there is certainly a social/sexual bias at play. We simply will accept certain behaviors from men that we are repulsed by in women - swearing, aggression, etc. are simply less tolerated when they come from women. It's not right, it's not wring, it just is.

I don't think we can ever believe anything Richard Williams says, and I think that Serena has inherited that 'smack talk' mentality. Venus is always a contender on grass but does anyone honestly think she's the front runner? No. Serena suddenly has a hamstring injury - great, that's a good excuse should she bail out. Who knows with Richard Williams, he's show biz.

Well, there is some truth in that. Certainly, if Serena (or Justine or Amelie or any woman) had screamed the female equivalent of what Roddick did at Tsonga in Australia, she would have been vilified. But let's be honest--no way, no how is Serena's current level comparable to Federer's or her own level in 2002. It comes off as arrogant in part because she really hasn't proved she's in a class by herself. She's won two slams in the past four years, and Justine (who has an .890 winning percentage since 2004) didn't play either of them. She may be a bit better tactically than she was five years ago--I thought she played a very cagy match against Vaidisova in Australia--but she certainly doesn't move as well as she did in 2002. She played very well against Sharapova, but Sharapova's an easy player to look good against. Maria doesn't move well, so if you serve and return well you can keep her on the defensive, and you can hit winners with a reasonable margin for error. She doesn't have much variety, so you stay in rhythm. When Sharapova's serve is off, she's susceptible to beatdowns--e.g. Ivanovic at the French and the double bagel against Davenport at Indian Wells. I'm not convinced Serena has proven her A game is so far ahead of anybody else's in 2007 (2002-03 was another story). Besides, a player's B game is a much better measure of how good they really are, unless you think Hana Mandlikova was better than Chris Evert. In 2002-03 Serena's B game was good enough to beat anybody else's A game except Justine on clay. I just don't think she's proven she's at that level now.

I would suggest that the difference between Serena and Roger's comments actually is the level of confidence. As long as Roger is not playing Rafa on Court Centrale in Paris, he knows he is the favorite to win the match. His comments are rather matter-of-fact and said without any real "smack" involved. It reminds me of champions like Evert, Navratilova, Borg, etc. Those players knew they were going to win and talked with more subtle confidence.

Serena has had one or two flashes of brilliance the last four seasons and has pretty much been a non-factor otherwise. Yes, both Serena and Venus are dangerous threats anytime they play. But the fact of the matter is they melt down more than they win these days.

Therefore, Serena's comments come across more as someone who is trying to convince herself she can still dominate when maybe she cannot. The last two years here were a 3rd round loss to Craybas and a DNP last year. She is not coming in as the favorite, though her chance to win may be the favorite story of the press.

Richard's comments always have set a poor example for his daughters. He does whatever necessary to keep them in the limelight.

So now Serena was somehow lucky to have won her two recent Australian Opens because Justine wasn't there? Justine who has never beaten Serena on anything other than clay? I guess Justine was lucky to have won her US Open in '03, and her Australian Open in '04 when Serena wasn't at either of those. Justine got to the finals of all 4 slams last year but she hasn't won anything but the French since '04. Serena didn't say no one was beating her. She said if she hit top form it would be hard for anyone to beat her. And...thats true, particularly on grass. Like I said...I prefer she just let her racquet do the talking but whatever...she's still my fave!! She's often damned if she does and damned if she doesn't. If she's fist pumping and screaming come ons in her match someone has a problem with it. If she doesn't put up any fight in a match people have a problem with it. She is polarizing though and has as many fans as detractors, as do many great sports players; Alex Rodriguez, Tiger Woods. It comes with the territory.

I believe there is a hamstring injury and that its not "all of the sudden". She had tape on the back of her right leg in a practice pic prior to the tournament and clearly didn't want her dad mentioning it. Serena and Venus have always been low key about their injuries and you could tell she didn't want to talk about it in her press conference. Pam Shriver this morning said that she really wasn't moving well in practice today and was working on a lot of return of serves. Pam said its the coldest day she can remember at Wimbledon so that won't help a hamstring issue. Hopefully, its just tightness like Serena said, and she's getting enought treatment for it, and the weather warms up. I've dealt with a tight hamstring before and its more annoying than anything. You're not 100% but its manageable. Hopefully the tournament stays on track and she can benefit from having every other day off.

My two contributions to this conversation:

1) Serena was clearly upset that her father mentioned the hamstring injury to the press. She did not want that out, it seemed to me anyway, and she didn't want to talk about it.

2) My problem with Serena's smack talk is that these are the same things she was saying when she was losing and not performing. I don't think anyone would say she was lucky to win the slams when Justine wasn't present, but it is a fact. Serena was so good at the AO this year, particularly late in the tournament. You can't take that away from her. However, it always seems a little silly to me that she says this stuff when she isn't at the top of the game. I didn't like it when she was saying it when she was at the top, month in, month out, but I at least respected it, and beleived it. I can't say that now.

I'm not a big fan of Serena's but make no mistake about it...I am glad that she is back, and a force at the majors.

Great post Shep. And as a Serena fan I don't see what's so wrong about JC's post, which broadened the topic a lot. He doesn't say anything about the hamstring, and his point that Serena's more recent victories have happened when Justine wasn't around is a valid one. If Justine was at the Australian final I think Serena would have stomped her too, though nowhere near as resoundingly as Sharapova. But she wasn't.

Yes, Serena owns Justine on the other surfaces, but most of their significant matches took place at least a couple of years ago. No one can convince me that Justine isn't a better grass player now than she was a few years back. With Serena it's anyone's guess how she is in relation to 2004, the last year she was really here at Wimbledon.

Venus and Serena are old enough that they follow their own, rather than their father's, example. And what's wrong with Richard stirring up the pot? The only way it's bad is if indeed he's given away something about Serena that she didn't want out there. I'm with kick -- it's hard not to think he's just lighting a fire under Serena's ass. She might need one, considering her conflicted attitude at the French, especially against Henin.

JC's post makes a great deal of sense. I might add though that both Serena and Justine have been through a great deal in the past couple of years. One could split their head to heads in two chapters (pre-2007 and 2007) and perhaps more accurately assess where they are...

Serena won the Aussie with no Justine to battle but Justine won the French, beating Serena handily. Personally, I think both of their performances at their respective grand slam wins were mostly high quality, but yes, Serena didn't have to face Justine down under, and I definitely don't think she would have stomped Justine. If they face each other here on grass, well, I guess we can all look forward to that.

The fact that Justine wasn't at the Australian is a valid one. But, if we're going to make statements like that then we can look at every grand slam and say "well this winner benefited because this top player wasn't in the draw. Justine wasn't there. We'll never know. Serena wasn't there for Justine's US and Australian wins. Yes, its a fact...but we can look at every tournament and speculate at "those who weren't there".

I thought Serena validated her AO win with the next tournament at Miami. She did win that with Justine and Maria there.

YOU'D THINK?!!! Considering Justine played about as flawless of a first set against Serena on a hard court EVER and had 2 match points while Serena was in her mopey dopey mood and playing like crap, and Justine still couldn't win.

Miami ain't a slam, and the courts there aren't grass.

I love Serena and loathe Justine but don't get what the big deal is -- JC was just pointing out a fact. It's not a matter of mentioning such-and-such a random top player didn't play -- the plain fact is that Serena and Justine are the top two women players of this decade, so if one of them ain't around, it is worth mentioning. Lord knows Justine benefited from Serena's absence even more in recent years.

Bryan, I get what you're saying about Justine not being stomped in earlier rounds, but if Serena brought her Aussie final game against Justine, then Justine would have been toast. Serena was smacking winners all over the court in a manner that negated speed. It was an awesome display. I don't think Justine's absence takes anything away from Serena's Aussie win -- clearly she would have been in full-on weirdo mode if she was there. But it does add some serious doubt to the idea that Serena has it made against Justine on grass.

In my mind, no one needs to "justify" a slam win. Winning the slam was justification, whether you play the number one in the world in the finals, or the number 100. Whoever plays their way into the final deserves to be there, no matter what their ranking is.

It seems to me, and it's a bit off topic, because of the increase of sports talk, and the need to fill the endless media oulets, there is always this type of discussion whenever someone wins. There is someone always trying to discount it. I think that sucks. Why would anyone want to take away from anyone's accomplishments? This isn't aimed at anyone here, or in response to a post...just a vent.

Agreed...I co-sign on that.

At this point maybe this thread should be named 'Get over Justine, Serena'.

I know I wanna see it happen.

Not me...if I had my way, they would both lost before their anticipated quarterfinal showdown. Does that make me bad? No need to answer if the answer is yes, by the way.

If Justine had said, in the fall of 2003, "I believe I'm definitely the best player if I'm playing well. It's hard for anyone to beat me," she said. "It's not even a belief. It's more of a fact.", I would absolutely have called her arrogant and pointed out that the best player in the world wasn't present at the U.S. Open. Especially given that fast hardcourts are probably Justine's worst surface.

I think the #1 player in the world, who beat her last time they met and was absent for her grand slam victory, might just be willing to dispute this "fact"--especially since Serena said nothing about surface in her claim to be the best. For that matter, the defending champion of this tournament, who also beat her in their last meeting, might question this fact as well. So would another player who's quoted on tennisreporters.net as saying she thinks she's the #2 player in the world, behind Justine--rightly or wrongly. Oh, and there's also a certain older sister who has more Wimbledon titles and may very well feel she would have won in 2003 too if she hadn't been badly injured. And another woman who slaughtered her last time they met on grass and who doubtless doesn't think she was playing well in the two matches she's lost to Serena this year.

Of course, there's a certain circularity in Serena's thinking. Patty Schnyder could claim she was the best "if I'm playing well", if she dismissed every single loss of her entire career as a result of off days.

Does this arrogance help her on the court? Maybe it does. But maybe it hurts her off the court. If you'd asked Amelie or Justine if they were the best players in the world in 2002, they would have said no, just as Rafael Nadal says no to that question now. Maybe Amelie and Justine are better players than they were five years ago because they knew they weren't the best and needed to work hard to catch up.

To be perfectly honest, most of the arrogant things that Serena says is probably true. However, I wish she wouldn't actually say those things herself because it makes her look bad when she is defeated in a match. If Serena were to always bring that focus and drive that she brought to the 2007 Aussie Open Final against Sharapova, then she would be well within her right to say whatever she wanted. But she doesn't or can't bring that to every match so she shouldn't set herself up to look like ridiculous.

That being said, I wish there were more top professional tennis players, male or female, who had the same confidence and arrogance to think and maybe occassionally say similar things. That would make tennis more interesting and entertaining. Most top professional tennis players are very boring on court and off.

Everything that is not traditional about Serena, including her physique, is good for tennis because regular people like you and me can see that you don't have to be the stereotypical tennis player to play good tennis.

Serena Williams is my favorite tennis player because of what she says, how she looks, how she plays, and for her heart and will to win.

Tennis will never be the same when Serena decides to retire. I don't think there will ever be anyone else like her in the game. I will be very sad when that time comes.

This is such an exasperating conversation because it is so been there, done that.

Either you love or hate her.

I can't stand her personna. I think she is extremely immature and egocentric.

But you can't argue with her tennis. When she is on, I love watching her play.

Unfortuantely in the last 3.5 years, we have only gotten to hear her more than see her.

To me her results have an asterisk because they should be even better. She is indeed Hall of Fame bound. But she will only be in the Top 8-10 players ever in the women's game instead of the Top 1-4 because she wasted her talent.

RE: WILL TO WIN
Serena demonstrates this only when it suits her. When she truly shows up, its beautiful. I just don't think she shows up all the time. Other champions have had a significantly greater input because of their more consistent tenacity and desire to win. When she retires, it will not have as significant of an impact as the true greats that the women's game has ever seen.

Ok...you are officially my favorite board member.

Terp- I thought your favorite board member was snicks

Serena is a strong asset to the game- but none like her?

PLEASE- generation Me is full of the arrogant and self-important. Someone is bound to be more bold and brash than Serena.... and possibly more successful.

Will she be a loss to the sport? Absolutely.

Will she leave a gaping hole? Absolutely not- at least not to the degree you fathom.

[quote name='kick' date='Jun 26 2007, 11:05 PM' post='331810']
Terp- I thought your favorite board member was snicks

Yeah...and Hitler is my favorite showering buddy. Surely you jest.
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She will leave a gaping hole in terms of a dominant, successful African American female presence on the court. Venus was asked about that today in her interview and the lackluster results of the other African American women. So yes...there will be a gaping hole in that aspect.

To the African American sporting community- a huge presence and a gaping hole.

To the American tennis- a great champion will be retiring.

To tennis history in general- a great champion will be retiring.

I guess I am thinking of so many champions that have left the sport and she will be no greater or lesser than them.... and to me, Althea Gibson and Arthur Ashe served a much greater purpose to the African American and tennis communities than Serena or Venus ever will. They are just a contemporary presence of those trail-blazing athletes.