If and when Barry Bonds surpasses Babe Ruth's 714 home runs, there shall be no official celebration. Said MLB Commissioner Bud "Beelzebub" Selig: "Hank Aaron broke Babe Ruth's record. We don't celebrate anybody the second or third time in. We celebrate new records, that's what we do. We're being consistent. There's nothing to read into that." He added that he wouldn't be in San Francisco or Milwaukee or Philadelphia (where the Giants play in the coming week) as Bonds moves closer to Ruth's mark.

~Adam

What a non-story, though primo shills Buster Olney and Jeff Brantley on Baseball Hacks Tonight sure hyped it.

Related, from Baseball Encyclopedia editor Gary Gillette:

Yeah...I couldn't figure out why this was such a big deal. I'm tired of hearing about Bonds (and the damn NFL draft). Enough already!

My, how quiet the B.B. Haters Club has been since he's been showing he can do things like hit 440-foot homers on one leg, apparently while passing any "PED" test baseball has...

Which seems to indicate that the ability of "performance enhancers" to enhance your ability to hit a baseball is somewhere between unknown and negligible.

I don't know exactly how I feel about Bonds, so this is not in response to him, but if the performance enhancers do/did not help baseball players, why would they take them? (not catty, just curious...as I've heard this arguement before) If there was no benefit, why would anyone risk their health, their reputation, and in some cases, their careers?

I'm sure there are several possible answers, one being that they're mistaken about the cause-effect relationship? Kinda like Wade Boggs eating chicken every day?

Bill W. I'm gonna give you a fact. Not my opinion, not something that was over heard in an elevator or by the water cooler, but medical biological FACT.

You don't go from being a small/scrawny person with a small head, to a gigantic mess without enhancers. Anyone can work out and gain muscle, but even if you worked out 7 days a week 24 hours a day, you won't get as big as he did as fast as he did without enhancements.

And the kicker? When you're 22ish, and your head is one size...it's never growing in size again, you're done growing at that point. His head grew....by enhancements.

But the sad part is, I know you won't take these facts and digest them, you'll just brush them off. My question to you though is this....When he is in jail for perjery (sp?) and it's PROVEN WITHOUT A DOUBT that he took steroids, will you still defend him?

Wow, never heard any of that before.

The big head stuff just doesn't get old!

That's the funny thing about science...it can't be proven wrong.

To quote Gil Grissom:

"People lie, science doesn't"

[ May 03, 2006, 01:28 PM: Message edited by: Chill-Trick ]

I don't see any science at all in your argument, sir. Please supply a chart showing exactly how many HRs a "clean" Bonds would've hit 1998-2002 -- and good luck finding a baseline, in a league where many of his fellows, hitters and pitchers, were taking all sorts of "substances."

Are you familiar with Marlon Brando, Elizabeth Taylor and Orson Welles?

[ May 03, 2006, 02:19 PM: Message edited by: Bill W ]

Taylor, Brando, Wells, all got fat...the faces got fat when they gained weight, their heads didn't grow bigger, their faces did.

You want me to produce a graph of what he would hit if he was "clean"? Well, first off that wasn't the discussion we were having, so I don't know why you brought that up (which actually is typical of someone losing an argument, they grasp at straws)....but I'll humor you. I don't know how he would play "clean" Steroids doesn't instill talent in you, it has to be there already. Given that, Bonds does have talent, and he had it to begin with, he just chose to use illegal enhancements to make his talent even bigger.

As far as other people also taking steroids, I'm sure there are many...And when it's revealed who they are, they should all be banned.

So there are the facts...I'm done. It's like talking to a republican, even when given facts, you're still blind.

That last sentence is amusing. Cuz I was going to say, if Bonds ever serves a day for perjury (it appears you don't know, along with the spelling, how hard it is to prove), I will register as a Republican (and the Dems have been too right-wing for me for 20 years).

Well, first of all, when steroids or PED's were becoming popular, there was no restriction on their use in MLB. The players could use them legally with no consequence. So many people forget this simple fact.

With the use of PED's, players such as Mark McGwire and Sammy Sosa began shattering old sacred records. As a result, many ambitious and jealous players jumped on the PED bandwagon in order to become (maybe) stars, with bigger salaries. Some players benefited greatly while others did not, no names here, but any player using the drugs would have to have superior talent in the first place. The PED's can only make you bigger and stronger, they can't help your innate athletic ability.

Now that the ban on PED use is in effect, any player that tests positive is just a complete idiot. But there is no way that MLB will go back and retroactively "punish" players who used PED's when they were NOT ILLEGAL.

Whether players such as Bonds used them or not is not an issue. The only issue is fans who believe that the use of these drugs was "cheating". It wasn't. It was a way of gaining a competitive edge with modern technology that was allowed by MLB at the time.

So, there will be no asterisks or denied entrance into the Hall of Fame for any of these players. It doesn't fit into the policies of MLB in the time frame that these activities occurred.

Phillies fans show their love.

That was an excellent explanation. Now, if everyone can just get off his damn back so he can break this record.

I love the 'beer & hot dogs' sign .. too funny.

He needs to do it today since it's my nephew's eleventh birthday and he's at the game! Do it, already, Barry...

I was at the day game today, all nine innings. Giants won big, 9-3, but Bonds didn't get a homer. He had a very close call in his last at-bat, but no cigars. I've got to score some more tickets for the Dodgers series, but the prices I've seen so far are astronomical!

Performance Enhancing Drugs do improve athletic performance (hence, the name). A gifted athlete like Barry Bonds, who was already strong, blessed with god-given hand-eye coordination, and had mastered the art of hitting the fast ball already, didn't need much enhancing to reach perfection, and the PEDs got him there.

These drugs would also improve the athletic ability of average week-end players like you and me as well, but our skill levels are so beneath that of Bonds that the " drug enhanced" improvement would probably go unnoticed by our teammates.

Could Barry have done what he did without PEDs? I don't think so. Instead of 700 home runs, I think he would have 600. But Barry wasn't satisfied with being a very good hitter. He wanted to be the best; he wanted greatness. So much so, he was willing to risk his career, his place in history, and the honor of the game itself. I'm not believing for a second that PEDs didn't contribute to his hitting prowess, because they did.

Whether he breaks the record or not; whether he's inducted into the Hall of Fame or not; whether he got caught or never gets caught again; whether he hits the same number of home runs without the PEDs; whether the drugs were considered banned substances or not at the time he used them; whether other players use them or not; none of this changes the fact that he dishonored himself and the game of baseball through his involvement with these drugs.

Sorry guys, but it has to said, and said, and said, loud enough for every Giants fan to hear: Barry Bonds did something wrong; he cheated. I know it. He knows it. It's time for Barry to throw himself of the mercy of the fans (we'll forgive him), and it's time for Giants fans to open their eyes and stop defending this guy. There are some things you just don't do; not even for a world championship.

You are a complete fool Thomas. Read my previous explanatory post.

Well, he didn't hit one today but my brother did get a ball for my nephew which contributed to an excellent eleventh birthday.

If someone can prove that Bonds was taking sh*t after they became illegal than they should...otherwise, they should simmer down.

Bill , I read your post again. I have no argument with you about the rules of baseball and PEDs. I could care less whether there is indisputable proof that Bonds did something illegal, or, whether he broke the rules of baseball. Bonds dishonored the game when he took drugs that enhanced his performance, whether he had prior knowledge or not. He should own up to his mistake and issue a public apology. For me, honor for the game, a sense of fairness, personal integrity, and morals are more important than legalese. If my belief in these principles makes me a fool, then I’m glad to be counted among them.

You stated that PEDs make you stronger and faster but don’t enhance your innate ability. This statement might apply to players like you and me (we’ll get stronger if we take PEDs but won’t become better hitters; because we never were), but your hypothesis does not apply to a super talented hitter like Barry Bonds, who is already so talented that the difference between excellence and greatness is a small one. PEDs can, and do, help such players to bridge that small gap. Why? Barry already possessed innate hand-eye coordination, an innate ability to hit a fast ball, an innate dedication to the game (e.g., long and dedicated hitting practices, keeping himself physically fit, and an intuitive knowledge of the game), and, an innate physical prowess even before he took PEDs. For a super hitter like Barry, a long fly ball that would otherwise be gloved on the warning track will now, under the influence of PED-induced physical strength, travel that ten extra feet to become a home run.

I’m surprised you don’t see this. If PEDs make you stronger (even you agree that they do), then a player blessed with excellent hand-eye coordination, hitting ability, and knowledge of the game (particularly the ability to read and predict pitch type and location) should be able to hit the ball farther under the influence of muscle-enhancing drugs. By any principle of science, a player already blessed with these innate baseball attributes should improve his batting average and home run total. Where's the error in this?

I want to know, above all, why Bonds is being virulently singled out when it appears that hundreds of batters and pitchers in the last 15 years took these substances. The answers seem to be: The media is returning his hatred of them; BB's 'unpleasant' personality; and race.

My main contention against your post is that most of Bonds' HRs don't need ten extra feet. I don't happen to think career totals are some kind of sacred benchmark across the ages (ie, Cobb is still a greater hitter than Rose), so Bonds is still the premier slugger of his era no matter what. Measuring him against hitters in other eras is a game -- a fun one, but utterly subjective.

[ May 12, 2006, 06:28 AM: Message edited by: Bill W ]

Bill: Yeap, PEDs are in wide circulation among athletes. And, I agree with you that the media hates Barry, but they're not being unfair on this one. If the allegations were false (I don't think they are), they wouldn't be able to harm him with them. The media is only reporting the findings of other investigating bodies. Yeah, some of them are definitely gloating and happy to see him squirm because they feel he was mean to them for years. But I see cheating as cheating, whether permitted by state, local, federal laws, or, whether permitted by baseball's own code of ethics; in my eyes, it's a moral wrong.

If you could only know the unfair advantages of PEDs so obviously noticeable in other sports like track (Ben Johnson, Marion Jones, Flo Jo, John Drummond, Tim White, and Kelli White) and olympic swimming (specifically the communist Chinese and East Germans olympic swimmers), then you'd see that these drugs do enhace the performnaces of world class athletes who are already professionally trained, in peak physical condition, and already at or near the top of their sport. Naturally these drugs won't make a world class athlete of a mediocre hitter, a mediocre swimmer, a medicore sprinter, but if world class talent is there already, these drugs provide an unfair advantage because they build muscle mass, endurance, and strength to the point where users, but not their ethically superior rivals, get even better.

Once public allegations surfaced, Mario Jones, the then #1 US female sprinter, couldn't use these drugs at the olympics trials. As a result, she had to settle for fourth place (off the olympic team) instead of her customary first place finish (something she'd recorded throughout the years through the use of PEDs). A fourth place finish at the olympics trails is an indication of world class talent because the time differential between first and fourth place finishers is only hundreds of seconds.

This proves what I've been trying to say about Barry Bonds; he didn't need much improvment to reach perfection (he was already supremely talented), and was able to reach perfection because of PEDs. The home run records would probably have happened in time anyway, without the PEDs (look how long Hank Aaron continued to play baseball), but Barry wanted the records sooner rather than later; and sought (or allowed) help in the form of PEDs.

I don't want to argue with you. I was a big Baryy Bonds fan before all this happened. I don't think he's a bad person; he just got anxious and made a mistake; one I want him to face up to so I can like him again. Even Kobe issued a half-apology and had to compensate his accuser for his part in the sex scandal (being a brain-dead horn dog), but because he apologized, I can now appreicate his basketball talent again.

You're a proud and loyal Giants fan; I see that. Had these allegations surfaced about Peyton or Eli, I'd probably defend them to the death too, because I know these guys, and I love these guys. I actually cried the day I admitted to myself that OJ (my hero) actually killed two people and got away with it. So, I can understand your passion for Barry Bands and the Giants. I just think you should also leave open the possibility that he did something morally wrong, because even our heroes make mistakes.

I hope Barry ties and passes Ruth's record in this 3-game series against the Dodgers. That would be sweet.

Barry doesn’t chase balls unless forced to; everybody knows that. We didn't get Saturday’s game against the Dodgers, but sports clips showed Dodgers pitchers trying to throw strikes. This proves that Lasorda had his team playing honest ball. They were trying to win, and would have, if they had a decent closer. Lasorda respects the game too much to resort to walking a player without good reason. If he wanted to, he could have pitched around Bonds to make sure he didn’t break the record, but he didn’t. He took the high road and played the game the way it should be played.

I don’t know if Bonds is scheduled to play on Sunday, but if he does, he’ll get honest pitching again. Anyway, what’s the big deal if he doesn’t break the record this weekend? I know you don’t want the record broken in Houston because you won't be there to mark the moment. So, if the record isn’t broken this weekend, the next best thing for Giant fans is that the record falls in Oakland (because the Stros have better pitching, Bonds has a better chance of breaking the record there than in Houston). This way, Giant fans could just drive over the bridge to Oakland and celebrate history close to home. Maybe it will happen Sunday, but you better keep Jeff Kent’s voodoo doll out of the stadium; he hates Bonds.

Breaking the Home Run Record is something all Giants fans should be pround of, but I would also be concerned about the team’s losing record. Once the record chase is out of the news, maybe they will play better, because they are looking old and sluggish right now; not looking like a play-off team at all.