Here's some links to great photos from the Asian Games:

Sepak Takraw - women's

Sepak Takraw - men's

letting it all hang out

I remember doing e-research on sepak tekraw when we were preparing for Thai visitors where I work. The thing that struck me most about it was that, if I remember correctly, it's usually played purely for the art and self-expression rather than to win.

Apparently that's because of the Bhuddist religion also practiced by by many of the sport's practitioners.

Thanks for those great pictures jaydeenyc. I always wondered what it looked like.

Pretty incredible stuff.

[quote]Originally posted by sportinlife:
I remember doing e-research on sepak tekraw when we were preparing for Thai visitors where I work. The thing that struck me most about it was that, if I remember correctly, it's usually played purely for the art and self-expression rather than to win.

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Thanks, I was wondering about the high kicks - they are beautiful.

[ October 04, 2002: Message edited by: bluebird48234 ]

[quote]Originally posted by jaydeenyc:
letting it all hang out

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This Chinaman is very hot, very hot. You've made my day, sportinlife. Thanks very much.

Bluebird -

I know you didn't just write "chinaman" in complete seriousness.

Anyway, here is another pic from the Asian Games:

North Korean gymnast

[ October 04, 2002: Message edited by: jaydeenyc ]

[quote]Originally posted by bluebird48234:


This Chinaman is very hot, very hot. You've made my day, sportinlife. Thanks very much.

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Not wanting to take undue credit, "dat iz knowt my showt" to paraphrase inspector poirot.

jaydeenyc... I'm not sure of your ethnic background. But as an asian... I say let it go. So he said "chinaman". To me it's no big deal. I'm assuming it was not meant in a derogatory manner.

I have never heard "Chinaman" used in a derogatory way or in a tense moment.

Of course, I meant "man born in China".

Nevertheless, please:

1/Forgive me

2/Explain the perjorative history of this word

- - - - -

Is it like "colored" or "Negro" in that it's an obsolete word?


Blue

[ October 05, 2002: Message edited by: bluebird48234 ]

[quote]Originally posted by sportinlife:

"dat iz knowt my showt"

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What is this?

[quote]Originally posted by bluebird48234:


What is this?

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An obviously very bad transliteration of french-accented english of
Agatha Christie's character Inspector Hercule Poirot who while standing next to a dog owner asked if his dog bit and replied no. When the person asking went to pet the dog it snapped at him. He indignantly chastised Poirot asking "I thought you said your dog didn't bite?" to which Poirot responded "That is not my dog" which loosely translated by me would be "dat iz knowt my dug."

Surely the jokes been lost at this point, but it's saturday and I have some time on my hands, so I thought I'd explain.

[ October 05, 2002: Message edited by: sportinlife ]

Bluebird...b/c you asked for it. On the other hand, I have ONLY heard the term used in ill terms. Back in the day in this country when there was legal legislation to exclude Chinese folks (The Chinese Exclusion Acts of 1882, not repealed until post-WW II in the mid to late 1940's), the terms was often used in chants, signs, and billboards. In fact, it was none other than the AFL-CIO, and the labor leader of the time, Samuel Gompers, that led the charge against the Chinese. He testified to Congress in an (in)famous speech entitled; "Meat vs. Rice: American patriotism verses Asiatic Coolieism". To this day, the Chinese are the only ethnic group to have legal exclusion acts passed against them in the United States.

1/I DID ask for it, because this is the kind of person that I am (not better, just a characteristic). I would not have posted the word (or any other) had I not been willing to be accountable for it.

1a/I looked up the Chinese Exclusion Act of 1882.
Although certainly egregious and inhumane, it is "on par" with the kind of racism that is part of our American history and typical of that time period. Note: This was just after Emancipation, and my guess (ONLY a guess) that Whites wanted to erase ANY competition for income, as they were having to resocialize and restructure per millions of "freed (try to explain to African-Americans what that meant - and then there was, in the early 20th century, the 2nd wave of immigrants given "White" status)" slaves.

2/Please don't forget the refusals of hire that the Italians and Irish suffered. Most notably, the Italians attribute a good deal of organized crime in the 20th century to the fact that they were denied employment. I am African-American and was seeing an Italian guy at the time who shared with me some things about what it was like in the Northeast (MA in this case) to be looking for work to see the signs that read, "Italians and Irish Need Not Apply".

3/I have tons to learn about Asians and America. In fact, along with my Turkish studies, I am reading (as we post) a book entitled, The Asian-American Century. Upon the first scan, I realized that at least 80% of the information was totally new.

Therefore, I hereby thank you sincerely for offering your friendship in trusting my request to learn something from an area in which I am weak, yet courageous.

- Blue

[ October 07, 2002: Message edited by: bluebird48234 ]

Salute Bluebird48234 for courage! I can only hope to follow in your good steed.

Blue -

Although I am not Asian, I was schooled long ago by Asian friends that "chinaman" is similar to "colored." I only meant to call you out in a friendly way.

Anyway, here is a great book that really opened my eyes:

Asian American Dreams: The Emergence of an American People by Helen Zia

I highly recommend it.

[ October 07, 2002: Message edited by: jaydeenyc ]

ung -
as someone of chinese ancestry it is a "big deal" when my ears hear the term "chinaman" because it was a derogatory term usually paired with a bad hollywood chinese accent when i grew up in enlightened multicultural san francisco.
i can understand if someone did not know that it is an offensive term as in this case- no offense taken - but i wouldn't let it slide if it was used in normal usage by people that have been told/educated about its negative connotation connotation. most people that i have met use the term as a slur aka hebe, kike, polack , etc. - you get my drift.

[quote]Originally posted by jaydeenyc:
Asian American Dreams: The Emergence of an American People by Helen Zia

I highly recommend it.

[ October 07, 2002: Message edited by: jaydeenyc ]

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I am reading Asian American Dreams: The Emergence of an American People by Helen Zia now.

Thanks.

You're welcome Blue. I can't believe how fired up I got after reading certain chapters from that book. Zia was unflinching in her telling of the stories, especially the Filipinos and the cannery and all the political flip flops. I sometimes wished she would share more of her personal stories, like the ones from her childhood that were so endearing.

Maybe she is saving those for a more intimate set of writings, or another book.

I trust that she will want to share a greater view of her life, when she is ready.

I recently read a great essay by Helen Zia in a new book called "Asian Americans and War". On 9/11 she was stuck in D.C. after speaking on a panel @ the Smithsonian. She talks at length about what it was like being one of the only non-whites @ her hotel, and how certain people seemed to question her "Americaness",and sharesa touching anecdote about an American flag given to her by the mother of Vincent Chin.
Hey Blue, heard of Vincent Chin from Detroit? I think this fall was the 20th anniversary of his death at the hands of unemployed auto workers (Vincent was mistakenly assumed to be Japanese). After local and federal charges, two men received probation. (wow we're way off topic now aren't we?)

Well Zia devotes a chapter to Vincent Chin in the book we were discussing.

[quote]Originally posted by Aznbutch:

Hey Blue, heard of Vincent Chin from Detroit? I think this fall was the 20th anniversary of his death at the hands of unemployed auto workers (Vincent was mistakenly assumed to be Japanese). After local and federal charges, two men received probation.

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Yes, I think there was an article on the 20th anniversary in the Detroit News/Free Press.

Thanks for asking.

[ October 11, 2002: Message edited by: bluebird48234 ]