The people I know at my school are pretty open-minded, so if I did come out it wouldn't be so much of a problem with anyone but my teammates and coach (Constant body to body contact, showering together, etc. with a gay person would likely rub even the most accepting of people the wrong way at least a little bit). I have managed to completely separate my sexual preference and the sport though, I'll always be the last on in the shower to make sure I don't stare or do something else to get myself in trouble. Besides, they're not that good looking I'll also go to the trainer or do other things to make sure I'm in the locker room with the fewest other people possible. This is both because I don't want to get caught and also because I just have a weird sense of ethics, I wouldn't want someone that I would never do something sexual with... say a 500 pound woman... staring at and drooling over me. Overall life's been good, one big reason being that my psychiatrist prescribed me some new pills and one of their side effects is that they almost completely kill my sex drive, so I don't really obsess over it anymore (When I first realized that I might even have been bisexual I went into a deep depression because I didn't know how to reconcile the fact that I am grabbing guys in places that would be considered sexual outside the sport while being attracted to guys). The realization that I'm gay is a relatively new thing for me and I'm fine with it at the moment even though I'm not getting any action. Things might change, but for now, I'm happy to be fine with life and won't be coming out until after college.

I know its a bit rambling and I may have repeated things a few times, but I'm a college student and I had a few beers before. Like I said, I've only really talked to three people about this, and I only realized that I'm probably, very likely fully gay and not bi a few weeks ago, so I wasn't exactly sure of what to say. It does feel good to get this off my chest though, I cant really talk about to anyone since my friends are fine with my being gay but I doubt they'd want to hear about it for an extended period. If anyone reads this, thanks.

Welcome to Outsports.

Welcome to the Family.

Best Wishes.

Rob

Welcome CW!

If I were you I wouldn't feel any pressure about coming out. It takes a while to come to grips with a big change in the perception of how you life was supposed to go. It takes some people a lifetime. Take you time and enjoy Outsports!

Hey CW, I read your post too. Way over in Eurp! Its interesting to read the various conflicts, questions and decison-making, reminds me of stuff I went through years ago when I was coming out. Now, being gay is such a non-issue that I cant recall those feelings. Just enjoy what you are doing with your life at the moment because sometime in the future when you are are no longer doing those things you will look back with nostalgia. You seem pretty adjusted anyhow.

cw...

there's no rush to figure things out.

You have your entire life to to sort what's best for you to do about your sexuality and how it fits in the scheme of life.

Keep wrestlin', keep livin' life to the fullest.

Welcome to the boards college wrestler! I wish you the best of luck and I am so glad that you found this site and feel comfortable enough to post here. Please keep us posted on what is happening with you. This is a great place to ask questions because many of us have already been where you are at now. (not necessarily wrestling in college--but the whole coming out process).

Another welcome CW. And ditto on not being too preoccupied with "official" coming out. It never really ends since you feel as though you have to keep doing it with every new acquaitance. The most important thing is that you seem to have figured out who you are, and now you can work on what you want to do in life.

Hope you will come back when you've sobered up. I am a great fan of the art of wrestling, as you will see in the Hot Jocks thread.

Wrestling's the oldest sport. (Unless you consider sex a sport. And I don't.) And for my part, the purest.

So relax and enjoy those college years.

HI CW:
Trust me, if you want to get something off your chest, you will get feedback here! I agree that you deal with your sexuality in your own way and there is no timetable. Look forward to having you here.
Jim

Hey CW,

Glad you found us. There are lots of stories/threads here that are very similar to yours & yet different in many ways. Welcome & keep us posted. If you desire to read others stories here let us know & we'll "link" you to the other threads.

Trust me, you're not alone!

Welcome to the board. A couple questions/comments, if you don't mind...

1) What year are you in? How much longer will you be wrestling in college?
2) Have you talked about your sexuality with your psychiatrist? If so has he/she been helpful?
3) You said you had a few beers before but also that your psychiatrist prescribed you something. You probably don't need to hear this, but be careful. The prescription and the alcohol may not be a good mix.

Hey Man,

Good to have more college athletes on the boards. Especially ones who understand what true suffering means (ie. hitting the bike with every single article of cloathing you own on combined with the ability to deprive ones self of food to the point that it would make anorexics jealous). I also found it interesting that bit about hitting the showers late and making a point to not check the guys out out of respect. I did this as well all throught highschool but now we have separate shower stalls. Anyway it sorta just got me wondering if anyone else did that but I don't really want to hijack this thread, so I will probably make another one or something.

Anyway, welcom.

Hey guys, thanks for the kind remarks, I haven't been back mainly for the fear that someone would have been negative about my being in the closet... thankfully thats not the case, not that I rationally thought it would be, but I get irrationally afraid of stupid things like that. Plus I'm getting back in the swing of things at school, so I've been busy as hell. Anyway, Joe, I have 2 more years wrestling in college, I haven't talked to my psychiatrist about my sexuality, but I plan on talking to one at school about it, and I can drink on my medications, I just can't overdo it. Oh, and Maddog, the thing is that I really don't feel any pressure about coming out, since all the people I truly care about in my life would be cool with it or already know. Its fear that keeps me in the closet, since the wrestling community is notoriously homophobic and I would likely be ostracized by the majority of people in it. Not to mention the fact that I coach and (my biggest fear, one that is completely unfounded) envision a lot of people viewing me as a child molester of sorts for doing community service. Plus, if I showed up at a wrestling event in my hometown, I fear that someone would want to start a fight with me even though I was basically one of a handful of people who turned wrestling into a competitive sport in my hometown. Granted, I'd likely kick someone's ass in a fight, but having a scumbag do something ignorant like that scares the shit out of me, and there are a lot of scumbags in my hometown. [Edited - Too Much Personal Info]

Going off subject, I also read a bunch more posts on here. Knowing other people have gone through this same stuff really makes it easier to deal with. Reading about Frustrated_Coach here and some other places also opened my eyes to both the increasing tolerance towards gay people (The firing wasn't immediate!) as well as what I believe to be, at least on the surface, a shift to where performance matters more than your personal life. Since so many articles talked about performance related reasons for the firing (which is unfortunate) and listed being gay as a background reason, even if it may have been a major reason, things seem to have gotten better with time, again, if only on the surface. Of course you could see all the intolerance that is still present, but all the information on the subject gives a pretty modern and complete view of coming out in the athletic world.

If y'all are interested, I'll keep you updated during the season, within limits that don't compromise my anonymity. Again, thanks for the positive replies, and sorry for having that fear in my gut about you guys, I knew it wasn't rational, but it was still there.

Peace

Oh! One final thing, I actually had a gay guy hit on me the other day! Granted I was out at a bar with some teammates, so I couldn't really do anything, but an openly gay guy was getting friendly with me! I "flirted" back a bit, but couldn't do anything too much because I had to play it off as a joke to the guys I was with. It was one of two highlights of my week, the other being smoking a hookah filled with flavored tobacco, which was almost as awesome.

Again, this was a bit rambling, cuz again, I've tossed back a few.

Great to see you back CW. And though you say you've knocked back a few, your last post seems almost as though it were written by a different person; a more likeable one at that. Well written.

Well, in six years of the message board it's the first time that sentence has been written!

Thanks for the update and it sounds like you are following your instincts, which is always best. Good luck and keep us posted.

Jim

CW -

Your epic missives have been great to read and thank your for your honesty and candor. I was once in your position and I took a different rout. I chose the hang up the skates and take a different road because the pain of the two competing sides was more than I could take. I now see my mistakes, but it is too late to go back - it was 17 years ago. This board, I hope, will continue to give men and women like you the opportunity to find support. Coming out is not an event, life has taught me, it is daily life.

Welcome.

Hey College Wrestler-

I was touched by your story. Would you be interested in being interviewed if we did this completely confidentially, changing your name to a pseudonym, not reporting the school you attend, and doing the interviews in a discrete location of your choice.

Your story is crucial to my research.

Look forward to hearing from you

Paul

PS

My contact info is ptontz@du.edu, or gayathletestudy@yahoo.com

Thanks

We all cope with adversity in different ways, so don't feel too bad about your decision. Hell, you at least had the balls to just quit, last year I attempted to break my wrist in various ways due to the combined stress of cutting 25 pounds of weight and coming to terms with my sexuality. It didn't work thank god, but even though I wanted to quit, I couldn't without a reason for other people to see. I won't go into it, but I did some very stupid things because I stayed on the team, if I had taken a year off it probably would have been healthier for me. The one thing I will say is that I have always enjoyed dipping tobacco on occasion and usually only when I'm drunk, but I got to the point that I was going through 2 tins of it a day by the end of the season and while I don't do it as much any more, I've become addicted to it.

I know this is kind of a somber post, so I'll end on a lighter note. I also tried to break my wrist my sophomore year of high school because back then I was 35 pounds under my natural weight, but since I couldn't do it myself, I took a $100 bill to school and tried to give it to all of my friends if one of them would do it, but of course they didn't. One kid did consider it though, but after a few days of thinking it over, he straight up told me that I was one of the most screwed up people he knew for asking him to do that That season, I lost a match in the regional tournament, but I made it to the second day. There was no weigh in that day and I knew I wasn't going to place, so I came in 15 pounds over weight and had a bottle of sparkling cider so I could celebrate when I finally lost. I don't think I was ever so happy to lose a match in my life, or prepared to celebrate a loss with a bottle of fine bubbly.

Hey CW:
Your wrist story was a classic and I highlighted it on our blog.

I am enjoying reading your posts and appreciate you sharing your stories with us.

Good luck!

Hey, thanks Jim, this board gives me a place to say things that are on my mind and I can't really say anywhere else. Like tonight, I was pleasantly surprised when I was hanging out with some guys on the team and the topic of homosexuality popped up. There wasn't any real animosity in anything they said, mostly that they were fine with it in general, but would be a bit skeeved out if they wrestled someone who was gay. There was one comment that was a bit funny though, one guy said that he can't see how a gay person can wrestle, since wrestlers want to kick someone's ass, and gay people want to have sex with that same ass, heh heh. The comment is politically incorrect, but still is funny at the same time. I mean, it is kind of true if a guy is good looking, but that topic isn't on my mind at any point when I'm actually wrestling, when I'm getting ready to wrestle, or when the match is over and I'm dead tired. Besides, there is the respect factor, even if someone is good looking, I'm not gonna think of them in a sexual way since they had enough respect to face me in a wrestling match (Well... if they are extremely hot, I'll at least try not to, and push it out of my head if something sexual pops into it).

Oh and one other funny thing from tonight, a friend from back home called and said that the next time I'm home that we have to go to a bar, since the last time we hung out we were like 19, because he joined the army. Anyway, he said that we gotta pick up some chicks, and a few minutes later he added that he forgot, and we'd maybe find me a guy . This was surprising since I didn't really think he was that accepting of homosexuality, I thought that since we were friends and I'm not overtly gay, he just put up with the fact. Aight, peace y'all, I'm off to bed.

Hey CW,

Sorry I have not seen this post earlier, but I don't go online for recreational reading that often as I do all of my work online and when I'm not working, I want to get away from the computer.

In any event, I have read your postings and wanted to give you some information, comments and opinions that may be of some help to you.
-- First, by way of intro, let me tell you that I wrestled in high school and college, then volunteered as an assistant wrestling coach at several high for nine years. I was unaware of my sexuality when I started wrestling, but I became aware by my mid-20s, while I was coaching, which is when I did come out. My experience cannot be considered universal, but at that time (1982), it was easier for me to come out to the jock community that I was gay than to tell the gay community I was a jock. And not just a jock, because at the time I was also the sports editor of the largest paper in the state.

-- I have talked with many gay athletes from other sports who told me they had wanted to wrestle in high school, but they were already aware of their sexuality by then and therefore were inhibited from trying it, so they went into other sports with less contact. Some end up wrestling later when they can handle it, others are happy with the sports choice they make. I think the only gays who lose in that situation are the ones who don't try sports at all.

-- There is, thanks to a lot of sacrifices by a lot of people over the past 20-30 years, greater acceptance of gays in wrestling than you might imagine. Wrestling has been sanctioned by USAW/FILA since 1982, the only sport to receive sanctioning every Gay Games. When we have gone into a new city to hold a Games, the local wrestling officials are at first leery of us, not knowing if we are serious about wrestling, but when they see us they not only become impressed, they become involved.

-- There are numerous gay wrestling clubs that are charter clubs within USAW. Los Angeles, San Francisco, Chicago (which started last year and paid its initial fees with a stipen from San Francisco) are just a few. The international organization that represents these clubs is Wrestlers Without Borders (www.wrestlerswob.com). You might want to check that out to see if there is a club near you. Granted, it's freestyle not folkstyle, but many of the wrestlers come from scholastic wrestling backgrounds.

-- People are point on when they tell you to come out only when and if you are ready. Don't let anyone pressure you: you will create enough pressure on yourself. I can say I have never known an athlete who did not feel empowered after coming out and better able to perform in his or her sport.

-- I think the reason why my coming out in Alaska was as smooth as it was was because I never made an issue of my sexuality. If someone asked me, I told them, I never denied or hid. Some who were comfortable asked and continued to be supportive. I am sure some others were uncomfortable, but they valued my wrestling coaching abilities (I was a little guy who
could safely handle anyone from 98 pounds to 177) more than they feared my sexuality.

-- When I say the USAW has accepted gays in the sport, I should give you some examples. Well, here in San Francisco we just had our annual torunament and it celebrated the 25thn anniversary of the first Gay Games, We had the former wrestling coach at Columbia and SF State, who addressed the 1982 tournament, come back to give a rousing, inspirational speech. The schools have asked Golden Gate WC to coach clinics for their wrestlers (we're setting up the program now). In Chicago, a major USAW Official has been working every month to help with their club and teach moves to the newcomers. For them, as with us, it is all about growing the sport so that as many people can benefit from it as possible.

-- On the WWB website, there's an informational book I co-wrote about the past 30 years of the Gay Games and wrestling. You might enjoy reading it. In particular, read the final story about the 'hooks' of wrestling and how gays have coped with wrestling.

-- My family never watched me wrestle while I was in scool (or play rugby, baseball or soccer). One of the best things to happen to me last year was to be able to wrestle in front of my mom, sister and niece and win a gold medal at the Games -- and have them see me coach so many guys through their matches. It is the only time that my biological family has really gooten to see me in my extended family. Just wish my father was alive to see it.

-- Good luck and write me any time you need advice or just to say hello.

roger

Don't know about CW but I am certainly inspired by your post rogerb.

Now if someone could just advise me how to get out of gardening with my partner and go watch the rugby match at a local sports bar instead, the day would be perfect.

Try saying: "I'm not gardening with you today. I'm going to watch the rugby match at the local sports bar." Then leave.

Hey guys, just one quick thought I had before I go to bed. Sorry if I come across as a bit moralizing and self-righteous, but I'm always thinking of what I should do that would make the straight wrestling community more accepting of me when I come out. Things like trying to avoid the showers when most guys are in them, doing my best to not view my teammates or opponents in a sexual way, etc. etc. These are ways that I believe straight wrestlers would want a gay teammate to behave in. Besides, I think I've said it before, but I don't think that I'd be able to wrestle if I didn't in some way moralize my position.

Oh, and rogerb, that post really opened my eyes. Its good to know that the wrestling community is growing more accepting of gays, especially the coaching part. Also, I think I know what you mean about coming out to the athletic and gay communities and it being different. I've competed with other athletes my entire life, in just about every sport a dad can get his kid to play, so there is going to be a large number of people who support me in that community when I do come out. On the flip side, I don't know anyone in the gay community, and I am a jock, a bit of a video game geek and come across as nice, but far from proper. I think the term for the way I come across is 'straight acting' and I don't think my interests of sports and video games are big among gays, correct me if I am wrong. So when I introduce myself to the gay community, I kind of envision a bunch of people scratching their heads saying, "He doesn't look gay, act gay (Well... when I do come out, there are a few ways in which I plan to 'act gay' that I am REALLY am looking forward to ), or even seem gay, hell, he acts like a bit of a redneck, wait, IS he gay?". So while telling the athletic community will be hard for me, I think I understand what you mean about how it was harder to tell the gay community you were a jock, because I myself don't think I'll fit into it.

Anyway, disregarding all that crap I just said, thanks for the post, I agree with sportinlife that it was really inspiring. I thought the funniest part was that you could beat just about anyone on your team as a little guy, it reminded me of when I was a little guy back in high school before I put some muscle on and I could pin every single one of my teammates, even the heavyweight. If anything, that little bit about how good you were at your weight and the respect you were provided as a coach due to that reminded me of how much respect I get from all the guys on my old team. Realizing how much respect they give me honestly gives me a lot more courage to tell them when the time comes. Even if they find out through other sources, I don't really feel afraid of facing them. Now, on the other hand, once I come out and have to tell the gay community that my ideal Friday night consists of 3 friends, an X-Box, Halo, and a whole crapload of cheap beer... I dunno, that I'm apprehensive about, lol.

Damn, I only intended to write the first paragraph, but then I saw rogerb's post, lol. So here you go, another rambling bit of crap from yours truly.

I will correct you because you are wrong.

This site alone shows that there are a LOT of gay guys into sports. I play on a gay-oriented flag football team in LA (and there are others throughout the country) and a lot of my teammates are always making plans to have a Madden night. Your perceptions are common among younger people who have not yet been exposed to the wider world out there. You should think about wrestling in the 2010 Gay Games in Germany -- the competition is intense as Roger B knows and you would meet a whole new group of people (and being in Germany you would have no fear of being found out by anyone you didn't want to find you out).

Jim

Hey Wrestler, best of luck on your journey! I remember back when I was around where you are now (but without the sports), it was a pretty exciting if a bit nervewracking time. Just remember who you are and if/when you do come out, don't feel like you have to conform to others' expectations of what it means to be gay. Be your own man.

Anyway, I will say that from my experience, there's something to be said for living in a larger city (in my case Chicago), with a developed gay community and generally progressive attitude. I've found it pretty easy to find gay and straight people who share my interests (although they're not always the same group), but also who feel comfortable around each other. Of course, it can make it easier to "ghettoize" yourself if you so choose, so that you can spend your day going to a gay cafe for brunch, playing gay sports in the afternoon, go shopping at a gay comic book store, and buy your gay outfit from a gay clothing store for your night at a gay play or movie, followed by a late gay dinner and dancing at a gay club. I mean, I love the gays and all, but there's a limit. As soon as you find yourself calling your straight male friends "girl" it might be time to take a step back.

Hi all, I just joined this site referred by rogerb. I never paid attention to wrestling growing up, but got into it after seeing a college match 2000. My first impression was "Wow, these are the most well-built guys around, and they can kick somebody's ass rather than just lifting a weight. I want to hang out with guys like that." I joined a WWB freestyle club in 2001. I originally went there just to watch, thinking I could never do this, but they were so encouraging I gave it a try. Later I attended a couple BJJ schools and an MMA school.

collegewrestler, I do think there's more fear of homophobia rather than actual, though college wrestling teams are often worse than private clubs/schools. But there are many gay wrestlers who have "been there" and can offer support. If you accept the fact that 90% of men have at least some level of same-sex attraction even if they wouldn't be considered "gay", a lot of those guys are in wrestling/MMA classes and clubs. Homophobia is really a religious-based phenomenon from what I've seen, though peer pressure (real or imagined) seems to be more of a factor in college. You may have to ignore/avoid a few extreme people, but most guys who are serious about wrestling have a good attitude. They know guys sometimes get hardons while wrestling. They're used to touching guys so they're less paranoid about it than the general population. Hugging your opponent after a match became universal in MMA some years ago and has now spread to boxing, although it may not have reached college wrestling yet. The trick is to distinguish between "male bonding" and coming on to somebody.

In general, what we need is more "out" wrestlers who can teach homophobes a lesson on the mat. But, understandably, you may not want to have to defend your sexuality on the mat all the time. But remember that "gay" and "straight" are artificial categories that don't match reality. The fact is that most guys like to hang out with their male buddies, enjoy the feeling of touching a solid manly guy, and their dicks may get hard more often than they admit. So you might tell yourself, "I'm a normal guy, not 'gay' or 'straight', and I'm just as normal as those other wrestlers." In that light, you don't necessarily need to reveal your sexuality; it's just a small factor that has been blown out of proportion by society.

Wrestling is a traditional male sport, and traditional males shower communally to show they aren't ashamed of their wieners, and they make pseudo-homosexual comments about each other (or even themselves) just to show they have the balls to do so (and that they can say it without getting an erection). This may sound homophobic but it's often just male competition. So I wouldn't avoid the showers but you'll have to decide when/how to participate in a nonthreatening way. Maybe wait till the guys have gotten used to you being gay. Or if it's a three-person shower stand, maybe go to the next one rather than sharing one. If a dick catches your eye, just recognize that's normal and don't dwell on it. Once the guys know they can trust you, it won't be an issue.

"envision a lot of people viewing me as a child molester of sorts for doing community service" ===> That prejudice is difficult to overcome if you work with younger people who have unreasonable parents. Most teachers I know in that situation remain in the closet.

"Plus, if I showed up at a wrestling event in my hometown, I fear that someone would want to start a fight with me even though I was basically one of a handful of people who turned wrestling into a competitive sport in my hometown." ===> Guys like that would be shocked to learn how much gays have contributed to the formation and preservation of wrestling and combat sports, and how many gay guys could wipe the mat with them. But the under-30 generation is *much* more accepting than their elders, so it may just be a matter of time. If the gay community would stop giving the impression that all gays are effeminite, and not have drag queens MC'ing every single event or fundraiser, it would help.

Haha, well, among our age set you might get a few funny looks. I've noticed that a lot of college aged/younger 20s gay guys tend to try and "look gay" instead of just being who they are. It's a matter of wanting to fit in with a new identity instead of sticking with the one that's worked for them in the past (which isn't to say that people's personalities don't change, but there are better reasons to change). Anyway, there are gay gamers out there for sure and as you can see on this site, many gay jocks.

So, you may get a few funny looks, but the gays vary as wildly as our straight counterparts. It's just a matter of finding like minded people.

I just got back from a regional USAW association meeting and it is interesting to note that the head of the association told all of the coaches there that if GGWC hadn't turned out in force to help run their biggest tournament last year they could not have pulled it off.

collegewrestler, when you say you are doing things like trying to avoid guys in tthe showers ... well, that's the kind of behavior that can single you out as 'suspect' and it is not a true reflection of who you are or why you are there. I'd just go about your business the way you always did since you were a kid and not worry about it.

Hey y'all, sorry I haven't been on in a while, but some shit has happened that I didn't expect. Basically I got hurt, causing me some mental trouble, coupled with a few bad grades on some tests and papers. Also, my grandmother hasn't been doing too well. At the moment, it looks like I might be taking the year off from wrestling. Besides, taking a year off gives me one year of wrestling in grad school, and I can use that as a bargaining chip to get into a better school than normal.

Anyway, enough about the negatives. I talked to some teachers of my school when the aforementioned crap happened, and it came out that I wasn't straight. They were very supportive, and promised to keep it secret, a few said it gave them insight into some previous problems that I've had over the years. So the administration here at least has my back if I come out and people are dicks.

Also, I said before that my one friend joked that I might find a guy over my thanksgiving break from school, which surprised me, but another friend said that he would see if a gay friend of his would want to hang out the next time I'm home. If this happens, it.. will... be... AWESOME! Especially if it leads somewhere .

To make up for not wrestling, I'm taking up a new sport though, any of y'all play frisbee golf? It kicks ass! Aight, well I got stuff to do, just lettin y'all know why I haven't been around and whats up. I'll check out the new posts a little later and see what they say, and again, thanks for being supportive and giving me a place to vent guys.

[Edited - I gave out a little too much personal info]

Oh... and guys popping boners, lol, I've got a funny story about that. This guy was talking to his girlfriend who was in the stands before his match and he got a hard on. Well, he had two matches to lose it, so he thought he was good and it would go away. Then all of a sudden there was a pin and he went around getting people to slap him in the face and hit him in the hopes it would go away. Lucky for him it did =P. Anyway, you're probably right that most people do have some degree of latent homosexuality and enjoy the sport, to some degree, for things they won't admit. Hell, the only guy I've wrestled with that openly despised (Didn't think they should exist, as in the ones who do exist should die) homosexuals was the guy who, after practice, was asking guys to roll around with him.

Oh, and the pseudo gay comments, you're right about it, everyone on the team spews them.

[Edited - Personal Info... I just realized a few things I've been saying that could really give away my identity]

Hah hah, if anyone ever catches me calling a man girl, except in jest, one of two things has happened.

A. *Not very politically correct, but what the hell*

Me: "I've been hit in the head by a large blunt object and am suffering from severe cranial
hemmhoraging! I need help now! Dave! I need help girl!"
Dave: "Did you just call me a girl? I know you're gay, but not that gay."
Me: "Of course I did girlfriend, now stop being a sillypants and call for help!"
Dave: "How come you're speaking like a flaming homosexual? Arghhhh! You're hitting on me! I'm leaving!"
Me: *Dies*

B. "These psychedelic mushrooms are awesome man, your face is melting! Oh my gawd! You're a woman! Hey girlfriend!" Actually, with my female friends, I just cut the 'man' out of 'what's up man'. So option B also involves blunt force trauma to my head.

I guess the one thing that happens when I'm around friends who know I'm gay is that I speak a lot less harshly, so instead of greeting someone with "What's up f**ker?!?" I say, "What's up man" or "Sup".

So, if I was hanging around with gay guys, my guess is that I'd curse a whole lot less and act somewhat cultured and less rednecky. But no 'girl' will come out of my mouth when referring to a guy... unless I'm insulting him =P

Dude, (this is my normal salutation)

I know that you coming out and all, but the responses aren’t as dramatic as you imagine. I seldom, if ever, call anyone "girl", straight or gay. I have always found it inappropriate, but over the intervening years since I started this coming out process, I have lightened up and am no longer offended by it. In fact, I might even employ it once and a while in jest. Yet, like all subcultures, there are certain slang terms that are fun and funny, and NOT meant to be taken literally. "Girl" is, at least in my experience, used as a term of endearment, and acceptance within the community as a brother (or sister as it may be!)

So girl, you are taking it a bit too personal. Lighten up and have some fun.

Lack of sleep, papers to write and midterms looming over my head makes me a dull boy... You're right girlfriend, sorry about the stick my school has shoved up my ass this week. Y'all know if I come across as saying something thats offensive to anyone here, I likely don't mean to offend you, its just that I'm not a big one for political correctness. But anyway, time to shut myself in and hit the books again and not see daylight for the next 48 hours. I'll try to gay it up a bit with my closing statement, lol, and no I'm not being sarcastic, just showin ya that I aint takin the whole issue too personally.

Kisses to all of you out there *heh* *heh* toodaloo,
-CW

Honeslty CW, I hate it when gay guys use the feminine pronouns. It drives me crazy but I understand that's how some people like to communicate. But don't think you have to say "girl this" or "she said that" when you decide to come out of the closet. There is no set vernacular for gayspeak. For the record I don't care for queer either. I'm just your average, run-of-the-mill homosexual.

Hey Gaywrestler-I Hadn't been on here much lately ( I discovered YouTube and have gotten addicted.) Just want to tell you I was outed at work a few years ago and it has worked out fine - If middle-aged COPs can accept a gay co-worker then your college-aged buds can too. BUT I do make sure that I don't crowd next to anyone at the urinals ( there are only 2 and one is a kids height.) A few brave ones do stand next to me, but very few. Also when I work out I cover up with towel or boxers when coming to/from the shower (younger guys especially are sensitive to that.) It helps that I have a life partner so most guys realize I am not interested. Once they realized that the queer guy wasn't gonna try to attack them sexually they seemed to relax. Welcome to Outsports -This is a great place to bounce ideas off of people and really be your self.
Also I really never use "girl" or "she" when talkin about gay guys. I'm a MAN who likes men. I have met older gay guys over 60 who seem to have done it for years, I think its generational. I should lighten up but it has as little do with my life as a gay man, as drag queens do. They each seem to have their place but not in MY GAY world. But if someone else does use those feminisms I figure it a goofy affectation, kind of like dipping snuff or smoking-its just not for ME.
Welcome, (a month or 2 late) .................... COPMAN

Hey man, whats up? Actually, I'm not too surprised that Cops will accept a gay guy. My dad worked as a Cop and one of his fellow Cops was gay. Hell, after New Years every year the guy would come in and it would be the one day of the year he would act gay around the other Cops. They thought it was hilarious and nobody f**ked with him from what my dad tells me. Heck, the guy saved my dad's ass in a barfight once.

I guess this brings up a funny point. From what I can tell, in the stories I've read online, it seems like most gay guys are a lot less scared of telling their mom than their dad. Well, my mom is very politically incorrect, but in a polite manner unlike me, and she lets things slip that are intollerant as f**k, but she herself has gay, black, hispanic, and just about every other type of friend you can imagine. So due to this and the fact that my dad has stuck up for gay people his whole life, I have almost no fear of telling him and some apprehension about telling my mom. Eh, whatever, but it was good hearing from you, ya PIG-gly wiggly, =). My daddy tells me that means "Pride, Integrity, Guts" so I don't mean it as an insult, heh heh.

Peace dude,

-Matt

Oh... don't worry, I'm just joking around, my big problem will be to stop talking like I normally do. I've had to do this around girls for years, but let me provide you with a little example of some of my favorite words:

When something awesome happens: F-ing shit man!
When I do something stupid: Godf**kshit! orrrr Godshitf**k!
Greeting someone: Sup, f**ker? or if they don't see me at first, Hey ass****!
or How you doing you fat sack of shit? <- if they're a wrestler... we have weight issues =P

The list goes on and on, but that kinda needs to stop if I plan on hooking up with a guy. I mean I know some girls are attracted to ass****s, and I'm sure some guys are too, but I'm no ass****, thats just how I speak, lol. Though I have to admit, it might be fun to speak in those feminine pronouns to my sister, or to her boyfriend when I come out, lol, I mean I've hung out with the kid before and he's cool, but that would be some funny shit. Maybe even tell him hes cute, or tell my sister I'm gonna steal him from her, I really am cracking up in real life as I write this, lol.
Yea... but I'd only use em in jest. If I ever caught myself using em for real, I'm popping in a lip of Skoal and acting like a total redneck until I stop, maybe buying some flannel and and a shotgun and shootin me some deer. I mean, nothing against it, but that aint me. I have no sense of fashion other than going into PacSun and buying some tee-shirts, like the one I'm wearing now that has pictures of cheeseburgers and fries in the brand logo and says, "meat and cheese"... high fashion... high fashion... especially coupled with my 6 year old cargo shorts missing the button, lol. Oh, and I can't decorate either, my idea of decorating comes down to spending 6 hours to pick up the trash off my floor... speaking of which, I haven't seen that in ages, I may have to go spelunking for a few hours to see if the carpet hasn't eroded away. Yea, but based on those two things, me using "girl" is about as acceptable as a Yankee fan saying "Go Red Sox".
Sorry about all the laughing at myself in here, but its midterm week and I think lack of sleep is making me go stir-crazy... lol... dammit! I did it again...

Peace, Son, (lets try some ghetto GUY speak rather than black woman speak here)

-Matt

Oooooooh! Just thought of something, don't know if I should post it here or somewhere else, but F it. Is anyone else excited as hell that all 10 season of Stargate SG1 just came out on DVD! I'm getting it this weekend when I get my check for coaching this summer. Granted, Sheppard in Atlantis may be cuter than the guys in SG1, but as far as the show goes, the whole way they twist all different sorts of mythology and shit around can't be beat. Plus I missed a lot of the beginning seasons so I'm excited as hell to see what happened.

Peace Homies

-Matt

(Trying another different ending, "Peace, Fahkers" just makes me sound like an a-hole, and "guys" "dudes" etc just sound too generic. I do think I like "Peace, Son" for my replies, cuz its ridiculous that a 21 yr old is calling people "son" when I'm willing to bet some of you guys are double my age, lol)

Ok guys, I have a question for y'all. Since I haven't been wrestling, I've felt much more confident in the person who I am, I'm not stressed out 24/7 and am looking forward to finding out about the gay scene on my campus. Basically, I feel like I can finally be ME again, for the first time since I heard some VERY homophobic remarks from my teammates and had a gay guy hit on me before I was comfortable with my sexuality. Those things kinda turned me into a social recluse to hide the fact that I'm gay.

Anyhow, as I've probably said all that before, here comes the problem. I have absolutely no goals in life now that I'm not wrestling! I mean sure, I want to finally hook up with a guy, but I mean like life goals. I mean, honestly, right now I have no clue what I'm going to do with my life once I graduate from school. It sounds kind of stupid, but even doing schoolwork to graduate seems pointless (to a degree) because I have no goals or visions of what I'm gonna do with my degree. I guess wrestling always gave me a physical goal to work towards that stood out in front of everything else and gave me some direction in life. I guess the fact that part of the cause of me not wrestling right now was getting hurt also had something to do with this because it kind of took all control out of my hands. Cause even if I still stayed on the team, I wouldn't be wrestling at the moment.

Ok, so what I'm asking is for a few opinions on what seems to be the better option right now. Being on the team and not wrestling is the only option I won't consider because it adds the stress of wrestling without all of the goals that give my life focus. So when I'm capable of doing it, should I join the team again, or should I search around and find something else to do with my time that gives my life some focus? Right now I'm leaning towards quitting, as thats the status quo, and its easier to just go along with the flow of things rather than change em, know what I mean? Plus now that I'm actually starting to go out again, its nice to be able to drink a case of beer and not worry about my weight as long as I don't grow a beer gut. Cause the beer gut causes the anorexia I developed from my years of wrestling to kick in and I get disgusted with myself and just don't eat til the gut disappears, lol. Not the best thing when you need some energy to stay awake in class. Plus no wrestling = no piss testing... while I don't touch any hard drugs, I won't lie about the fact that a little puff every now and then is a fun thing. Hell, my best semester was the one I smoked the most weed in my life in, so it can't kill too many braincells.

I wish I could give a little more information on my situation right now, but if anyone who knows me reads this, anything at all would be a dead giveaway. So I'll just stick with the two big reasons for quitting, getting injured and getting stressed out from everything school related with wrestling being the straw that broke the camel's back, stress-wise that is. Obviously a good deal of that stress comes from my sexuality and the way I view my teammates in general due to their comments, even though I know that about half of them are good guys and would likely be tolerant, though probably not accepting. I won't get into a rant about that subject again, but suffice to say, the question comes down to:

Lots of Stress, Hiding Like My Life Depended on It, Seemingly Reachable Goals

or

Some Stress, Some Hiding, No Goals That Seem Worthwhile at the Moment

I know, its kind of stupid, but if I could get some opinions, I'd be grateful.

-Matt

One of the hardest phases in an athletes life, is when the time comes to step away from competition and move on to something else. It's a scary situation to be in as you've spent your entire life focused on one thing... being number one in your sport.

My suggestion is that you sit down and really think about what you'd like to do with your life... try to imagine what you'd want to be doing 10-15 years from now. Think about what you're really passionate about or really enjoy doing, and see if you can turn that into a career.

Some suggestions...

Would you be able to go to school to become a high school teacher so you can teach/coach wrestling?

Maybe you take kinesiology and learn to become a personal trainer or something related to sports?

At the end of the day Matt, you were given an awesome gift of being a very talented wrestler... it'd be a shame to see you waste that gift now that you're no longer competing. It'd be awesome if you could share what you know to younger kids who want to follow the same path you did.

Excellent response ENIGMA-............... CW I would try to think of what you would like to do if you had no preconcieved rules or expectations. Then dream a while and try to set up new goals to work towards. Besides smokin pot & gettin laid. Life moves fast.

Thanks guys, I definitely agree with your sentiments. As much as wrestling has given me over the years, right now it just isn't for me. I guess I'll share a little bit more about the situation I'm in, and why wrestling has stressed me out so much, if I haven't mentioned this before.

The crazy thing is that the exact moment I realized I liked guys, I had no problem with it. In fact, it was right after wrestling season, and the rest of that semester was my best academically, the one I was most sociable, and the last one I was able to be myself and actually have fun and not worry when I went out to party. The next year, things were going good until I got hurt... recurring theme, I know. I got a little depressed from that, but it wasn't anything too much. However, a few months later a guy on the team got drunk and sent out an email to the team that ranted about a bunch of things. Now remember, this guy was one of my best friends on the team, one of the few I would have considered more than just a friend on the wrestling team, but an actual friend. The email had probably a good page's worth of text (In Microsoft Word) that ranted about gays who wrestle, and homosexuality in general. It started out fine, with the fact that gay people were ok with him, as long as they didn't hit on him or flaunt their sexuality in a flamboyant way. But then he started saying that gay people who wrestle don't even deserve to live, that he would go out of his way to make life a living hell for any gay wrestler if he knew they were gay, and that if anyone on the team was gay, he would kick their ass.

The responses from guys to the email all said that they thought it was hilarious. Now, none actually agreed to the part about gays, but the fact that they thought it was funny and didn't outwardly disagree with it made me believe that they all hated me for something I couldn't change. This meant to me that they would always hate me no matter how good I was or what I did for the team (I was the best, people this year have told me that I'm the best before I left the team. It was hardly debatable, and I am pretty humble when it comes to my accomplishments.). Right now at least it is only subconsciously that I think this way, but it is still present and f**ks me up. The worst part is that I can't hate the kid who wrote the e-mail, because he was a good guy even outside of wrestling, doing community service and other stuff. I can't hate him, but I really do feel I can blame him for ruining my life for a good portion of time.

Thats when things started going downhill and if I even saw a guy on the team, my heart would race for fear that someone knew. Now, its different, but I still just don't feel comfortable around most guys on the team, and wrestling in general causes me so much stress that I need prescription medications to cope with it. Lower potency stuff doesn't even work, I don't know if any of y'all have ever heard of Oxazepam, but it doesn't do anything for me. Even the dose of Xanax that my psychiatrist initially prescribed doesn't work, I needed to take double a normal dose of Xanax to feel relief and not be pulling my hair out. Again, it isn't that way any more, as Oxazepam has a minor effect on me and a normal dose of Xanax works, but the kid who wrote the email freaking graduated, so why am i still stressed out!?!?

Ok, now that thats off my chest, I'll be waiting for some more responses before I make my final decision. And believe me, your responses matter, there really isn't anyone else I can talk to about this. Actually, I am telling one guy on the team tomorrow, I talked to him tonight and he said he could keep his mouth shut, and I trust him. Besides, if he betrays my trust, I'm going to jail and he is getting hospitalized. I swear to god about that, I'm not joking, I WILL go to jail because I won't be able to contain the anger I'll have towards him, and he stands no chance against me in a fight especially if I'm holding a baseball bat. I also told my father a few days ago and he totally accepting of it, not just tolerant. Then there is the final person who I can talk to about this, its my friend who does MMA. He will actually listen and talk about the subject of sexuality, and has no problem with it, as he doesn't get skeeved out or anything when one of his friends who's gay makes out with a guy right in front of him. So thats 3 people besides y'all, and I haven't even told one of them.

-Matt

I hate to say this because it almost sounds like a cliche nowadays, but the guy who sent the e-mail might be struggling with his own sexuality. It's odd that, after probably never bringing up the subject in any conversations, he suddenly writes out a long e-mail abut homosexuality?

Well said Joe...I was thinking the exact same thing.

As for you Matt...

First and foremost you need to find a way to rid yourself of this anxiety and fear and stress you have that is associated to wrestling. Have you considered seeing a psychiatrist?

Once you straighten that portion of your life... I really think you should consider sticking around with wrestling as a teacher or a coach or a mentor. Think of it this way... what if there's a kid who's going through the exact same thing as you are... you can help point him or her in the right direction and give them the help they need.

I'm already seeing two of them, lol, but guess what? tonight I just told a guy on the team and he was accepting and promised to keep his mouth shut! I mean I did threaten him with the fact that if he blabbed, I would beat him practically lifeless with a baseball bat without a second thought... but that was before I said anything about being gay. Hell, he even said that I should hook up with a guy before I go back to wrestling, if I do, cause that would likely help me to accept myself more than I currently do, and it will give me a better perspective on my true sexual orientation (We talked about the fact that I still would have sex with a hot chick, but would take a guy over a chick any day... maybe its because gay sex is "forbidden" to me in a way, so I desire it a lot more compared to sex with a woman, whereas if I started going out and did have sex with a guy, maybe I might be more 50/50 in who I'm attracted to because gay sex would then seem less "forbidden").

Hell, he said he'd have no problem wrestling me cuz I never have done anything gay to a guy on the team, and act professionally while in the wrestling room. So unless he lied to my face and told some people after we talked, things are good. I'm thinking I might actually come out, to my team at least, not to society as a whole, and start wrestling again this year if not next. I mean, the fact that one guy said he has my back gives me the confidence to tell more guys on the team, if not right away. It also makes me care a whole lot less if any of my teammates are bigoted ass****s, cuz I know there will be some guys who would have more of a problem with bigots than they do with me. Its crazy how things change in a heartbeat, but now I'm gonna have to get rid of the pack of cigarettes I just bought, since I promised myself I would smoke a pack when I was finished wrestling and I honestly thought I was done with it, lol, but it may be that I still have some time left on the wrestling mat.

So Enigma, this helped to get rid of a LOOOOOT of that fear, anxiety, stress and all those other good things that make my life a living hell at times.

-Matt

You're breaking down stereotypes CW. That always incurs a lot of stress, both on the mold-breaker and their supporters.

Unfortunately you may be right to assume the worst about your teammate keeping your secret. But you must have decided either consciously or subconsciously that it doesn't matter at this point. And that's a good thing IMO. A secret is something that only one person knows. I've heard people gossip about an 82 year old friend of ours who has apparently been in the closet all his life - and still is - to his wife and children, and grandchildren.

I don't think you want to go there.

The advice about having some kind of relationship is excellent. It has always been my theory that we will not see a major pro athlete come out while playing until that person is in a supporting relationship with a same-sex partner (the literal type not the legal one).

There are some brave exceptions but those individuals have had a more difficult time of it. And they were natural loners, which you do not seem to be.

Your gregariousness is one of your most endearing attributes. Some guy "out" there will appreciate that too.

Hey guys, whats up? Right now, I have to say that Cyd and Jim are freaking amazing! They were in the in my area and invited me to go out with them to some gay bars (If there was any doubt to my credibility, this should dispel it ). Anyway, whadda y'all think happened at the very first bar we went to? I met a guy! We chatted it up in the bar and I had my first make-out session with a gay guy! It didn't stop there though, we went back to his place and we hooked up! Woo-hoo! It was freaking amazing by the way, best moment in my life over the past few weeks, and over the past few weeks I told my dad and some teammates about my sexuality, so that says something about how sexually repressed I was, heh heh. I never would have gone out if it wasn't for Cyd and Jim, so I have to give them another shout out, and I suggest y'all do the same cause they are awesome guys and care about the people on this site. Perhaps I will write more when I get up tomorrow, er... this morning, perhaps not, but I have to say that I am the happiest I have been in a long while and that I'm gonna have to call all the people I've told about my sexuality (barring my dad ) tomorrow to tell them that I've finally hooked up with a guy. The cool thing too is that he said that we'd have to meet up in the future, which makes me even happier.

I'll be damned though if I wasn't nervous as hell and had no clue what to do , but the guy was cool with that, going as far as to say that, something along the lines of the fact that I was the cutest thing he had ever seen, lol. God I was inept at first, heh heh. Aight, I won't delve into this any more, though I'm sure some of you would want the graphic details, lol.

Night y'all!

-Matt

Good to know you've opened up, so to speak, CW. And not surprised at all that two experienced celebs like Cyd and Jim would be guy-magnets at any gay bar in the country...and maybe beyond.

Personally the last thing I need is details - been there, done that - but hope your enthusiasm holds up regardless of how your "first make-out" pans out.

Congrats CW! Your exuberant post brought back fond memories of my first tryst. Thanks for that!

Now Jim and Cyd would you like to meet me at The Barracks here in Palm Springs after the Chargers game? Matt isn't the only one that needs help with a hook-up.

It was awesome meeting Matt and he is a terrific guy and it was a blast going to the bar. It was Halloween there so most everyone was in costume and Cyd and I thought, great Matt will think all gay people are freaks. But then Matt hooks up with the first guy he talks to and he told you the rest.