Just finished watching the 2nd episode. Jeez. What a huge disappointment.

This show moves slower than All My Kids, Young and the Restlesss and the rest of the lot.

Worse yet, it's worse than at least 80% of the schlock that's on the Lifetime channel.

I thought this show was going to be about football. Instead, it's about drug use. And it seems to have confused the 2 issues.

And then there's the cardinal sin of all television: is there anyone that you can really empathize with on this show?

I tuned in for the second episode but I admit, it kind of lost my attention. Cute guys but it wasn't enough to save the storyline. I still think if it went through an overhauling it might have been better. Definately, didn't like the voice-overs. Too Lifetime.

I was a little disappointed too. I guess I was expecting more like Any Given Sunday. It is overly cynical with no likable characters. I wish it was on HBO, so there would be more full nudity.....like Oz.

Enjoyed the eye candy, but it seems like a mishmash of too many different sytles / objectives. We've been over this territory before.

Still I was surprised there would be nudity on ESPN. Sure stuff on HBO and SHOWTIME has more, but ESPN has a much wider penetration (no pun intended) than either of those pay channels.

Are wonder what the rules on nudity are on a cable channel like ESPN vs. a regular network , what parts you can show, what you can't show.

I recall hearing some questionable language too. It sounded like Raze wrote the script...

Sorry, I'm hooked on Playmakers. I watch it a the Club while I'm working out. I'm a captive audience as I'm pounding away on the stairclimber. I agree with posters that it is a little shallow. But it's better than CNN and fifteen re-hash of Lacy Peterson or Kobe B case.
The eye is great. Of course I love the QB-Derek McConnell played by Chris Wiehl. Any photo's of Chris out there?

[ September 04, 2003, 08:15 AM: Message edited by: Eastsidewa ]

In another thread, MuscleCubWa posted

Has anyone been watching the espn playmakers series? I have caught a couple of shows and am pretty impressed. I was also very suprised at the end of the one i watched last night where a player and his gay lover are having problems. Very Suprised. will be interesting to see how ESPN handles it all. Just was wondering what anyone opinion on the show is. Hopefully i posted this in the right area.


Kenny replied

Funny, I was just signing on to start this topic! And someone already has. I love the show so far, have not missed an episode. And the episode next week regarding the gay player should be interesting. But I do not expect any difference between the shows take on this subject to be any different than what we all think would happen if a gay player came out. Might be wrong, but we will see.


SportzFanPatrick replied

I like the show as cynical as it is, but last night's ending was hardly a surprise. I thought the narrative of the gay player gave it away. I suspect the writers will have him "roughed up" a bit, but I hope they also include some sympathy and support by some of the players.....stay tuned.


Eastsidewa replied

Totally hooked on Playmakers. I wish there were more football scenes not so much drama. The drug scene is getting old. I work with 3 ex-NFLers and they are admit that 80% of Playmakers is real. You knew the gay theme was coming sooner or later. Gay theme in episode 6 Sure the wide reciever is cute- but his boyfriend is even cuter. I'm waiting for episode 7. wink

Sorry i posted on the wrong thread.

When a cub's this cute, he can post anywhere he wants. wink

Back on topic ... the latest print issue of The Advocate has a brief but interesting article on the gay player in Playmakers and the actor playing him (but it's not in the web edition yet). The character was originally supposed to be a born-again Christian but was rewritten after the role was cast, and the actor pretty much rolled with the changes. :cool:

oh yeah and thanks Danimal

Someone mentioned earlier that they wished that this show showed more football. While the football action would be nice. My understanding was that the show was meant to show the life behind the sports, the pressures these guy are placed under and the pressure they place on themselves. I think its a good show. In my opinion worth watching. Whether it is an accurate portrayal?? who knows

Don't be surprised if that a**hole, DH, uses the fact that Guerwitcz bought DH drugs against Guerwitcz when it comes out that he's gay.

MuscleCub, that's the impression I got, that it's really a soap opera about the off-field stuff. I'm kind of intrigued, so I'll watch it at some point.

Erm, any manflesh shown?

Jim A: Great Eye candy. I watch Playmakers at the Gym and it allows me to stay with my aerobices for 60+ minuts.

I got the story going the other way. Because Guerwitcz Wide Receiver #83 helped DH out and bought him drugs at halftime...I expect DH to tell the team to back off and leave him alone and it will allow the gay theme to continue.....It seems like all sports DH is the kingmaker and what he says or does goes....DH is that kind of a stud.....but I want Guerwitcz boyfriend if and when he dumps him. wink wink

[ October 01, 2003, 04:04 PM: Message edited by: Eastsidewa ]

ofcourse dude! There are locker room scenes. Nothing graphic, but some bods. I like the show, I too think it gets a little "soap opera-ish" but overall entertaining. Actually, it's kind of nice to see the actors as most of them are not high profilers but good.

P.S.- I didn't get to see the deleted thread so I can't hold it against ya! wink

In another thread, GatorJamie posted

Anyone see "Playmakers" last night and its developing storyline about the wide receiver (Gurlewicz? sp?) being gay?


Joe in Philly replied

Oh, great. Does this mean I have to start watching this?? wink


RGMike replied

Joe, I had the same thought.

I had watched the first episode and thought: Too slow... too soapy... and not enough naked linebackers. I figured it was only a matter of time before they worked in a gay storyline, though.

A wide receiver, indeed...


Breesboy posted

Well I got beaten to the post on this one. Being the only one on the team that could "sell the fake", he'd been portrayed as more of a strong in his belief Christian, with the last episode where he seemed more than uncomfortable, going to the parking lot and getting the drugs for DH. I had been waiting to see if the gay "Playmaker" would become a storyline.


Adam replied

From what I've seen in previews for next week's episode (and watching ESPN, one sees lots & lots of ads for "Playmakers") the gay player's partner shows up an inappropriate time and causes some problems for the player. That and the coach's bloody urine seem to be important next week.

~Adam

Boy, I'm sure NOT glad I got to catch tonight's episode of Playmakers.

Does the show not have smart or creative writers? To say that I was disappointed (and more than a little disturbed) is an understatement.

Actually, your whole post is kind of an understatement. What exactly disappointed you about the episode?

The part I just saw, switching over from the baseball game briefly, was disturbing. The gay player in the bar with his teammates and his boyfriend shows up?

[ October 07, 2003, 07:27 PM: Message edited by: Joe in Philly ]

Unfortunately, my VCR went kaput and I didn't get to see the last 17 minutes of the show. What happened? I was also a bit disappointed the way the bar scene was handled. If I was that boyfriend I would have dumped his ass right there. Let him have his football. I don't see his situation any more different that that of an abused wife or girlfriend. If that's his way of hiding from his teammates, he can find someone else to hit.

Can you believe the line from that Sleese back Dereck McConnell- the QB? Scenario- he got $2K bet with 2 players that he'll lay the Owner's (Wilbanks) daughter (she's Sophomore at some Ivy League School) who just broke up with her boyfriend because he cheated on her (she confided in her female RA (Resident Advisor) about wanting to wait to have sex w/ her boyfriend and then the RA used that advice to snag the horney boyfriend. Hence the breakup. So QB McConnell (that snake) uses this line on the owners daughter after their first kiss "I can't imagine why any man would ever want to cheat on you"? He uses this line to slay her 3 minutes later. Hot Sex scene. Episode 7

I gotta remember that line - somewhere sometime it'll pay off. wink wink

[ October 08, 2003, 10:49 AM: Message edited by: Eastsidewa ]

Interesting show last nite. I admit i did not expect the bar scene at all. Although the boyfriend looked a little pyscho as he stared at Guerwhatshisname across the bar. I didnt get a very good impression of the boyfriend. Granted i dont condone him getting beat up. And he was placed in a bad situation by having to have his boyfriend a pro football player making out with a women in front of him. But at the same time how many of us know people who are closeted and dont want friends, family or work to know. I kinda get the impression that the boyfriend is going to become rather vindictive as the show goes on. Especially by his comment about eventually their going to find out. I think this could possibly portray gay men in a bad light. I can also feel for gurwhathisbutt a little also...Not the violence, but the fact that he feels he cannot fully be who he is and be gay, because he is to afraid of losing his career. Doesnt condone what he did. But it is a tough thing.

and you Gotta love the sick kid who told DH to get lost and not come back. Even though i dont condone what he did to his wife. I am feelnig sorry for Leon Taylor. At least he is trying to be a man and take responsiblity for what he did. not hide behind his money and fame. There is a poll on espn.com about whether Guerny will be outed or not. And i did find his comment to the owner in the locker room pretty funny.

I'm irritated for the same reasons MuscleCubWa.

I mean, why, why, why?!?!?
- why does the boyfriend have to be a whiney stalker Euro-fag (his build, demeanor, bad hair and poor wardrobe)
- the rest of the show's dialogue is pretty bad, but the gay stuff is REALLY bad
- why couldn't they just have an argument?...heck, I'd even settle for Gurewitz pushing his fey boyfriend...but to punch him and then kick him while he's down...what the fcuk, ESPN?!?

This is it?!? THIS is *the* portrayal of a "gay relationship" ESPN chooses to show? THIS is what closeted athletes and ignorant frat dicks get to learn from?

You'd think the producers and writers have no gay friends, or that all they know about gay people are skits they see on Saturday Night Live. The gay boyfriend is characterized like a stereotype of what CLUELESS straight people think gay people are like. CLUELESS straight people in rural, backwoods, swamp-boat Louisianna, that is...

I agree all the way around the comments. I'm not too happy with the character type cast but...it is ESPN after all...it probably challenging The Best DAMM Sports on Fox for audience. It make you really appreciate Jim Rhome...trust me Guerwitcz will have a conscious and a "need" for David. I think the theme will continue for 4-5 more episodes. Then what -we'll see.

Its pretty sad that ESPN is playing into the stereotype that people already have of gay men. And also making him the complete opposite of Guerwitcz. I was searching espn.com and found a poll they did around the time Esera Taoula came out.

But what we found might encourage other gay athletes to step out of the closet.


A SportsNation survey indicates that pro athletes might have less trouble with fans than with teammates.
As part of our extensive, ongoing survey of sports opinions and attitudes, we asked more than 40,000 randomly selected ESPN.com users, "If your favorite player announced he was gay, would that make a difference to you?" While 22 percent of sports fans said 'yes', 78 percent said 'no'.


Interesting article for them to publish. Albeit on some backpage on thier webiste. But do they honestly think all gay men are as clueless as this guy david? I am defenitly interested to see where they take this. I can see it going one of two ways. David becomes some sort of stalker and harrasses Guer untill he is outed at least to certain members of the team...Or David disappears and Guer is left conflicted and fighting with his inner feelings with the girl he ended the episode with and thats the last we hear of it. So far i am not impressed with ESPN's backwoods portrayel of the gay characters love interest. But i gotta give them something for at least trying to bring an issue like this to a very specific audience.

The actor playing Guerwitz was interviewed by The Advovcate and stated that he didn't have too many gay friends to base his character on, but that the ones he has are just regular guys who watch football, etc., but " . . . its not like they're sitting around doing each other's nails".

So glad that they found an actor with such a deep understanding of what it is to be a gay man!!

Is anyone bothered by this show?

I mean, they make a show about a pro football team and make perhaps every last stereotype possible happen within like 5 guys....

You've got the black guy selling and doing drugs.

You've got the black guy hitting his wife.

You've got the trainers warning about drug tests.

You've got the QB on so much pain medication, you think every bone is broken.

You've gone the stud QB that picks up women whenever possible, and goes to meet them during halftime.

You have crimes being committed and covered up.

You have players doing drugs during halftime (that halftime show had a lot going on for a 20 minute halftime).


I mean, that's just what I can think of off the top of my head from watching like 3 episodes. Sure, some of thise stuff happens (such as drug/violence problems), but my God, is there one guy on this team that's a NORMAL person!? Sure, quarterbacks are sore after games, but they don't load up on pills. Quarterbacks also don't exactly go around picking up women during the game either.

The sad thing, people are probably watching this and thinking this is exactly how a team acts and is run, but come on, can we at least remain realisitic.

Oh, and now we have the gay guy that's afraid to come out!

I would guess that on each NFL team you have maybe one of these problems. The problem for me with this show is that they are taking all of these dramas and piling them onto one team, and the result just doesn't strike me as believable.

I tend to agree that this may not be an accurate portrayel of whats really going on on a profesional sports team. I wouldnt be suprised that if on many teams there are alot of these problems and by more than one person. However i dont think the reality of the quarterback meeting women during halftime is real. Even though quarterbacks are the pretty boys on the team. But at the same time, unless any of us have played profesional sports or know anyone who has, we dont know how it really is in there. Its a fairly closed fraternity in the fact that you only catch a glimpse of it every once in awhile.

I agree w/ Illini in Milwaukee's comments. Playmakers is not a pretty story. Review in SFGATE Somewhere I saw a press release that ESPN was not sure that Playmakers will be picked up for another seasons. Seems that the NFL is pressuring them to discontinue the series due to the negative spin. It's ironic that if you listen closely in the locker room the Jim Rome Show is in the background talking about the NFL Police Blottter.

That's not irony, Alanis. That's product placement. Hearing his voice is a subtle way of promoting his TV show on ESPN.

Last week, in the midst of the Rush Limbaugh crap, Eagles' owner Jeffrey Lurie criticized ESPN not only for hiring Rush but also for "Playmakers." He called it an example of \"institutional racism.\" An article in the paper last week speculated that the NFL encouraged him to speak out because they hate the show.

Thanks Joe in Philly and illini for bringing up those points. Given the rambunctious tenor of these boards sometimes, I didn't want to be called a pinko-liberal-communist, et al.

In fact, I'm still waiting to be "called out" for dissing the Gurewitz's boyfriend for being too "gay"...

According to Tom Hoffarth in the Los Angeles Daily News, some NFL players--unnamed in the article--are now refusing to be interviewed by ESPN reporters as a form of protest about "Playmakers." The atricle says this started with some Bucs & that it has spread to include players from four other teams.

~Adam

Saw the promo for the next new episode. It looks like it's dealing primarily with the gay player storyline. (The next new show is in 2 weeks--next week the screen crawl said they're showing a marathon--probably not wanting to show a new episode against the World Series.)

Saw the new episode last nite. Wasnt real impressed with the gay storyline. Granted they are doing a fairly decent job of showing how conflicted Guerwitcz is. But they are doing a great job of portraying his boyfriend as a stalker. I am not impressed at all with espn portrayal of the boyfriend. His euro trash, euro gay look and attitude is annoying. And portraying him as anything but a stereotype would be to much for playmakers writers to imagine. Come on not every gay man is the typical stereotype. And there are those of us who are turned off and annoyed by the stereotypical queens. Dont get me wrong for some people thats just the way they are. But the writers for this show needed to maybe do some research and find some gay men that are normal average guys. Hell i love sports, love the outdoors, Consider myself a normal average guy. Who just happens to like men. I think they could have done alot more by portraying this character a little differently. Do have to say that the next new episode is going to be interesting. Can go one of two ways. Guerwitz is outed or somehow he covers it up. The boyfriend showing up at the field should be interesting. But damn why do they have to show him as being a stalker like that. Leave guerwitz alone when he is at work. LOL jus tmy rant for the day. Like Jim rome says on rome is burning, "bring and bring it strong" or something to that effect

After last night's fan-induced debacle at Wrigley, I felt a real need for mindless entertainment so, after watching Sportscenter dissect the game, stayed around for "Playmakers." I have to say I enjoyed it but do hope that the writers get over the stock characters and stereotypes and put some real thought into the series. Like having the Euro-gay (I'm not being xenophobic; I actually like his looks!) displaced by a decent gay guy who brings Guregay out of the closet and enlists some fellow team members (bun intended) to help out. That's what would move this show from groundbreaking to great.

It's just TV. Playmakers goes to extreme to make a point. I lose myself in it while I at the Gym on the stairmaster for an hour. We have lots of TV's on the wall and ESPN is a mandated channel. I'm not looking for reality. There is NO REALITY TV!! Sure I hope that David (the stalker)turns out to be an okay character. Could we ever see hot M2M sex on major channel? Sure Queer as Folk has it- but at an obscure time with disclosures to a limited audience. One step at a time. I happy just immerse myself in it for 60 minutes per week. Doesn't sound like it'll be around next year. NFL Player's reactions
The League is being pressured by the Player's Union to scrub the show. Only time will tell.
But next week's show is set up for lots of different opinions about Gays in Football. We'll see the General Public's reaction.

I admit I've found the past couple of weeks to be interesting. I'd like to know how far they're gonna take the gay storyline. On the previews, I thought DH said something interesting. It went something like 'that's fine with me. It means more ladies for me!' I always kid my straight friends about that. Can't wait for next week.

It seemed to me that the gay story line is goign to be the main story for next episode. Let's see what happens with the boyfriend when he shows up at practice.

There was an interesting column that appeared in the Baltimore Sun on Sunday (written by Ed Sherman of the Chicago Tribune) which indicates that the reason why ESPN has not decided whether Playmakers will return for a second season or not (despite it being a huge hit in the ratings, particularly among the important 18 to 34 year old male demographic, trailing only NFL games and prime-time college football among ESPN's highest rated shows) is due to pressure they are receiving from the league....the NFL is clearly not happy with the network's portrayal of professional football, with Paul Tagliabue describing Playmakers as "a gross characterization of our sport" and Gene Upshaw going so far as to call the show "racist" because the majority of the players with problems are black....Upshaw went on to say, "I really don't believe our broadcast partners should be participating in that type or program, because it is portraying players in the wrong light"....although ESPN senior vice president for original programming Rob Semiao defends Playmakers (properly so in my opinion) by simply saying, "This is dramatic television. It's fiction. It's entertainment. In Hollywood things are condensed and blown up for entertainment purposes", there is speculation that ESPN could pull the plug if the NFL continues to howl since the last thing the network wants to do is damage its relationship with the league.

It will be interesting to see how this plays out, considering there are only three original episodes left to air, counting tonight's....speaking of which, according to the previews (how could you possibly miss them since ESPN only airs them about ten times an hour? ) tonight's original episode (9PM) is the one where a gay player is outed by his former partner....I will be interested to see how they handle this topic and would love to hear Esera Tuaolo's or Dave Kopay's opinion on it.

[ October 28, 2003, 05:16 PM: Message edited by: gamecock ]

Tagliabue and Upshaw need to shut their traps. The show finds a way to present all the players in unflattering lights while also humanizing them--they are not models of perfection but flawed human beings, and that comes through, with the white and black players. It can be soap-opera-ish at times, but Guerwitcz's (sp?) outing and subsequent coming out to me were pretty interesting; at least this show is willing to address, in its imperfect way, the economy of pro sports, drug use and abuse and how this ties into the needs and fears especially of aging athletes, mortality, (homo)sexuality, male-female relations, and so on. It's a flawed show, but I'm glad ESPN is airing it. I just wish they'd go further and show a bit more male nudity--frontal, that is. It helps that a number of the actors are pretty hot as well.

Um, and picking up the paper in the morning and reading the police blotter section is an improvement?

I just watched the bit where the ex- outs him in front of the team. It was well done, but whoever approved the camera-jumping-around-like-NYPD Blue stuff should be told it's not the early 90's anymore.

Edit: Um, this isn't bad at all. Why does the QB immediately make me think "Peyton Manning"? And blonde ass**** "Jeremy Shockey"? I think they're doing a pretty good job of portraying the pressures and internal politics that are involved with the situation. Not so thrilled with the "Harpie of an ex-boyfriend gets hysterical" bit but, hey, it's a plot device.

[ October 28, 2003, 09:33 PM: Message edited by: Jim Allen ]

I've just started to watch this week's episode on Tivo. I love the irony of Bruce Gray playing Wilbanks, the homophobic owner. I especially love the line, "Are you a fairy? Now you don't seem like one but you just can't tell these days." For those of you who don't know, Bruce Gray played George Schickel on Queer as Folk. He is also openly gay.

[ October 28, 2003, 09:48 PM: Message edited by: claudew ]

Good catch there. He's lost a lot of weight since QaF.

Interesting episode tonite - and some nice eye candy as always, especially as Gurewitcz padded off to the showers - and I hope ESPN rethinks its plans to not run Playmakers next year. I also agree 100% with FT's sentiments about Tagliabue and Upshaw's need to shaddup; these guys' real life denial is almost as bad as Guregay's was in the first 3/4 of the show!

But before we criticize the ex's dramatic performance at practice, how many among us can say they've never witnessed - or instigated or received - similar treatment from a lover spurned? Let those without sin throw the first pass!

[Looking around, tapping feet, nervous] Um, not me! Nope, never!



Help: tonight's the first time I watched the show. What's the backstory of the incident in the parking lot that was caught on CCTV that allowed him to be blackmailed in to signing the IR paper? Thanks.

Damn. I wish I'd watched the show beforehand, I enjoyed it tonight. The really poor reviews put me off.

[ October 28, 2003, 11:08 PM: Message edited by: Jim Allen ]

Posted my review of the show.

Jim, lay off The Drunk (the previous entry). He's the best QB in NFL history and is cute as all hell.

Only one of those statements is even possibly true.

Yeah, the show couldn't avoid the "Get Up on Soapbox" preachy-ness. I did like it when he said "Now you know my secret [pause for effect] I'm the best player on this team".

And so he needed a beard. Why didn't he just get an actress or a lesbian to do it? I hate it when closet cases lie to women about loving them as sexual/romantic partners.

I'm waiting for someone in the NFL, based on this episode, to prounounce to the press that there are no homosexuals in the NFL etc.

[ October 28, 2003, 11:54 PM: Message edited by: Jim Allen ]

I really enjoyed tonight's episode and have to admit I find the gay storyline interesting. If I were Guerwitz I would have beaten the crap right out of David. How could he get hysterical like that in front of his teammates? Still, I guess if you're a man spurned, you might say anything. I also like how they made Guerwitz stand up for himself after he was selected for the All-Star and wasn't gonna put up with their crap. You know, what would make an interesting story twist: Guerwitz is traded or signs with Pittsburgh and ends up on Queer as Folk! That would be something. Maybe he could end up as a love interest for Brian, who by the way, reminds me of McDonnell. Just a thought[grin].